Poolhall Prices- Hurting Pool?

cuetechasaurus said:
Are poolhalls charging too much for people to play, or are they forced to charge those prices? I can't count how many times I've seen $50 or $100 action end up losing a large chunk of it (and sometimes all of it) to the house because of table time.

If you really think about it, although a large percentage of the world's population (that has been exposed to the game) likes to play pool, they have wisened up to the fact that renting equipment for a game that does not involve electronics (to us its a sport, to them its a game), paying $12 or $14 per hour for just two or three players really isnt worth it in the long run to most people. I'm sure that the majority of recreational players want to get better at the game, but when they make an attempt to get some practice, they quickly realize how much money per week or per month its going to cost them, and they back out.

What other games or sports have been around for centuries, where the basic fundamentals of it have been the same since it was invented, would appeal to the average person and have them shell out $40 just to play it with a friend for a few hours?

I'm sure that many poolhall owners have considered lowering their rates just to test and see if it will increase business, so perhaps rent and other costs are preventing them are doing so. Is the game itself just a lost cause, and will it remain like it is today? When pool was in it's golden years, if you do the math and check the prices related to inflation, it was extremely cheap to play.
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Hello Partner, I will try and tell what I think from a Pool Hall owners perspective.

My room is a smaller room, I have nine tables seven 9ft and two 8ft. I open at 12:30 pm and close at 2:00 am sunday thru Thursday, on Friday and Saturday I open at 12:30 pm and close at 4:00 am. I sell a limited amount of food (Microwavable), many different types of soft drinks, and beer in bottles.

Table rates are as follows:

12:30pm until 6:00pm $3 per hour one person, or $5 per hour for two or more people.

6:00pm until close $6 per hour one person, or $10 per hour for two or more.

I also offer a monthly membership which covers all table time from 12:30pm until 6:00pm seven days a week for $65 per month.

I also sell production cues and cases, Custom cues and cases, and I offer my customers full repairs to include complete refinishes. Many repairs are done while you wait, Tips, ferrules, Wraps, weight changes, and joint facing. I also build Custom Cues and Cue Conversions which I sell locally, as fast as I can build them.

I do all the maintenance on my equipment myself, replace rubber, recover the tables, and any other repairs that may be necessary

In addition to the above, I also support 5 BCA teams, and 6 APA teams which also increase my revenues for all the above.

I only have one employee, who is part time, and who is also my apprentice.

Now, most pool room owners, due not do their own maintenance, do not repair cues or build cues, do not focus on the sale of merchandise, and they do not run their room themselves.

This is not an easy business, many people think that all you do is put some tables in a room and people will come, this can not be any further from the truth. I work around 12 hour's a day, seven day's week, last year I had two days off, Thanksgiving and Christmas. Now I am not complaining, because this is what I chose do, and I do love it. However, I could not do this if I did not have my Military Retirement. Currently I have only been open two year's, and my business has only improved from the beginning to now. But many people do not have the resources available to me and they also did not understand the sacrifices necessary to start this type of business. This is the main reason so many rooms fail and I suspect will continue to do so.

I also think the lack of knowledge of many room owners creates expenses that could be over come by a little hard work on their part.

In my opinion it is foolish to open a pool today if you only rely on table time, some food and drinks as your main source of revenue. I also think this is why table rates are so high in some places, however from my limited experience rooms like this will not stay open long.

I hope this helps, and have a great night!!!!!

Manwon
 
Manwon that monthly rate is awesome..i am retired so i have the time..when i was playing in a hall none around where i was offered a monthly rate....i was playing 5 to 6 days a week.i would come in and get the daily special of $9.00 for 11 am till 6pm.then $6.00 per hour after 6 pm..with table time and pop and once in awhile a candy bar (they did not sell food but you could bring it in) i was spending about $550.00 per month at this hall for about 2 years....i got pissed the way he was treating customers.he wouldn't even give anyone a discount on cues ect..i had purchased 2 cues from him ..About $800.00 and $1,000.00 ..i could have purchased the same cues over the net for 40 % LESS...BUT because i am loyal to people i continued there till i had enough of him yelling at decent people (i personally never had a problem w/him)....other people left also when i did..so that is his loss on what were VERY Loyal customers.i wish you luck in 07 Manwon..i wish you were closer i would come and visit and we could talk about Hippipool...:)
 
cuejoey said:
Manwon that monthly rate is awesome..i am retired so i have the time..when i was playing in a hall none around where i was offered a monthly rate....i was playing 5 to 6 days a week.i would come in and get the daily special of $9.00 for 11 am till 6pm.then $6.00 per hour after 6 pm..with table time and pop and once in awhile a candy bar (they did not sell food but you could bring it in) i was spending about $550.00 per month at this hall for about 2 years....i got pissed the way he was treating customers.he wouldn't even give anyone a discount on cues ect..i had purchased 2 cues from him ..About $800.00 and $1,000.00 ..i could have purchased the same cues over the net for 40 % LESS...BUT because i am loyal to people i continued there till i had enough of him yelling at decent people (i personally never had a problem w/him)....other people left also when i did..so that is his loss on what were VERY Loyal customers.i wish you luck in 07 Manwon..i wish you were closer i would come and visit and we could talk about Hippipool...:)
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Thanks for the kind words, however talking Hippepool could be hazardous to you mental health!!!!!!!!!:eek: :eek: :D :D

Have a nice night!!!! I am getting ready to close!!!!!

Manwon
 
i'll bet that Hippiepool is one hell of a pool player .man the knowledge we could learn from him...take care buddy.have a great day today.
 
crown Billiards

Crown Billiards in NJ rates are damn good. Regular players do not pay by thhe hour. $15 daily pass and play the whole day. $150 per month and play anytime the whole month.
 
cuetechasaurus said:
Are poolhalls charging too much for people to play, or are they forced to charge those prices? I can't count how many times I've seen $50 or $100 action end up losing a large chunk of it (and sometimes all of it) to the house because of table time.

.
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Rent and operating costs are the number one reason pool halls are dying. Here in St Louis a local room had to close because their rent went to $19,000 a month. Was that absurd? Not at all. In the neighborhood they were in that became the going rate. Our billliard parlor is in a middle income neighborhood and normal rent for our 90 yr old building would be about $7,000 a month. Add to that $1,500-$3500/ month utilities, employee wages, workman's comp insurance, health insurance, table maintenance and repair. Thats a lot of playing at $3.00/hour before you see a single dollar in profit. And a lot of complaining from players about how your $3.00 rate is so outrageous.

And in my opinion about the people who are playing for $50-$100. They are really just playing for pool time most of the time. 30 years ago when I was a teenager average players gambled for that much. I saw many a match for $200-$500 back in the 70's. $1000's of dollars matches in the 80's. Truth is people do not want to gamble anymore. They really just want to prey on lesser players. The idea that you can become rich playing pool passed this sport by....and the gambling did too. ( I am talking about the TRUE DEFINITION of gambling) You know...when each player has the same chance of winning.

Our prices for playing pool have bounced between $3.60 and $3.00 /hour for our MAXIMUM rate for almost 15 years now. No one "gets rich" at that rate guys.
 
pooltchr said:
Hmmmmmm. Golf?

Steve
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Right, I forgot you think that pool is in a "golden age". LOL. How many APA SL 2's did you get to shell out a few hundred bucks for lessons this month? Pool might be in a golden age for YOU, but the game itself isn't, and this seems to be agreed upon by every other pool player but YOU and a few key others perhaps.

Oh, and by the way. Golf is generally (and stereotypically) played by what economic class? And what is it that this particular economic class has much more of than the economic classes below it? And the average full time pool player is of what economic class?

And yes you are correct about golf, but I thought it was obvious my question was a rhetorical one.
 
Well, I agree the cost of pool is hurting pool. I think they must be that high to support a business. It is kind of a catch-22 for them. If they lower prices they have more business, but they don't get anymore money than with the higher prices and less business. If they have a bar, maybe they make it up there, but without a bar they have to make it on table time.
 
Discounted rates

I think $8-9 and hour is more than the casual person wants to spend. These prices have driven away most of the kids. These prices may be necesary to maintain the business, but most people think it is more than they want spend.
For the more serious players who want to get better and practice, many places have special rates. I pay $5 flat rate to play all I want as long as the place does not get busy and need my table. I know many places that charge a flat rate of $10 to people who want to play on a regular basis. There is a pool hall in northern NJ that charges something like $40 a month to practice by yourself all you want.
High rents are driving the prices, but teenagers who want to "hang out" on the weekends don't have $20-30 for a few hours out so they go play video games $5 and sit around.
 
Rule of thumb

my rule of thumb is that playing Pool should be about the same
as what it costs you to go to the movies for 2 hours of entertainment.
(Movies are $7 here, $6 for seniors)

Kids go where it is cheap, and fun.

Everyone here about croaked when Bar tables went from .50 to .75.

2 places here will still open up Bar tables for play for $5 an hour, when 2 players match up, that's total, not per player.

Big table rates at the highest is $7 an hour, per player, with cheaper rates in the non primetime hours.

You guys just need to live where a decent standard of living exists.
Spending well over a million dollars for a modest home in San Francisco, when you could buy the same house here for less than $200,000.

We are getting more and more people moving from NY and California to our city, and saying that they just love it here. They send letters in to the editorial page of our paper.
 
Snapshot9 said:
...You guys just need to live where a decent standard of living exists...
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Good idea I guess, but some of us have awfully deep roots where we are. My family has been in NE 400 years, it would be tough to go anywhere else. Also, even though I rarely visit it, I don't think I could stand to be that far from the ocean.
Unlike Dorothy, I never was in Kansas. :)
 
Pool is too expensive.

Pool halls should give big discounts during the non busy times/food specials/etc to keep the people coming in.

Maybe this is why bowling will continue to outpace pool LOL.
 
The poolhall I do most of my buisness in has been open aprox 2 years and cost over 4 million bucks to open. They charge $2.75 per person per hour up to 3 people. They dont charge for more than 3 people no matter how many people are playing. Also domestic beers are $2.75 This place is 10 minutes from downtown denver. I have been in a few places charging $12 - 15 per hour but I find them to be more of a bar than a poolhall and the tables were not very well kept. Chris.
 
I play at a pool hall here in Phoenix and it has free pool on the 9 footers all day until 7 and then you can either pay by the hour or a flat rate of 14.00 for the night.
 
bankshots said:
I played pebble beach golf course about two seasons ago and paid 150.00
to play. It took 5 hours to get around so thats 30.00 per hour and I enjoyed every minute of it and never thought once about the amount of moneyit cost. QUOTE]
This is beside the point, we're talking about playing regularly here. I'm guessing you playing at Pebble Beach was probably a once a year or lifetime thing. You would hear the same complaints from golfers who play 3-4 times per week if they had to shell out $150 to play 18.
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axejunkie said:
bankshots said:
I played pebble beach golf course about two seasons ago and paid 150.00
to play. It took 5 hours to get around so thats 30.00 per hour and I enjoyed every minute of it and never thought once about the amount of moneyit cost. QUOTE]
This is beside the point, we're talking about playing regularly here. I'm guessing you playing at Pebble Beach was probably a once a year or lifetime thing. You would hear the same complaints from golfers who play 3-4 times per week if they had to shell out $150 to play 18.
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I agree. Johnnyt
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The pool hall i work at, we open at 6 pm and close at 2 am, but you can play from 6 till close for a flat rate of $10. During sat and sun, we're open from 12 pm till 3 on sat an 2 on sun, from 12-7 it's a flat rate of $7, and from 7 till 2am it's $10 so 17 will get you an all day of pool playing. The only bad thing tho is that we dont sell liqur, so we have to have it this way so we can attract customers. Not to mention on Wensday night it's ladies night, so girls get to play for free.
 
whitewolf said:
Pool is too expensive.

Pool halls should give big discounts during the non busy times/food specials/etc to keep the people coming in.

Maybe this is why bowling will continue to outpace pool LOL.
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I am facing the same problems as ajrack. My rent is $3100 + tax, which brings it up to $3800 a month. Add in insurance, utilities, payroll and other expenses, it is imperative that I make money. Most of the money comes from beer/beverage sales - not pool rates. I currently have a $3.00 flat rate during the day, and its $4.00 an hour per person after 6PM - $5.00 and hour on the "good" tables. I FREE POOL on Tuesday nights - and Thursday is ladie's night and they play for free. I believe that I have the most affordable rates in the city. During the slow times I try to invent ways to bring people in so that I can make money to cover those bills. Why should I "give big discounts" when its slow? When the place is packed, I offer half price drink specials - because I can afford to do it. Asking a room owner to offer discounts during slow periods makes no sense. If you want the proces to go down, then the rooms need your busines - as in YOU spending YOUR money. When that happens, the room owner is given breathing room and we can discount tables rates and drink prices.
 
Blackjack said:
I am facing the same problems as ajrack. My rent is $3100 + tax, which brings it up to $3800 a month. Add in insurance, utilities, payroll and other expenses, it is imperative that I make money. Most of the money comes from beer/beverage sales - not pool rates. I currently have a $3.00 flat rate during the day, and its $4.00 an hour per person after 6PM - $5.00 and hour on the "good" tables. I FREE POOL on Tuesday nights - and Thursday is ladie's night and they play for free. I believe that I have the most affordable rates in the city. During the slow times I try to invent ways to bring people in so that I can make money to cover those bills. Why should I "give big discounts" when its slow? When the place is packed, I offer half price drink specials - because I can afford to do it. Asking a room owner to offer discounts during slow periods makes no sense. If you want the proces to go down, then the rooms need your busines - as in YOU spending YOUR money. When that happens, the room owner is given breathing room and we can discount tables rates and drink prices.
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$700 tax on $3100. What the hell is the tax rate there? Johnnyt
 
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