Ruling on coins under the rail

L

longhair

Boyd Porter-Reynolds
Silver Member
Suppose that we are playing nine ball and using coins under the rail to keep score. When I moved my coin after the last game, I didn't tuck it under quite as far as I should have, but you didn't notice. You take a shot and a ball hits my coin and affects the outcome. Is this:

no foul, the coin is part of the table?

a foul on me because I put the coin there?

a foul on you (the shooter) because you are responsible for the table while you shoot?


Also, does it matter whether the ball that touched the coin is the cueball?


This situation came up between some friends of mine recently. They called it a foul on the player who moved the coin (not the shooter). My intuition is that this should be a foul on the shooter. Obviously this is not a rule that one would think of negotiating before a match or set. What say you?
 
longhair said:
Suppose that we are playing nine ball and using coins under the rail to keep score. When I moved my coin after the last game, I didn't tuck it under quite as far as I should have, but you didn't notice. You take a shot and a ball hits my coin and affects the outcome. Is this:

no foul, the coin is part of the table?

a foul on me because I put the coin there?

a foul on you (the shooter) because you are responsible for the table while you shoot?


Also, does it matter whether the ball that touched the coin is the cueball?


This situation came up between some friends of mine recently. They called it a foul on the player who moved the coin (not the shooter). My intuition is that this should be a foul on the shooter. Obviously this is not a rule that one would think of negotiating before a match or set. What say you?
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I don't think it is a foul on anybody. It is a lesson learned on both parties. Always make sure the coin is under the rail. I always do - whether it is mine or not. JMO

BVal
 
Maybe you shouldn't ever get to play again!

LOL

I am just kidding, I think it is just a lesson learned.
 
BCA Rulebook p.143. Rule 14.6 - Marking the score with coins on the rail. Coins must be the same denomination and size. All coins are the responsibility of the player moving them. In the case of a coin protruding from the rail, if a ball comes into contact with this coin, it is a foul on the player who placed it there.

First infraction gives the opposing player Ball In Hand. Second infraction to include loss of coin, plus Ball In Hand. Third infraction and the penalized player must empty his pockets and give his entire bankroll to the aggrieved player. With a written letter of apology.

Hey don't take my word for it. It's right there next to the part about shooting straight through frozen balls.

Just having fun kids. Don't get all worked up now.
 
jay helfert said:
BCA Rulebook p.143. Rule 14.6 - Marking the score with coins on the rail. Coins must be the same denomination and size. All coins are the responsibility of the player moving them. In the case of a coin protruding from the rail, if a ball comes into contact with this coin, it is a foul on the player who placed it there.

First infraction gives the opposing player Ball In Hand. Second infraction to include loss of coin, plus Ball In Hand. Third infraction and the penalized player must empty his pockets and give his entire bankroll to the aggrieved player. With a written letter of apology.

Hey don't take my word for it. It's right there next to the part about shooting straight through frozen balls.

Just having fun kids. Don't get all worked up now.
Click to expand...

Hmmmm I didn't know that. You mean all these years when I had no shot I could have pushed my oponents coin out a little when he or she wasn't looking and hit it with the QB and got ball in hand? Johnnyt
 
jay helfert said:
BCA Rulebook p.143. Rule 14.6 - Marking the score with coins on the rail. Coins must be the same denomination and size. All coins are the responsibility of the player moving them. In the case of a coin protruding from the rail, if a ball comes into contact with this coin, it is a foul on the player who placed it there.

First infraction gives the opposing player Ball In Hand. Second infraction to include loss of coin, plus Ball In Hand. Third infraction and the penalized player must empty his pockets and give his entire bankroll to the aggrieved player. With a written letter of apology.

Hey don't take my word for it. It's right there next to the part about shooting straight through frozen balls.

Just having fun kids. Don't get all worked up now.
Click to expand...
Thanks, Jay
 
jay helfert said:
BCA Rulebook p.143. Rule 14.6 - Marking the score with coins on the rail. Coins must be the same denomination and size. All coins are the responsibility of the player moving them. In the case of a coin protruding from the rail, if a ball comes into contact with this coin, it is a foul on the player who placed it there.

First infraction gives the opposing player Ball In Hand. Second infraction to include loss of coin, plus Ball In Hand. Third infraction and the penalized player must empty his pockets and give his entire bankroll to the aggrieved player. With a written letter of apology.

Hey don't take my word for it. It's right there next to the part about shooting straight through frozen balls.

Just having fun kids. Don't get all worked up now.
Click to expand...
If you were to read league rules here in SanAntonio, you would have believed your explantion.

Here, you can push out behind a ball without touching the rail. Then you can get ball in hand after two consecutive fouls. Plus thee is no call pocket or shot, just shit em in.

Then you have to mark the pocket for the 8-ball plus pat your head and rub your tummy at the same time.

Then, if you win the city championship you win a gold ring,,,,,,,which you have to pay for.
 
No foul... but feel free to argue with your opponent til you're blue in the face.
 
What if you use a chocolate coin, and the chocolate melts, and your opponent is allergic to chocolate, and then a drunk David Hasslehoff stumbles in thru the door, and calls a foul? Should you go along with it?
 
cuetechasaurus said:
What if you use a chocolate coin, and the chocolate melts, and your opponent is allergic to chocolate, and then a drunk David Hasslehoff stumbles in thru the door, and calls a foul? Should you go along with it?
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does hasslehoff eat the coin?
 
Was it heads? Or tails?
spin.gif


peace_350.gif
 
jay helfert said:
BCA Rulebook p.143. Rule 14.6 - Marking the score with coins on the rail. Coins must be the same denomination and size. All coins are the responsibility of the player moving them. In the case of a coin protruding from the rail, if a ball comes into contact with this coin, it is a foul on the player who placed it there.

First infraction gives the opposing player Ball In Hand. Second infraction to include loss of coin, plus Ball In Hand. Third infraction and the penalized player must empty his pockets and give his entire bankroll to the aggrieved player. With a written letter of apology.

Hey don't take my word for it. It's right there next to the part about shooting straight through frozen balls.

Just having fun kids. Don't get all worked up now.
Click to expand...

OK - Jay - You deserve to be on the forum again.

Good Stuff!!:D
 
jay helfert said:
BCA Rulebook p.143. Rule 14.6 - Marking the score with coins on the rail. Coins must be the same denomination and size. All coins are the responsibility of the player moving them. In the case of a coin protruding from the rail, if a ball comes into contact with this coin, it is a foul on the player who placed it there.

First infraction gives the opposing player Ball In Hand. Second infraction to include loss of coin, plus Ball In Hand. Third infraction and the penalized player must empty his pockets and give his entire bankroll to the aggrieved player. With a written letter of apology.

Hey don't take my word for it. It's right there next to the part about shooting straight through frozen balls.

Just having fun kids. Don't get all worked up now.
Click to expand...

First paragraph, Im like oh wow there is a BCA rule on this..

Second paragraph...wait a minute wtf lmao
 
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uwate said:
First paragraph, Im like oh wow there is a BCA rule on this..

Second paragraph...wait a minute wtf lmao
Click to expand...

Ha-Ha I did the same thing...DOH!!!!!!!!!!!!

We have been using the coin method at the Flamingo for as long as I can remember and it has never caused a foul.

I myself do not like it, I prefer the balls on the wire.:D
 
I'd definitely vote "part of the table" (no foul). It's both players' responsibility to make sure there aren't obstructions on the table when they shoot. If you don't make sure of that, and your balls hits something that affects the shot, you take what you get. That's why Johnny Archer picks lint off the table. He had a ball deflect off some lint once in 1992. Never again for Johnny.

Oh, that and he clearly has some level of OCD (not bashing Johnny at all; I've had friends with OCD, and what Johnny does at the table moving balls from pocket to pocket where he's not even shooting at those pockets, and picking little tiny invisible bits of lint before almost every shot, is textbook OCD).

-Andrew
 
Nick Varner discussed this situation with Howard Vickery on an accustat video I have (1P, Parica vs Alex). Nick said he shot and the ball went into his pocket off a coin (playing 1P). He admitted that he would have missed the shot otherwise. The TD (Grady I believe), ruled that the players were to come to an agreement of where the OB would have come to rest if not interfered with by the coin and spot it there. They spotted the OB and Nick lost his turn as he would have missed anyway.

Seemed like a reasonable solution to me.
 
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