----------
Last edited:
Pro Pool players courting disaster
- Thread starter jay helfert
- Start date
thats 100% right, like snooker in the UK. then there is a future. all I see now a the pool room is the same faces, more wrinkles, more gray hair and sadly a few less people each year. its all old people, Cotton said it best-it 20 years "its gonna be you and Hawaiian Jimmy left".
Kids play soccer and kids play golf. Real simple.
Much of pool is math and physics. Angles, spins, fractions, friction, english. The science kids would eat it up. The struggling students would have a visual reference different from the typical book explanations.
I bet the typical sports jocks would love to see who has the most powerful break. The science wiz kids would love english and trick shots. How cool would it be for the nerdy science kid to beat the captain of the football team in pool ? Or the skinny kid who is not strong, but has a faster break speed than the weight lifter ?
It would take a while, but pool in the education system is probably the only way pool will grow substantially.
Guess that playing the game (sport) I love for over fifty five years has taught me nothing. Keep reading about all these grand plans to save pool. More specifically pro pool. Pool in America is doing just fine. All you have to do is visit any bar or pool room on league nights. So many words (and dollars) have been and will be wasted trying to get pro pool to the level of golf. It just isn't going to happen. Does anyone think that BB will energize the pool world to where league nights will be BB instead of 8 or 9 ball. Even a few places? Then again, I'm part of the great unwashed.
Understand and respect CJ's point of view. Nathan's as well. Mark G went overboard in his offer. Jay has a legitimate point. Many of the other posters as well. In the end, this whole thread is nothing but verbal masturbation! It appears nothing will change. Sad beginning and perhaps a sad end. Who is in charge here? Again JMHO.
Lyn
Understand and respect CJ's point of view. Nathan's as well. Mark G went overboard in his offer. Jay has a legitimate point. Many of the other posters as well. In the end, this whole thread is nothing but verbal masturbation! It appears nothing will change. Sad beginning and perhaps a sad end. Who is in charge here? Again JMHO.
Lyn
----------
Last edited:
Are you kidding Dave? I've heard that comment a number of times...starting with Lou Butera saying it after he'd won a world championship. Most pro players live in the moment...i.e.: "what's in it for ME?...NOW, not 5 years from now!" Until they work together for a common goal, they, as a group, will stay in the same place they've been for decades...treading water!
Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Living in the moment has nothing whatever to do with with feeling you are owed a living. 80% of americans live paycheck to paycheck and 50% retire without one nickel in savings.
yeah thats for sure, i have had 1000's of employees that were 100X worse than pool players and they cant make a ball-whats their excuse. there is no coorlation between living for today and pool IMO. thats just life. not my life, i refuse to live like that. im a planner, not a hoper or dreamer
Not a clue ?
I think a lot of people that comment on the state of Pro Pool should state their qualifications for making their assumptions. Other than they have played pool for a long time. Rome wasn't built in a day, Unfortunatly pool is taking 100 plus years.
The mentality of some of the posters on here is that it will never become mainstream. Some of us disagree. Seems to me that China is taking the lead here. I doub't they have forums like this where 80% of the people come on and tell how things can't happen. C.J. like myhas started prself does have the background , So does Jay , Mark, Greg etc..
C. J. made a comment that pool players are very resiliant, They find a way because they are tough. To think that there are no young people that love to play pool is not a very accurate statement. Mark Wilson has started a program at Lindenwood College in St. Charles Missouri .
From what I understand this is taking off very well. I think they are building a Facility for pool tables . If I were Greg , I would be talking to Mark and the other schools involved about installing the fine Diamond Tables.
Pool leagues are thriving, The connection has to be made to get these league players interested in watching pool. This could start with the team format of B.B.
All of this talk of Television sponsorship is a ways away. Pool league players have to get interested in watching pool, Not just playing. There is no sure answer, But saying it will never happe is a little on the negative side.
Gary
I think a lot of people that comment on the state of Pro Pool should state their qualifications for making their assumptions. Other than they have played pool for a long time. Rome wasn't built in a day, Unfortunatly pool is taking 100 plus years.
The mentality of some of the posters on here is that it will never become mainstream. Some of us disagree. Seems to me that China is taking the lead here. I doub't they have forums like this where 80% of the people come on and tell how things can't happen. C.J. like myhas started prself does have the background , So does Jay , Mark, Greg etc..
C. J. made a comment that pool players are very resiliant, They find a way because they are tough. To think that there are no young people that love to play pool is not a very accurate statement. Mark Wilson has started a program at Lindenwood College in St. Charles Missouri .
From what I understand this is taking off very well. I think they are building a Facility for pool tables . If I were Greg , I would be talking to Mark and the other schools involved about installing the fine Diamond Tables.
Pool leagues are thriving, The connection has to be made to get these league players interested in watching pool. This could start with the team format of B.B.
All of this talk of Television sponsorship is a ways away. Pool league players have to get interested in watching pool, Not just playing. There is no sure answer, But saying it will never happe is a little on the negative side.
Gary
Because of my position as a pool player I secured an SBA loan
Pool's been a stepping stone in many of our paths and most of us will always be grateful. Because of my position as a pool player I secured an SBA loan for $1,000,000 on my signature and my pool room's revenue alone. This business generated over 35 Million Dollars, so it was a big asset for the American economy. I know many people that enjoy and play advanced pool that are very wealthy.
This is a fact, so don't think Pro Pool is a "lost cause" and please don't judge the players without knowing for sure....it's just common courtesy and prudence. I played pool with a gentleman two Saturdays ago that's one of the wealthiest men in Texas, and he plays several times a week at a private mens club in Ft. Worth.
The reason Pro Pool isn't successful has very little to do with the players. Just like all the rest of the sports and games, the business leaders are the ones that are in the position to make the difference, very rarely the players. This is true across the board in most sports and games.
Pool's been a stepping stone in many of our paths and most of us will always be grateful. Because of my position as a pool player I secured an SBA loan for $1,000,000 on my signature and my pool room's revenue alone. This business generated over 35 Million Dollars, so it was a big asset for the American economy. I know many people that enjoy and play advanced pool that are very wealthy.
This is a fact, so don't think Pro Pool is a "lost cause" and please don't judge the players without knowing for sure....it's just common courtesy and prudence. I played pool with a gentleman two Saturdays ago that's one of the wealthiest men in Texas, and he plays several times a week at a private mens club in Ft. Worth.
The reason Pro Pool isn't successful has very little to do with the players. Just like all the rest of the sports and games, the business leaders are the ones that are in the position to make the difference, very rarely the players. This is true across the board in most sports and games.
I Left The Billiard Congress of America in 1996.
Scholastic participation is the only way to grow the future market in the U.S.
I, and many others, had a number of ideas to promote this type of development, from summer camps, youth development, and creation of ancillary relationships with other professinal sports youth organizations. Unfortunately, former Exec. Dir. Bruce Cottew was busy lobbying the board for his raise and there wasn't a "budget" for any of that nonsense. I saw the writing on the wall. John's vision of olympic recognition was the highest priority, because the BCA was paying 10k a year for membership in all these organizations. Where is the ROI,...???
Jay nailed it. There is no reason to believe the BCA Trade Association will have any interest in Pro Players,or anyone else for that matter.
Pool and Billiards will never die out, but it is in one of the longest comatose conditions I have ever seen. This is why it is very important for Bonus Ball to work with the other Tournament Promoters to solve the scheduling conflict.
Carl
And basically, didn't look back at pool the same way. Jay knows exactly how much John Lewis's Dream was to get the BCA to support his vision of Olympic Recognition. Yes, Jay, the BCA has wasted a lot of time, energy, and money on these fruitless endeavors. They didn't want to embrace real youth organizational structure to develop a future. The BEF has a handful of scholarships, but I doubt enough to have 1 per state. The Olympics,...WPA,WCBS,...worthless for developing youth pool.
Scholastic participation is the only way to grow the future market in the U.S.
I, and many others, had a number of ideas to promote this type of development, from summer camps, youth development, and creation of ancillary relationships with other professinal sports youth organizations. Unfortunately, former Exec. Dir. Bruce Cottew was busy lobbying the board for his raise and there wasn't a "budget" for any of that nonsense. I saw the writing on the wall. John's vision of olympic recognition was the highest priority, because the BCA was paying 10k a year for membership in all these organizations. Where is the ROI,...???
Jay nailed it. There is no reason to believe the BCA Trade Association will have any interest in Pro Players,or anyone else for that matter.
Pool and Billiards will never die out, but it is in one of the longest comatose conditions I have ever seen. This is why it is very important for Bonus Ball to work with the other Tournament Promoters to solve the scheduling conflict.
Carl
Golf is not a good comparison
Golf ratings are through the roof as are the purses, whether Tiger or Phil is in the field or not and the companies willing to advertise on the telecast, sponsor an event and sponsor a player with their company logos on hat/shirt/bag etc....are taking a number to wait for the opportunity. Just look at FedEx alone with the FedEx cup and 10 million to the year end winner. You may find it boring but obviously MANY do not..myself included.
Golf ratings are through the roof as are the purses, whether Tiger or Phil is in the field or not and the companies willing to advertise on the telecast, sponsor an event and sponsor a player with their company logos on hat/shirt/bag etc....are taking a number to wait for the opportunity. Just look at FedEx alone with the FedEx cup and 10 million to the year end winner. You may find it boring but obviously MANY do not..myself included.
FALSE
Just one example -- baseball was DEAD after the PLAYERS strike in the 90s. McGwire and Sosa and their home run battle saved baseball.
Since you like to compare golf to pool -- look at the yearly money leaders and the total they won from pre and post 1997 when Tiger came on the scene. It goes straight up like the sport never saw before.
Also, let me know what channel you find the Tour De France on this year.
People like Gary want to talk about making pool popular with the younger players. It has to be done right like Mark Wilson is doing it. If you want to see the wrong, just YouTube some of the videos of the DCC of the 'woofing' exhibitions of the younger players. They are simply pathetic and embarrassing and simply lack respect for not only their opponent but themselves. Every nickel in the crowd trying to be a quarter. Why is that? Because they are just taking to the next level what the player foundation put in front of them from before.
----------
Last edited:
and people say steroids are bad, LOL I love them!!! Anavar, suston250, equipoise, deca, you name it i used it, and i hope to get back on the juice someday. life is just better when your peaking on a good cycle....:thumbup:
Eurosport all day everyday.
that was my point to CJ why I like Asia better than america, the ESPN monopoly is to tough to fade, where in other markets there are smaller media outlets to sell to, Barry Hearn knows that and is hugely successful. And Why he Avoids America.
----------
Last edited:
----------
Last edited:
Soccer ............
They just had a Professional Soccer match in St. Louis, Between 2 of Britain's best teams. Busch stadium sold out in 2 hours, 48,000 fans, They loved it !!!!!!!!!
They just had a Professional Soccer match in St. Louis, Between 2 of Britain's best teams. Busch stadium sold out in 2 hours, 48,000 fans, They loved it !!!!!!!!!
Since the time BB was allowed to preview their game during an Accu-Stats production
(can't remember which event) a few years ago I have been very neutral about the whole matter.
I really cannot see trying to reinvent the wheel for one, but kept it to myself.
Just figured it isn't a good idea when the country is still trying to get the general public
to try other games besides 8-ball.
The first time it was shown to the public's eye I can assure you it was on a Diamond table
covered with Simonis Cloth.
BB has optioned for a different brand of table. That's their choice.
But now I see it will be covered with a cloth that is not Simonis !!!
Diamond and Simonis has been the backbone of what the pro players do have.
They also do alot for amatures and their events.
To me it is like the BB players and officials have stuck the knife in.
Thats life I guess. Backbiters everywhere in everything, not just pool.
Humans just not smart enough to work things out with their own kind.
I know they have the right to make their own decision on this and so do I.
I WILL NOT send one thin dime the way of BB.
(can't remember which event) a few years ago I have been very neutral about the whole matter.
I really cannot see trying to reinvent the wheel for one, but kept it to myself.
Just figured it isn't a good idea when the country is still trying to get the general public
to try other games besides 8-ball.
The first time it was shown to the public's eye I can assure you it was on a Diamond table
covered with Simonis Cloth.
BB has optioned for a different brand of table. That's their choice.
But now I see it will be covered with a cloth that is not Simonis !!!
Diamond and Simonis has been the backbone of what the pro players do have.
They also do alot for amatures and their events.
To me it is like the BB players and officials have stuck the knife in.
Thats life I guess. Backbiters everywhere in everything, not just pool.
Humans just not smart enough to work things out with their own kind.
I know they have the right to make their own decision on this and so do I.
I WILL NOT send one thin dime the way of BB.