New Board Members for the WPBA?

It seems to me that if you collected, even $1, from the weekly fees you could do good things for professional pool (or, maybe buy yourself a pad like Fatboy's :)). I'm going to guess that the overwhelming majority of league players have no idea where their weekly fees go and would have no problem giving the BCAPL a percentage. So, why not? I, for one, would much rather help support professional pool with my weekly fees than line the APA's pockets.

Ding, Ding... we have a winner!

Whoever finally does this will own professional pool.

Why do you think so many people and players are trying to start a league now? Well, they may not use the money to start a tour with, but they see the money coming in. They quickly realize that it's not as easy as it sounds, you still gotta work hard, but the existing leagues have the structure in place. Even at 50 cents a week from every player in one of the national leagues is enough to get a Pro Tour going...

Next problem is to figure out how to make money once you have a pro tour going. Awful lot of work and expense to get a tour going when you can barely recoup your expenses with a "gate"...
 
USA Pool League

Rubyron and Allen Jr. - Please go to http://www.playusapool.com.

We have started a new league system. This is a nationally handicap league using the 'fairplay' handicap system. 18 years history with over 2.5million matches and over 70% being hill/hill. This is a GOOD system.

This is not a franchise deal, but a league manager can get a protected terriitory at no cost. All the leagues will be using the same system so we can get an accurate national number for the players. This system also really limits the effect of sandbagging a lot.

It is one on one match play, 8-ball team (3-4-5 player). Everything is web based and real time.

It is very very slick! And all systems are proven.

$.50 fromn each players weekly dues are dedicated towards a pro fund. I totally agree with what you guys said. It is easy to say and tricky to do. BUT we have all the pieces in place and just started recruiting league managers to go nation wide. Currently we are interviewing over 50 interested people.

If we can get this off the ground, pool will be self funded. This is also where the TEAM CSI players come into play. These guys can go around and get the local amateurs all excited about playing pool. Do Boys club appearances and stuff like that.

Please contact me or our office and get the full info. We have all the pieces in place. There is no player membership fees the first year. Everyone can go to the $750,000 BCAPL National Championships and all is good. (We pay the dual sanctioning fees).

I hope people get behind this concept. It can save pool! It is a true handicap league and there is a place for beginers or top players. We have a unique method of allowing teams to stay togeher - even if they have too high of a handicap rating. Teams doNOT have to break up (but they might spot themselves out of a chance to win).

Please see our ads in Inside Pool, On the Break and others. Or contact Mark Estes at 702-719-7665 or go to: http://www.playusapool.com.

Mark Griffin,
markg@playcsipool.com
marlg@playbca.com
 
Rubyron and Allen Jr. - Please go to http://www.playusapool.com.

We have started a new league system. This is a nationally handicap league using the 'fairplay' handicap system. 18 years history with over 2.5million matches and over 70% being hill/hill. This is a GOOD system.

This is not a franchise deal, but a league manager can get a protected terriitory at no cost. All the leagues will be using the same system so we can get an accurate national number for the players. This system also really limits the effect of sandbagging a lot.

It is one on one match play, 8-ball team (3-4-5 player). Everything is web based and real time.

It is very very slick! And all systems are proven.

$.50 fromn each players weekly dues are dedicated towards a pro fund. I totally agree with what you guys said. It is easy to say and tricky to do. BUT we have all the pieces in place and just started recruiting league managers to go nation wide. Currently we are interviewing over 50 interested people.

If we can get this off the ground, pool will be self funded. This is also where the TEAM CSI players come into play. These guys can go around and get the local amateurs all excited about playing pool. Do Boys club appearances and stuff like that.

Please contact me or our office and get the full info. We have all the pieces in place. There is no player membership fees the first year. Everyone can go to the $750,000 BCAPL National Championships and all is good. (We pay the dual sanctioning fees).

I hope people get behind this concept. It can save pool! It is a true handicap league and there is a place for beginers or top players. We have a unique method of allowing teams to stay togeher - even if they have too high of a handicap rating. Teams doNOT have to break up (but they might spot themselves out of a chance to win).

Please see our ads in Inside Pool, On the Break and others. Or contact Mark Estes at 702-719-7665 or go to: http://www.playusapool.com.

Mark Griffin,
markg@playcsipool.com
marlg@playbca.com

Sounds like a nice plan Mark. But how will this be different than the APA funding the WPBA and dictating decisions to that organization? Should we assume the USAPL will want control of the pro tour that it is funding? Or could it go to fund tournaments sanctioned by an independent player's organization that also sanctions other tournaments? Who will decide what player's qualify for the tournaments the USAPL funds?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Griffin
The APA cancelled the contract saying Diamond was in competition with them (what????) and switched back to Valley tables. If I remember correctly, there is no Diamond League but there is a VNEA league.
markg@playbca.com

I remember thinking that changing back to the Valley tables looked like a big step backwards for APA at the Nationals Event... I thought it was bad decision that only hurt their own image and players. (there are still some great league operators that use the Diamonds because they like their players and only want the best for them - obviously you know this Mark, I'm just telling the others). It had never dawned on me before that Valley Tables was the VNEA league... duh! Guess I just didn't think about it as much as you did, what a transparent, spiteful move on their part.

I remember when a friend of mine was launching a billiards magazine, the APA would not allow it to be distributed at their events because it provided highlights and reports from ALL leagues, not exclusively APA.

Yes, they have some strong and demanding policies. No, I do not think they are bad people. Whatever they have been doing has been working, because they have made themselves into a large, profitable, and powerful organization. I know this debate could go on back and forth for quite a while.

BTW, I really like what Dave Letterman did when he was being blackmailed. Rather than let the guy blackmail him, he stood his ground and refused to cave in. I am not saying the APA blackmailed anyone, they merely acted in their perceived best interest. They have every right to sponsor whomever they wish, and they can notify them of their intent at any time. That's business, and that is their perogative.

I think its best to focus on what was done with the information. I mean absolutely no disrespect whatsoever, but was it ever considered that having Mark up for election might anger the main sponsor, who is a business competitor? I know, and agree, that Mark would be great for the job, but how does the election process work? (I apologize for my naiveness) Who decided that the owner of the main sponsors direct competitor should be up for election? Was that ever considered?

It seems to me that by allowing Mark to be an option (again, no offense Mark, it could anybody in your spot), the WPBA forced the APA to be like, "hey - remember us? We are your main sponsor and you are about to elect our competitor". My point is, the letter should not have HAD to be written. Of course the APA doesn't want the head of its competition on the board.

It's like if you're married (which I'm not) and your wife wants to go away for a private 1-week vacation to the islands with her ex-fiance that she almost married before you. But they're just friends now, right? Assuming you two aren't swingers or anything, this is just a ridiculous question, isn't it? What could be going through your wife's mind to even consider that you might be OK with this? And why should you be forced to have to ultimately put your foot down and say "No, you should not do this, it's just inappropriate"

My point is, I find it odd that the head of the main sponsors competition was even considered. Again, I mean no disrespect Mark, I hope you understand what I'm getting at here...

Can anyone explain the process, maybe that will make things clearer?


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well put Allen and while I disagree with the APA having issue with allowing the WPBA to benefit by allowing Mark on board and putting their personal crap in a vault for the betterment of the WPBA and pool as a whole...................I have to say the WPBA did handle this poorly and I also wonder how it became so messy. Even if they allowed Mark to run, wouldnt you think they would have contacted the APA to discuss this before the election and then having the same discussion with Mark before the election? It seems to me that reading a letter at the election was a joke and very unprofessional and unnecessary. Had the WPBA board contacted Mark maybe things would be seen differently at least by Mark. The APA will not change as long as certain people are involved in it.............they have and will likely always be the greedy, self serving, narrow minded group they have always been. Its their choice to do business that way but many wont like that stance or support them and they will lose followers if they dont begin to do something for pool instead of themselves. Support the dang industry and you grow plain and simple! They would fall off of a cliff before taking the hand of another company or competitor in this industry and most definately wouldnt hold out the hand to anyone falling off of that cliff. This is pool ala APA!

Can you imagine how great this sport could be if all people with know how, finances and name recognition would actually work together as opposed to segregating the industry? One can hope but IMO, the APA will be the last one to ever take that step to improve pool.........they are the ones that in the end may very well be the worst thing for pool when all is said and done.
 
R

Please see our ads in Inside Pool, On the Break and others. Or contact Mark Estes at 702-719-7665 or go to: http://www.playusapool.com.

Mark Griffin,
markg@playcsipool.com
marlg@playbca.com

Already have ...been in talks with Mark and the USAPL of North New Jersey is well underway.

I can't wait and the response is being incredible so far.

Guys contact Mark and get in on the ground floor on this killer new league...The support so far has been incredible


Rick
 
I'm not speaking for either side on this, particularly because I was not at the elections. But to give some insight onto how the process works, any voting WPBA member can nominate you. You submit a letter of intent (why you want to be on the board) and a bio that is distributed to all of the membership. I'm not sure how many people actually read that information but everyone does get an electonic copy of it.

Then the nominees are voted on at the players meeting at the Pacific Coast Classic. It's important to mention though that all nominees are allowed to be present to make a speech before the vote AND those that are not able to attend in person, are given the opportunity to address the membership via teleconference during that same time period. So all nominees were given the opportunity to make a speech whether it was in person or over the phone. Although I assume Mark did not know about the letter at the time, it's my understanding that he passed on speaking to the membership on the phone conference.

But again, I was not there so I don't know exactly how all of this went down.
 
From what I understand via a post somehwere

All those not present were called except for mark griffin. I dont think Mark turned down the call he was not called almost as if they were avoiding the issue but he shouldve been the first call before the meeting actually and off of the record............of course thats just how I think it shouldve been handled.

I'm not speaking for either side on this, particularly because I was not at the elections. But to give some insight onto how the process works, any voting WPBA member can nominate you. You submit a letter of intent (why you want to be on the board) and a bio that is distributed to all of the membership. I'm not sure how many people actually read that information but everyone does get an electonic copy of it.

Then the nominees are voted on at the players meeting at the Pacific Coast Classic. It's important to mention though that all nominees are allowed to be present to make a speech before the vote AND those that are not able to attend in person, are given the opportunity to address the membership via teleconference during that same time period. So all nominees were given the opportunity to make a speech whether it was in person or over the phone. Although I assume Mark did not know about the letter at the time, it's my understanding that he passed on speaking to the membership on the phone conference.

But again, I was not there so I don't know exactly how all of this went down.
 
That's why I said I wasn't there so I don't know exactly how it went down. I had followed up with Anne to make sure I could speak because I knew I wanted to address the group since I think many of the players only see me as a young player and don't know much about my professional life.

I was called before the meeting (just an hour or so before) and told that they were trying to contact all the nominees and letting them know when to expect a call to address everyone. So I had not idea that Mark was not included in those calls. I was just told by other members that he never spoke to the group.
 
Rubyron and Allen Jr. - Please go to http://www.playusapool.com.

We have started a new league system. This is a nationally handicap league using the 'fairplay' handicap system. 18 years history with over 2.5million matches and over 70% being hill/hill. This is a GOOD system.

This is not a franchise deal, but a league manager can get a protected terriitory at no cost. All the leagues will be using the same system so we can get an accurate national number for the players. This system also really limits the effect of sandbagging a lot.

It is one on one match play, 8-ball team (3-4-5 player). Everything is web based and real time.

It is very very slick! And all systems are proven.

$.50 fromn each players weekly dues are dedicated towards a pro fund. I totally agree with what you guys said. It is easy to say and tricky to do. BUT we have all the pieces in place and just started recruiting league managers to go nation wide. Currently we are interviewing over 50 interested people.

If we can get this off the ground, pool will be self funded. This is also where the TEAM CSI players come into play. These guys can go around and get the local amateurs all excited about playing pool. Do Boys club appearances and stuff like that.

Please contact me or our office and get the full info. We have all the pieces in place. There is no player membership fees the first year. Everyone can go to the $750,000 BCAPL National Championships and all is good. (We pay the dual sanctioning fees).

I hope people get behind this concept. It can save pool! It is a true handicap league and there is a place for beginers or top players. We have a unique method of allowing teams to stay togeher - even if they have too high of a handicap rating. Teams doNOT have to break up (but they might spot themselves out of a chance to win).

Please see our ads in Inside Pool, On the Break and others. Or contact Mark Estes at 702-719-7665 or go to: http://www.playusapool.com.

Mark Griffin,
markg@playcsipool.com
marlg@playbca.com

I, too, have heard about this. A guy in my area is currently trying to start a league. I've been helping to spread the word, and everyone I've spoken with is interested in playing. The APA in my area has NO competition. My APA division is one of the largest in the country with over 700 teams. The players here know nothing but the APA. I hope this new USA Pool League really takes off in our area and it grows tremendously. I personally would love to see competition for the APA. I am a current APA member because I want to play competitive pool, and quiet frankly, there's no other alternative for me (at the moment).
 
I hope this new USA Pool League really takes off in our area and it grows tremendously. I personally would love to see competition for the APA. I am a current APA member because I want to play competitive pool, and quiet frankly, there's no other alternative for me (at the moment).

The tentative date for the start of USAPL in Charlotte is Sat Nov 7th at the Green Room. Looking to start play at 7pm with 3 man teams. Should be done by 9-9:30 which leaves plenty of time for people to still go out on Sat night. We'll more than likely be playing on the Gandy side so TV's will be on with football and/or races. I'll hopefully have the date confirmed tonight and will post a thread announcing it later this week. The idea is have people show up, either with their own team already and/or we will do our best to make fair teams out of everyone else who is there.

Brian
 
Quote:

Well put Allen and while I disagree with the APA having issue with allowing the WPBA to benefit by allowing Mark on board and putting their personal crap in a vault for the betterment of the WPBA and pool as a whole...................I have to say the WPBA did handle this poorly and I also wonder how it became so messy. Even if they allowed Mark to run, wouldnt you think they would have contacted the APA to discuss this before the election and then having the same discussion with Mark before the election? It seems to me that reading a letter at the election was a joke and very unprofessional and unnecessary. Had the WPBA board contacted Mark maybe things would be seen differently at least by Mark. The APA will not change as long as certain people are involved in it.............they have and will likely always be the greedy, self serving, narrow minded group they have always been. Its their choice to do business that way but many wont like that stance or support them and they will lose followers if they dont begin to do something for pool instead of themselves. Support the dang industry and you grow plain and simple! They would fall off of a cliff before taking the hand of another company or competitor in this industry and most definately wouldnt hold out the hand to anyone falling off of that cliff. This is pool ala APA!

Can you imagine how great this sport could be if all people with know how, finances and name recognition would actually work together as opposed to segregating the industry? One can hope but IMO, the APA will be the last one to ever take that step to improve pool.........they are the ones that in the end may very well be the worst thing for pool when all is said and done.



Well said, the sooner the APA gets that concept the better for pool in general. Of course if they ever get this I may die of shock.
 
I'm not speaking for either side on this, particularly because I was not at the elections. But to give some insight onto how the process works, any voting WPBA member can nominate you. You submit a letter of intent (why you want to be on the board) and a bio that is distributed to all of the membership. I'm not sure how many people actually read that information but everyone does get an electonic copy of it.

Then the nominees are voted on at the players meeting at the Pacific Coast Classic. It's important to mention though that all nominees are allowed to be present to make a speech before the vote AND those that are not able to attend in person, are given the opportunity to address the membership via teleconference during that same time period. So all nominees were given the opportunity to make a speech whether it was in person or over the phone. Although I assume Mark did not know about the letter at the time, it's my understanding that he passed on speaking to the membership on the phone conference.

But again, I was not there so I don't know exactly how all of this went down.


Thanks for explaining this, I was curious how it worked... It seems to me as though this whole situation could have, and should have, been avoided. It seems pretty obvious that Mark never had a chance. I would assume that some "higher-ups" knew this all along, it would have been much more appropriate if this was handled prior to the meeting, before allowing Mark to have any hopes of being elected. And before doing something some so absurd as reading that letter at the meeting prior to voting.

Again, I am not saying the APA is right or wrong, I can definitely understand their position. It just seems like Mark never had a fair chance, and someone probably knew that. Although some people feel that APA should be more concerned about pool as a whole, ultimately, their only obligation is to themselves and their constituents. This is pretty common in all business. If they feel he is a threat, so be it. If the WPBA chooses to allow their sponsors to dictate their actions, that's a reflection on their business practices. What we all think of that is our own opinions, of course.

I have no idea how much the APA "gives" to the WPBA, and it's not my business of course. The WPBA obviously finds it important enough to submit to them. It sounds more like politics and friend-deals than anything. I don't know much, but I know things aren't exactly rosy for the WPBA right now... hopefully things improve.

There is also the real possibility that the APA and WPBA don't want Mark involved because they know he has plans (with very real chances of succeeding) along the lines to work with/create a Mens Pro Tour, and certain people may not want that to succeed. I'm surprised that hasn't been mentioned yet. Of course, this could be considered wild speculation, but I honesty don't think its too far off base...
 
I hope youre right

Thanks for explaining this, I was curious how it worked... It seems to me as though this whole situation could have, and should have, been avoided. It seems pretty obvious that Mark never had a chance. I would assume that some "higher-ups" knew this all along, it would have been much more appropriate if this was handled prior to the meeting, before allowing Mark to have any hopes of being elected. And before doing something some so absurd as reading that letter at the meeting prior to voting.

Again, I am not saying the APA is right or wrong, I can definitely understand their position. It just seems like Mark never had a fair chance, and someone probably knew that. Although some people feel that APA should be more concerned about pool as a whole, ultimately, their only obligation is to themselves and their constituents. This is pretty common in all business. If they feel he is a threat, so be it. If the WPBA chooses to allow their sponsors to dictate their actions, that's a reflection on their business practices. What we all think of that is our own opinions, of course.

I have no idea how much the APA "gives" to the WPBA, and it's not my business of course. The WPBA obviously finds it important enough to submit to them. It sounds more like politics and friend-deals than anything. I don't know much, but I know things aren't exactly rosy for the WPBA right now... hopefully things improve.

There is also the real possibility that the APA and WPBA don't want Mark involved because they know he has plans (with very real chances of succeeding) along the lines to work with/create a Mens Pro Tour, and certain people may not want that to succeed. I'm surprised that hasn't been mentioned yet. Of course, this could be considered wild speculation, but I honesty don't think its too far off base...

I hope Mark does have plans and succeed with a pro tour! Im sure many of us with knowledge and experience would love to help him in anyway we could. Im sure if the APA or others were opposed to that plan then they truly arent a positive influence on pool and why would any pool enthusiast want to support the monster that is out to keep pool status quo or control it entirely by keeping amateurs amateur and sending the pros back to factory work or something else..............not that there is much luck of that either given our economy.

What bothers me most is that pool is suffering...........isnt it time to change that and who better to make changes than the largest league entities in pool? Seems simple on paper and could be done but, to do this means to take on alliances even with competitors and the APA isnt willing to do so. There is market share for everyone in the league system! Why would anyone hope MG fails at offering thousands of professional and aspiring professional players a chance to make a living and entertain so many of us? I suppose I'd have to open myself up to being more selfish before I will ever understand that side of their business practice. Businesses are in it for profit agreed but by offering a hand to the industry.....doesnt this seem as if it would gain them more business and improve their reputation? Doing what theyve done may have been the last thing needed to change many minds and many supporters of the APA into MG or USAPL supporters. We shall see.
 
The tentative date for the start of USAPL in Charlotte is Sat Nov 7th at the Green Room. Looking to start play at 7pm with 3 man teams. Should be done by 9-9:30 which leaves plenty of time for people to still go out on Sat night. We'll more than likely be playing on the Gandy side so TV's will be on with football and/or races. I'll hopefully have the date confirmed tonight and will post a thread announcing it later this week. The idea is have people show up, either with their own team already and/or we will do our best to make fair teams out of everyone else who is there.

Brian
Brian, I was referring to Eddie's league. The Green Room is way to far for me to drive, plus you're offering Saturdays which I currently have no interest in playing league.
 
Brian, I was referring to Eddie's league. The Green Room is way to far for me to drive, plus you're offering Saturdays which I currently have no interest in playing league.

Figured you meant Eddie, but had to put it out there anyways :)

Brian
 
Christina- I did NOT get any call or any notice that I could address the voting members! Sorry- you were wrong. And that begs the question-why wasn't I called???? Mark griffin
 
Christina- I did NOT get any call or any notice that I could address the voting members! Sorry- you were wrong. And that begs the question-why wasn't I called???? Mark griffin

Would be interesting if it is actually a violation of the by-laws for voting and would in turn make the results of the vote invalid...

Brian
 
Christina- I did NOT get any call or any notice that I could address the voting members! Sorry- you were wrong. And that begs the question-why wasn't I called???? Mark griffin

I just verified some information with the WPBA and this is what I found out.

Not everyone was called to address the membership...only the ones who asked to do so...like myself. Mimi, Paul, me, and Tamre had all asked to speak to the membership so Anne called us during the meeting to set that up. John R, Mark, and Ashley did not.

I only asked because when I ran last year I didn't address the membership but had heard that people were given the opportunity so I wanted to make sure I was able to this year.

Sorry about the misinformation. I did confirm with John that he did not address the membership either.
 
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