Pool lesson from Jimmy Moore

Thanks! I welcome anything Mr Moore has to say in general and hope he has a little to say about the slipstroke he was a master of.

Hu
 
I really appreciate seeing stuff like this, just to get one more look at players who I admired so much. Guys like Jimmy have very few matches that were ever recorded. In his day they didn't want photographers around while they were playing. Jimmy was still running hundreds when he was in his 80's. He had to be over 90 when he died.
 
jay helfert said:
I really appreciate seeing stuff like this, just to get one more look at players who I admired so much. Guys like Jimmy have very few matches that were ever recorded. In his day they didn't want photographers around while they were playing. Jimmy was still running hundreds when he was in his 80's. He had to be over 90 when he died.
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I have a picture of my uncle (who was armed forces champion) playing Jimmy Moore in the late 60s. I will post it sometime.
 
JAM said:
When asked who had the best stroke in the pool world, Keith McCready always mentioned Cowboy Jimmy Moore.
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There is just something magic about a well executed slipstroke. The power seems to come from nowhere.

Hu
 
ShootingArts said:
There is just something magic about a well executed slipstroke. The power seems to come from nowhere.

Hu
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Jimmy had this one "signature" shot that he liked to show off with. He would place the object ball right by the side pocket, on the head string side of the pocket. Then he would place the cue ball in the middle of the table just above the side pocket, again on the head string side. He would shoot the object ball into the side pocket and have the cue ball go forward into the side rail above the side pocket and GRAB! Then the forward english would take hold and the cue ball would change direction and roll along that same side rail (past the side pocket) down toward the corner pocket on the foot rail, making the ball that laid in the jaws. It was a very cool looking shot that was hard to duplicate by anyone other than the best players with the strongest strokes. I know I couldn't do it. Maybe Bob Jewett or Dr. Dave can diagram this shot for us.

One other trick that only Jimmy Moore could ever do: He did this on a ball return table. He would allow all 15 balls to go into the ball box at the end of the table, and without ever looking he would reach in and grab four balls in each hand and throw them on the table, rolling them toward the other end. In about one second when they reached the side pocket he would shout out a number. That number was the total of all eight balls if you added them up. I saw him do this dozens of times and there was no subterfuge involved. He really could somehow instantly compute the total of the eight balls in his head. This was a "trick" of a savant of some kind. NO ONE ever has been able to come close to duplicating this trick. I once asked Jimmy how he did it and he looked at me and said, "I don't know, I just see a number when I look at the balls!"

I wish this one was on video somewhere. I'm sure someone recorded it because he did it so many times in so many locations. All he needed was a ball return table. I damn sure wish I had the presence of mind to record it, but back then we didn't carry around cell phones that could record anything. And very few people had hand-held motion picture cameras at the ready.
 
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jay helfert said:
Jimmy had this one "signature" shot that he liked to show off with. He would place the object ball right by the side pocket, on the head string side of the pocket. Then he would place the cue ball in the middle of the table just above the side pocket, again on the head string side. He would shoot the object ball into the side pocket and have the cue ball go forward into the side rail above the side pocket and GRAB! Then the forward english would take hold and the cue ball would change direction and roll along that same side rail (past the side pocket) down toward the corner pocket on the foot rail, making the ball that laid in the jaws. It was a very cool looking shot that was hard to duplicate by anyone other than the best players with the strongest strokes. I know I couldn't do it. Maybe Bob Jewett or Dr. Dave can diagram this shot for us. ...
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I think this is the shot. It can also be played as a cross-side bank if the balls are up the table. How far the OB can be from the pocket (or rail) depends on the equipment -- much easier on new cloth. This is an absolutely standard carom shot.

CropperCapture[252].jpg
 
He kind of explained the slip stroke when he said he started by gripping the cue about 5 inches behind the balance point. He described it as "the way they teach". If in fact someone was teaching that back in the day then it explains why the slip stroke was more prevalent then than now.
 
ShootingArts said:
There is just something magic about a well executed slipstroke. The power seems to come from nowhere.

Hu
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I'd agree with Keith. The only one that I ever played that I might consider to have a better stroke than Jimmy's would be Marvin Henderson. Two different strokes but both silky smooth. Beauties to behold. Great memories.
 
jay helfert said:
Jimmy had this one "signature" shot that he liked to show off with. He would place the object ball right by the side pocket, on the head string side of the pocket. Then he would place the cue ball in the middle of the table just above the side pocket, again on the head string side. He would shoot the object ball into the side pocket and have the cue ball go forward into the side rail above the side pocket and GRAB! Then the forward english would take hold and the cue ball would change direction and roll along that same side rail (past the side pocket) down toward the corner pocket on the foot rail, making the ball that laid in the jaws. It was a very cool looking shot that was hard to duplicate by anyone other than the best players with the strongest strokes. I know I couldn't do it. Maybe Bob Jewett or Dr. Dave can diagram this shot for us.

One other trick that only Jimmy Moore could ever do: He did this on a ball return table. He would allow all 15 balls to go into the ball box at the end of the table, and without ever looking he would reach in and grab four balls in each hand and throw them on the table, rolling them toward the other end. In about one second when they reached the side pocket he would shout out a number. That number was the total of all eight balls if you added them up. I saw him do this dozens of times and there was no subterfuge involved. He really could somehow instantly compute the total of the eight balls in his head. This was a "trick" of a savant of some kind. NO ONE ever has been able to come close to duplicating this trick. I once asked Jimmy how he did it and he looked at me and said, "I don't know, I just see a number when I look at the balls!"

I wish this one was on video somewhere. I'm sure someone recorded it because he did it so many times in so many locations. All he needed was a ball return table. I damn sure wish I had the presence of mind to record it, but back then we didn't carry around cell phones that could record anything. And very few people had hand-held motion picture cameras at the ready.
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I watched video of Jimmy doing that trick with three, four, and five balls on each side. I can't remember if he did six. I think he did but he rolled slow enough some didn't quite reach the rail. Then as a joke he did all fifteen, the only one I can do!

I am guessing in part that Jimmy simply thought numbers when he saw balls. Many years ago, maybe early seventies, my mom came over when I was watching some of the rare pool on TV. It was the usual quality of probably old video at the time and I commented on the runout with a handful of balls left so it must have been eight ball, perhaps straights. My mom was astonished. Not that I could predict exactly what he did, that I could see the numbers on the balls! I told her I couldn't see the numbers either. I could tell stripes from solids most of the time and I knew the colors before all the fooling around with them.

Hu
 
Bob Jewett said:
I think this is the shot. It can also be played as a cross-side bank if the balls are up the table. How far the OB can be from the pocket (or rail) depends on the equipment -- much easier on new cloth. This is an absolutely standard carom shot.

View attachment 584101
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Standard for you maybe, but not so easy for us mere mortals. :)
 
ShootingArts said:
I watched video of Jimmy doing that trick with three, four, and five balls on each side. I can't remember if he did six. I think he did but he rolled slow enough some didn't quite reach the rail. Then as a joke he did all fifteen, the only one I can do!

I am guessing in part that Jimmy simply thought numbers when he saw balls. Many years ago, maybe early seventies, my mom came over when I was watching some of the rare pool on TV. It was the usual quality of probably old video at the time and I commented on the runout with a handful of balls left so it must have been eight ball, perhaps straights. My mom was astonished. Not that I could predict exactly what he did, that I could see the numbers on the balls! I told her I couldn't see the numbers either. I could tell stripes from solids most of the time and I knew the colors before all the fooling around with them.

Hu
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I wish we could find that video that you speak of. My recollection is that he rolled the balls at a medium speed and some of them may have reached the end rail and others may not. They were not rolled fast and they were not rolled slowly either. He did seem to make sure that all the balls were spread out when rolled with none of them bumping into each other as they went down the table. Perhaps that made them more clear to him so he could calculate rapidly.
 
He was a long time friend of Adam Brostoski, owner of Paramount Billiards on Long Beach Blvd. in Long Beach CA. I was fortunate enough to of been asked to play him there in an exhibition match probably 1978. I also ran into em quite a few time in NM at the pool rooms.
 
jay helfert said:
I wish we could find that video that you speak of. My recollection is that he rolled the balls at a medium speed and some of them may have reached the end rail and others may not. They were not rolled fast and they were not rolled slowly either. He did seem to make sure that all the balls were spread out when rolled with none of them bumping into each other as they went down the table. Perhaps that made them more clear to him so he could calculate rapidly.
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It's on the video in the OP. He does it a few times, rolling a different amount of balls down the table and calculating the total.
 
I suppose the brain is capable of doing any kind of math instantly. Common trick in 61/rotation is to pair your balls into 10s or multiples of 10s. If nobody could duplicate the feat it must be the former.
 
straightline said:
I suppose the brain is capable of doing any kind of math instantly. Common trick in 61/rotation is to pair your balls into 10s or multiples of 10s. If nobody could duplicate the feat it must be the former.
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Long time ago I knew a guy whose left hand must have thought he was Leonardo de Vinci. He could write left handed and backwards as soon or sooner than he learned to write right handed. He said it wasn't something he put any effort into learning, just something that came automatically. He could write backwards left handed alone too as well as writing normally right handed. His writing seemed best quality when he was writing with both hands. Nice party trick, didn't seem to have much other use!

Hu
 
chitownnorth said:
It's on the video in the OP. He does it a few times, rolling a different amount of balls down the table and calculating the total.
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Very cool to see that trick being done by Jimmy. When he was a bit younger (pre 1980) he threw them a tad faster and gave an answer maybe a second sooner. Old age may have slowed him down by then, but it was still a great trick. If you think it's easy try it sometime.
 
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