Potential pro caliber players in APA league

[lorider]

Maybe it's an APA thing and I'm not that familiar, but can someone explain how a player can average a 1/2 inning per game? If you break and run a rack does that count for less than an inning or something?

Thanks.

you take the number of racks played in a match and divide by the number of innings played to reach avg number of innings .

example : a player wins 5-1 in 3 innings . you have 6 racks divided by 3 = 1/2 inning a game.

i have no idea what my average is, i am a 5 by the way. i do remember the match that caused me to get raised to a 5 though. i ran 4 racks in 3 innings. that was one of my better days.

if i remember correctly i won 4-0 in about 9 or 10 innings the other night which is about average for me. i lost against a 6 tonight 5-3 in about 14 innings. my last 2 matches averaged about 2 innings a game.

 

[DogsPlayingPool]

you take the number of racks played in a match and divide by the number of innings played to reach avg number of innings .

example : a player wins 5-1 in 3 innings . you have 6 racks divided by 3 = 1/2 inning a game.

i have no idea what my average is, i am a 5 by the way. i do remember the match that caused me to get raised to a 5 though. i ran 4 racks in 3 innings. that was one of my better days.

if i remember correctly i won 4-0 in about 9 or 10 innings the other night which is about average for me. i lost against a 6 tonight 5-3 in about 14 innings. my last 2 matches averaged about 2 innings a game.

How can you win 5 games in 3 innings? If you break and run a game you won it in one inning. How can you do better than that? The next rack is a separate game so it is your first inning of that game. It's not like 14.1 where your inning continues into the next rack. Or is it in APA? As I said, I'm not that familiar with APA so I'm just not seeing how you can average less than 1 inning even if you break and run every game you ever play.

BTW, I'm not arguing, just asking.

Thanks.

 

[Tony_in_MD]

Both players have to shoot for it to account as an inning. Just like in baseball.


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[DogsPlayingPool]

Both players have to shoot for it to account as an inning. Just like in baseball.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk.

Thanks, Tony. It's like I thought, an APA thing.

BCAPL defines an inning as a turn at the table by A player, not both:

Inning
A turn at the table by a player.

Under WPA rules, an inning also relates to one player:

8.12 Inning
An inning is a player’s turn at the table. It begins when it is legal for him to take a shot, and ends at the end of a shot when it is no longer legal for him to take a shot. In some games a player may choose not to come to the table in certain situations when play would normally pass to him, and then the player remaining at the table continues the inning (e.g. a push-out at nine ball). The player whose turn it is to play is called the “shooter.”

But I get it now. Appreciate the clarification.

 

[ActionGene]

An inning in APA does not close until both players have come to the table.

For example, if a player breaks and runs a rack the game is marked on the score sheet as 0 innings. A player that breaks and runs out the entire set will have completed the match in 0 innings.

Lets say that player A breaks and runs 2 games, and then breaks dry in the 3rd game. Player B then proceeds to run out the rack, it would still be considered 0 innings.

When player B misses a ball/ breaks dry etc, the inning is then considered closed and marked down as 1.

Hope this helps to bring some clarification. Just remember, both players have to have completed a turn at the table to constitute 1 inning.

How can you win 5 games in 3 innings? If you break and run a game you won it in one inning. How can you do better than that? The next rack is a separate game so it is your first inning of that game. It's not like 14.1 where your inning continues into the next rack. Or is it in APA? As I said, I'm not that familiar with APA so I'm just not seeing how you can average less than 1 inning even if you break and run every game you ever play.

BTW, I'm not arguing, just asking.

Thanks.

 

[OUSooner]

Chip Compton played a couple seasons of APA on his dads team. Once they got to Vegas someone filed a protest. He was not DQ'd but came to an agreement with the local league operator to no longer play.

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[jbmcgee1]

APA Regional

I played in the regionals this weekend as well, and faced Jeff in the second round. He played very smart, was well prepared, and beat me easily 5-0. In the match there was a total of 6 innings, 5 defensive shots, and only 1 break and run.

When I thought about the match afterwards I realized that I wasn't "playing my game" and it cost me at least a couple of games. I had chances to win games, but either didn't think my way through the entire run, or didn't play the right percentage shot. Fortunately for me, it was the typical modified-single elimination format, so I had a chance to play again.

I moved to the losers side and won my next two matches, then had to match up with Rusty (the guy that knocked Jeff out). I wish I'd had a chance to watch Rusty and Jeff play to see how their match shook out, but when I played Rusty I thought he was a very solid player. If I had to give a reason for why I beat him, it was because he was thinking 90% runout, and I was thinking 50% runout. I played a ton of defense and won 5-4.

I lost in the finals to Melvin, but walked away knowing that I could have had a shot against him as well. Melvin played very aggressively and was also a 90% runout, 10% defense guy.

All things considered, and back on the original topic of the thread, I wouldn't consider myself or anyone else I saw this weekend a professional player. All the 7s I saw were solid, but nobody in the professional realm. The downside of being a 7 is that you realize you probably play better that most in the league, but you're a long way from making a living at the game. :smile:

 

[whammo57]

There will always be someone better.

Shoot your best and learn how to beat them.

Sometimes you can and sometimes you can't.

Be a good winner and a good loser.

Kim

 

[slim234]

The league is a business not for you but the operator making a living

The APA is a bunch of bull crap designed to make money for the league operators. what you have to consider is that they own this prtion of the league. If they allow such players to participate they are not giving a damn about you or anyone else. they are there to protect ther own interest " their pockets"

That's why being a league operator is so profitable

if you read the bi laws form the national registry ot even call them

Every league operator has the ability to govern what goes on, how much they charge, what they charge, if and when and whenever they please they own it

The best you can do is step up to the plate, play your game, or get smart and quit giving your money away.

It's the mentality of people that play in leagues

they pY TO PLAY

***** AND WINE WHEN THEY GET BEATEN
THE BEST ANYO LEAGUE PLAYER CAN DO IS GIVE IT UP, THEN YOU CAN PICK AND CHOSE TO PLAY WHEN AND WHENEVER, PLAYING TOURNAMENTS WITH A CHANCE TO WIN SOMETHING

QUIT THROWING YOUR MONEY IN A MONEY OLE FEEDING THESE OPERATORS THEY DON'T GIVE ADAN ABOUT ANYONE, AS LONG AS YOUR MONEY IS MAKING THEIR LIVING

tHEY WILL LET ANYONE PLAY AS LONG AS THEY HAVE MONEY

REMEMBER THE LEAGUE IS NOT THERE FOR YOU IT'S A BUSINESS TO MAKE MONEY

 

[jrt30004]

The APA is a bunch of bull crap designed to make money for the league operators. what you have to consider is that they own this prtion of the league. If they allow such players to participate they are not giving a damn about you or anyone else. they are there to protect ther own interest " their pockets"

That's why being a league operator is so profitable

if you read the bi laws form the national registry ot even call them

Every league operator has the ability to govern what goes on, how much they charge, what they charge, if and when and whenever they please they own it

The best you can do is step up to the plate, play your game, or get smart and quit giving your money away.

It's the mentality of people that play in leagues

they pY TO PLAY

***** AND WINE WHEN THEY GET BEATEN
THE BEST ANYO LEAGUE PLAYER CAN DO IS GIVE IT UP, THEN YOU CAN PICK AND CHOSE TO PLAY WHEN AND WHENEVER, PLAYING TOURNAMENTS WITH A CHANCE TO WIN SOMETHING

QUIT THROWING YOUR MONEY IN A MONEY OLE FEEDING THESE OPERATORS THEY DON'T GIVE ADAN ABOUT ANYONE, AS LONG AS YOUR MONEY IS MAKING THEIR LIVING

tHEY WILL LET ANYONE PLAY AS LONG AS THEY HAVE MONEY

REMEMBER THE LEAGUE IS NOT THERE FOR YOU IT'S A BUSINESS TO MAKE MONEY

yep. you're the guy i'll take advice from:shocked2:

 

[uwate]

Jeff is at the level where the amateurs think he is a pro and the pros think he is an amateur.

There are alot of APA guys across the nation that play very close to Crawford's speed, both above him and below him.

There is alot more than just those guys too. Singles nationals is a tough ass tournament to win. Bar box race to 5 in 8ball especially can turn on a single miscue or missed ball when your playing guys that speed.

 

[jrt30004]

I played in the regionals this weekend as well, and faced Jeff in the second round. He played very smart, was well prepared, and beat me easily 5-0. In the match there was a total of 6 innings, 5 defensive shots, and only 1 break and run.

When I thought about the match afterwards I realized that I wasn't "playing my game" and it cost me at least a couple of games. I had chances to win games, but either didn't think my way through the entire run, or didn't play the right percentage shot. Fortunately for me, it was the typical modified-single elimination format, so I had a chance to play again.

I moved to the losers side and won my next two matches, then had to match up with Rusty (the guy that knocked Jeff out). I wish I'd had a chance to watch Rusty and Jeff play to see how their match shook out, but when I played Rusty I thought he was a very solid player. If I had to give a reason for why I beat him, it was because he was thinking 90% runout, and I was thinking 50% runout. I played a ton of defense and won 5-4.

I lost in the finals to Melvin, but walked away knowing that I could have had a shot against him as well. Melvin played very aggressively and was also a 90% runout, 10% defense guy.

All things considered, and back on the original topic of the thread, I wouldn't consider myself or anyone else I saw this weekend a professional player. All the 7s I saw were solid, but nobody in the professional realm. The downside of being a 7 is that you realize you probably play better that most in the league, but you're a long way from making a living at the game. :smile:

great. another one of you guys i have to stay away from:smile: even though you didn't win it sounds sounds like you played a decent tournament congrats.

 

[Maniac]

I'm not confused about what I want out of pool nor do I have visions of grandeur. If I want to go to Vegas, I can afford my own air fare and hotel room, I don't need to rely on APA to pay for it. These folks that treat an APA match like it's the Super Bowl need their head examined IMHO.

Ahhhhh...........a man after my own heart!!!

Well said, nob!!!

Maniac

 

[Black Cat 5791]

The APA is a bunch of bull crap designed to make money for the league operators. what you have to consider is that they own this prtion of the league. If they allow such players to participate they are not giving a damn about you or anyone else. they are there to protect ther own interest " their pockets"

That's why being a league operator is so profitable

if you read the bi laws form the national registry ot even call them

Every league operator has the ability to govern what goes on, how much they charge, what they charge, if and when and whenever they please they own it

The best you can do is step up to the plate, play your game, or get smart and quit giving your money away.

It's the mentality of people that play in leagues

they pY TO PLAY

***** AND WINE WHEN THEY GET BEATEN
THE BEST ANYO LEAGUE PLAYER CAN DO IS GIVE IT UP, THEN YOU CAN PICK AND CHOSE TO PLAY WHEN AND WHENEVER, PLAYING TOURNAMENTS WITH A CHANCE TO WIN SOMETHING

QUIT THROWING YOUR MONEY IN A MONEY OLE FEEDING THESE OPERATORS THEY DON'T GIVE ADAN ABOUT ANYONE, AS LONG AS YOUR MONEY IS MAKING THEIR LIVING

tHEY WILL LET ANYONE PLAY AS LONG AS THEY HAVE MONEY

REMEMBER THE LEAGUE IS NOT THERE FOR YOU IT'S A BUSINESS TO MAKE MONEY

Wow, who the hell pissed in your coffee this morning!!! Play league to have fun, make and meet new friends.... etc.... If you really want to get better put in more time at the table and get better not that complicated. Once you get to a 6 SL most games come down to who makes the first mistake, after that it's usually game over. If your lucky locked in a match against a strong 7 you have to know and understand that before you break the first rack. At this level the game is first played in your head, then it's up to the body to execute the plan.

Black Cat

 

[Maniac]

The best you can do is step up to the plate, play your game, or get smart and quit giving your money away.

Actually, I think that me playing in the APA is SAVING me money. The places I shoot out of give us league players FREE table time. I get to the poolhall for some practice a good 2 1/2 hours before league starts. Many nights, we will hang around after league play and hit some balls around or use this time to give the lesser skill-level players some instruction. So, all-in-all, I'd say that I average about 3 hours of FREE table time for every night I show up for league play. If I happen to play that night and it cost me $7, I'm still coming out ahead.

Giving your money away??? Hardly!!!

Maniac

 

[Spimp13]

An inning in APA does not close until both players have come to the table.

For example, if a player breaks and runs a rack the game is marked on the score sheet as 0 innings. A player that breaks and runs out the entire set will have completed the match in 0 innings.

Lets say that player A breaks and runs 2 games, and then breaks dry in the 3rd game. Player B then proceeds to run out the rack, it would still be considered 0 innings.

When player B misses a ball/ breaks dry etc, the inning is then considered closed and marked down as 1.

Hope this helps to bring some clarification. Just remember, both players have to have completed a turn at the table to constitute 1 inning.

-----missread this post

 

[cardiac kid]

Jeff is at the level where the amateurs think he is a pro and the pros think he is an amateur.

There are alot of APA guys across the nation that play very close to Crawford's speed, both above him and below him. Guys like

Kenneth Brisbon
Gabe Apollos
Brian Parks
Jeff Sergent
Ernesto Bayaua
Robert Hall
Steve Knoll
Frank Almanza
Lyn Wechsler
Alex Olinger

There is alot more than just those guys too. Singles nationals is a tough ass tournament to win. Bar box race to 5 in 8ball especially can turn on a single miscue or missed ball when your playing guys that speed.

Damn you Uwate, I've been outed! Guess this means the guy in CA who called me a "banger" won't play me when I'm in Vegas in January :grin:! Seriously, I think you overstate my abilities. I play and practice hard. Need to do it to maintain what skills I have at 67. Honored though as you put me in some great company!

Joined APA two years ago. My Monday nights are by far the most fun playing pool I have. Wish my team mates would stop relying on me so much. One person CAN NOT win the entire match. It takes all five. As we say, there is no "I" in team. Order of hot wings and a 20 oz LaBatt's Blue please!

Lyn

Forgot to mention opponent complaints to the LO. Was told this past weekend at a singles qualifier, a couple of players have complained. Was news to me. Thought my helping some of the weaker players with their game might have given them insight as to why I play. Sorry to say, they must be "bangers"!

 

[justadub]

The APA is a bunch of bull crap designed to make money for the league operators. what you have to consider is that they own this prtion of the league. If they allow such players to participate they are not giving a damn about you or anyone else. they are there to protect ther own interest " their pockets"

That's why being a league operator is so profitable

if you read the bi laws form the national registry ot even call them

Every league operator has the ability to govern what goes on, how much they charge, what they charge, if and when and whenever they please they own it

The best you can do is step up to the plate, play your game, or get smart and quit giving your money away.

It's the mentality of people that play in leagues

they pY TO PLAY

***** AND WINE WHEN THEY GET BEATEN
THE BEST ANYO LEAGUE PLAYER CAN DO IS GIVE IT UP, THEN YOU CAN PICK AND CHOSE TO PLAY WHEN AND WHENEVER, PLAYING TOURNAMENTS WITH A CHANCE TO WIN SOMETHING

QUIT THROWING YOUR MONEY IN A MONEY OLE FEEDING THESE OPERATORS THEY DON'T GIVE ADAN ABOUT ANYONE, AS LONG AS YOUR MONEY IS MAKING THEIR LIVING

tHEY WILL LET ANYONE PLAY AS LONG AS THEY HAVE MONEY

REMEMBER THE LEAGUE IS NOT THERE FOR YOU IT'S A BUSINESS TO MAKE MONEY

Of course its a business. The whole league thing doesn't just happen magically on it's own, someone has to do the work (and put the money in to the supplies and websites and other stuff that makes a league as big as APA run over the course of a year) and those people deserve to make a living, too. People who worry about what other people make....sheesh.

As Maniac put it, league is a great value for me. $9 for the night, play as much as I want, get actual structured competition, end of session and season tournaments....

Yep. APA is a bargain. At least for me. I like it.

 

[CreeDo]

To my knowledge, pros are disallowed from the APA, and you're considered a pro if you ever cashed and accepted the money in a pro event. I guess you can refuse the money if you want to keep amateur status.

Who decides what's a pro event, I don't know. "Cashed" might also be something debatable... if you place 14th and win back your entry fee, does that count?

There is the separate masters league, and from what I've seen, there's no need for a THIRD league. That's overkill. Masters is designed for those who want to just play the best players straight up. If that means one area is a bunch of soft 6's and the other is a bunch of killer 9's, so be it.

The handicapping can only go so far, especially in 8 ball. I think someone on here put it nicely when they said "there's no limit to how good a 7 can be". Guys who play a ball worse than me are a seven, and francisco bustamante would also be a seven if he somehow snuck under the radar. But in no way would I ever beat busty in any APA race. So the handicapping system breaks down there.

Guys who can run out the entire set probably don't belong in the APA. A lifetime average of 0.5... Ack. Just one miss every other rack?

 

[bazkook]

No one consistently runs sets out. If he works 40hrs a week, why shouldn't he be able to play in a amateur tournament since thats what he is? You want to penalize someone because he plays better than you! If you have natural talent you to can put in the work and improve.

I'm not saying penalize him and forbid him from ever playing APA. I'm just suggesting that the APA handicap system is not accurate enough. I was recently bumped up from a SL6 to a SL7 in 8-ball. I usually have one break and run per match and have never broke and ran more than one rack consecutively in 8 ball. Then you have a player of Jeff's caliber or better who may also be a 7, who can string multiple racks fairly easily, if he makes a ball on the break.
Is it fair for both of us to be the same skill level when he is clearly superior to me? I think not.