subdude1974 said:
Just to add...
Martinez, Petersen, Runde, Kikel, Kershenbrock, Jensen, Zylr, Phillippi, Olney, All make great cues and reasonably priced. All have the capability of creating a flawlessly executed cue. I mean flawless.
Searing cues???
- Thread starter subdude1974
- Start date
Just to add...
Martinez, Petersen, Runde, Kikel, Kershenbrock, Jensen, Zylr, Phillippi, Olney, All make great cues and reasonably priced. All have the capability of creating a flawlessly executed cue. I mean flawless.
WheatCues
Banned
subdude1974 said:
Well alot of it is hype it seems once a cuemaker is mainstream and he is solidifies in the industry he can pretty do as he wishes... let's face it "it's all about marketing" forthe most part however, as you know this particular field of profession is very close and tight knitted and it only takes the right person to give you a good or bad name and it spreads like the black plague to everone else.. so it's imperative to approach this market with quailty and respect to insure you dont crash and burn and forever be an outcast in this cutthroat realm we call a lifestyle...
Per. my last message that I edited a couple of times to finally get it right, alot of cuemakers are afforded the luxury of turning out "mistakes or coverups" to the avg. person only because you are getting what you are paying for, and most of the high end cues are reserved for the deep pocketed or professional players. and once again Dennis's reputation dictates his quality, therfore you could x-ray the cue or put it under an electron microscope and it would be absolutlely perfect !
It's more or less the prestige than anything else !
Searing Cues are like the Rolls-Royce of Cars to put it directly....
- Eddie
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WheatCues
Banned
regarding seem
Oh I can detect the seam....
I know your a tough crowd and I have no problem handling it... if you took the time to read it thoroughly, you would have picked up on it !!!
the point is, I AM in the business of building cues as well, and since I have the uptmost respect for Dennis I would never try to compare my cues to his, simply because we are on two different levels of the business.
Therefore, if you paid attention to the text you would have seen the first half was explaining the "big deal about searing cues" and then the bottom half adverstising my company as well becasue that is what it's all about...
If you were a cuemaker you would understand, it's a give and take industry and you plug yourself whenever you can !
- Eddie
Oh I can detect the seam....
I know your a tough crowd and I have no problem handling it... if you took the time to read it thoroughly, you would have picked up on it !!!
the point is, I AM in the business of building cues as well, and since I have the uptmost respect for Dennis I would never try to compare my cues to his, simply because we are on two different levels of the business.
Therefore, if you paid attention to the text you would have seen the first half was explaining the "big deal about searing cues" and then the bottom half adverstising my company as well becasue that is what it's all about...
If you were a cuemaker you would understand, it's a give and take industry and you plug yourself whenever you can !
- Eddie
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WheatCues
Banned
regarding flawless cues
Don't get me wrong.... there are alot of great cuemaker on the market today... anf they do produce flawless work !
However, Denns's cues have ALWAYS been that way. he never evolved... he's just that friggin' anal about his work...
He scraps wood that most of us wood consider perfect, as well as other materials I drool over...
You would have to know him on a personal level to understand what I'm talking about !
I have the greatest respect for all cuemakers.... it's definitley a passion and an undying love to be able to consistantly give most of your waking hours to mastering this unmasterable art. only becasue there is always room for improvement and efficiency !
The reason why all these cuemakers still exist on the market is due to loyal fans and a variety of taste for each personality...
"beautiful thing America !"
- Eddie
Don't get me wrong.... there are alot of great cuemaker on the market today... anf they do produce flawless work !
However, Denns's cues have ALWAYS been that way. he never evolved... he's just that friggin' anal about his work...
He scraps wood that most of us wood consider perfect, as well as other materials I drool over...
You would have to know him on a personal level to understand what I'm talking about !
I have the greatest respect for all cuemakers.... it's definitley a passion and an undying love to be able to consistantly give most of your waking hours to mastering this unmasterable art. only becasue there is always room for improvement and efficiency !
The reason why all these cuemakers still exist on the market is due to loyal fans and a variety of taste for each personality...
"beautiful thing America !"
- Eddie
I know where you're coming from and you are certainly entitled to your opinion. I feel that way about a lot of products and some cues as well. I'd like to point out that Dennis does not charge anywhere near what the cues sell for on the secondary market.
Martin
Martin
subdude1974 said:What is the deal with Searings and being overpriced as hell? I just dont get it. Dont get me wrong, he makes a hell of a cue but WAY overpriced for what ou get. I dont see paying what people are asking when you can get a nicer cue for less,i.e. Scruggs,Cochran,Mottey,White,etc. Is it just because he decides to do it like a hobby(IMO) and only put out like 10 cues a year if that many. Again, not knocking the craftsmanship. I have seen some beautiful cues of his but no plain 4 pointer from a modern cue maker is worthy of 6000. I think you got to be crazy or just have more money than you know what to do with if you pay these kind of prices. Agree or disagree. Just looking for some enlightnement.
Playability is what its about, the truth is you dont have to break the bank for an awsome playing cue, Albrecht is a fine example, and to me it is perfect, and is the best playing cue for me, period, I just dont think your going to find a better playing cue, a DS may but I dont see how. I think thats buying into the Magic Bullet theory myself, but thats just one aspect of a cue, If the ring work, inlays, points etc.. are indeed perfect, then yes it warrents a higher price, but at some point it will be over priced, for the cue described at 6000 is over priced. IMHO. I could understand 2000-2500. its basicaly a plain jane right? anything higher, and it is just hype...if you ask me Im sure DS makes fine cues, but YOW! thats high..
SPINDOKTOR
SPINDOKTOR
I would dearly love to own a Searing cue but I never will because (1) I will not pay the inflated prices they bring on the secondary market, and (2) I'm to old to go on his waiting list. But I will never fret that I can't get one. With that being said, I doubt that I will ever miss a ball because I don't have one.
As far as perfect build execution, I own/owned cues I consider just that. My two current players are Scruggs and Chudy... and believe me, they both are flawless with great playability. And I've owned others that I can say the exact same thing about. As far as me not having a Searing cue, as much as I'd like one, it's... well... not the end of the world. I'm proud of the cues I do have.
As far as perfect build execution, I own/owned cues I consider just that. My two current players are Scruggs and Chudy... and believe me, they both are flawless with great playability. And I've owned others that I can say the exact same thing about. As far as me not having a Searing cue, as much as I'd like one, it's... well... not the end of the world. I'm proud of the cues I do have.
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How About Prewitt and Haley...
Those guys put out cues that are about as prefect as any I have ever seen. Thanks to Ribdoner (Adam Orr) I have had the pleasure to play with a Searing cue and while I thought it was one hell of a cue, I would not pay 6k for a four point standard cue. But I do not have tens of thousands of dollars to spend on cues, if I did I might think otherwise.
As we always state each and every cue is worth what ever you can get out of it when you sell it
-don
Salamander said:
Those guys put out cues that are about as prefect as any I have ever seen. Thanks to Ribdoner (Adam Orr) I have had the pleasure to play with a Searing cue and while I thought it was one hell of a cue, I would not pay 6k for a four point standard cue. But I do not have tens of thousands of dollars to spend on cues, if I did I might think otherwise.
As we always state each and every cue is worth what ever you can get out of it when you sell it
-don
Man I would be scared to touch, let alone play with a 6,000 cue. I was looking at my player(pred 4k4 $800), and I have dings & scratches (who say pool isn't a contact sport) all over the butt. If it was a 6,000 cue It would make me cry, and I might give up the sport!
That Searing,He is almost getting Sugartree prices!
What's the big deal. If you like a cue and are willing to pay the price do it.
And if you don't .... don't.
Most will say the market place dictates the price on everything. Me personally I decide on what I will pay for a cue or not pay, it is totally my decision.
I am willing to invest more to own a Dennis Searing,Barry Szamboti,John Showman,Joel Hercek,South West,Ron Haley,Bob Manzino etc.
It is all personal choice my friends and there is no right or wrong on the price of a cue, only what one is willing to pay or not pay.
PS. If any of you guys that are complaining about the price of cues and just happen to have any of the cues I have mentioned please feel free to contact me and I will be happy to pay you less than the current market value.
PPSS. Dennis is blessed to be a great cue maker and there are many of us that appreciate his cues and that is why his cues command a higher price on the secondary market.
And if you don't .... don't.
Most will say the market place dictates the price on everything. Me personally I decide on what I will pay for a cue or not pay, it is totally my decision.
I am willing to invest more to own a Dennis Searing,Barry Szamboti,John Showman,Joel Hercek,South West,Ron Haley,Bob Manzino etc.
It is all personal choice my friends and there is no right or wrong on the price of a cue, only what one is willing to pay or not pay.
PS. If any of you guys that are complaining about the price of cues and just happen to have any of the cues I have mentioned please feel free to contact me and I will be happy to pay you less than the current market value.
PPSS. Dennis is blessed to be a great cue maker and there are many of us that appreciate his cues and that is why his cues command a higher price on the secondary market.
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It seems there have been many, many threads here about cue prices and whether or not a particular cue is overpriced. Perhaps the better question is, "Why, if you are not in the market for a Searing/B. Szam/BlackBoar/Manzino/Cantando/Schick/Tascarella/etc, do you care what is being paid by someone else for a particular cue?" Frankly, if you can't afford it it's none of your business and you don't need to be questioning the intelligence (or inferred lack thereof) of those who are in a position to buy spectacular works of cuemaking art.
The Szambotis and Balabushkas and Palmers of 30-40 years ago are fairly plain cues. Many made from Titleist blanks which were nowhere near perfect. Certainly none of them had the equipment to create the precision and flawless execution available to the modern cuemaker. Yes, they were visionaries and innovators and artists and their work now brings prices that are much higher than Searing and the others.
Perhaps the collector (if there is one) who will pay $6000 for the Searing being sold is a very shrewd collector who knows what he is doing and is buying a bargain. And maybe he will lose his shirt!!! My point is that it really isn't anyone's else's business and perhaps the "wannabe's" and the "I could buy one if I wanted but I won't pay that much" should keep their opinions to themselves and let the market place take care of business in it's own efficient and gentlemanly manner.
The Szambotis and Balabushkas and Palmers of 30-40 years ago are fairly plain cues. Many made from Titleist blanks which were nowhere near perfect. Certainly none of them had the equipment to create the precision and flawless execution available to the modern cuemaker. Yes, they were visionaries and innovators and artists and their work now brings prices that are much higher than Searing and the others.
Perhaps the collector (if there is one) who will pay $6000 for the Searing being sold is a very shrewd collector who knows what he is doing and is buying a bargain. And maybe he will lose his shirt!!! My point is that it really isn't anyone's else's business and perhaps the "wannabe's" and the "I could buy one if I wanted but I won't pay that much" should keep their opinions to themselves and let the market place take care of business in it's own efficient and gentlemanly manner.
DukeofDBQ said:
So the market won't work if people have opinions? Now thats funny.
I guess that's your opinion, and I am glad you didn't keep it to yourself.
what subdude1974 is trying to say.......
IMHO if everybody would buy direct from the cue maker and not resell (and profit from it) the prices would stay reasonable dennis sells his sticks pretty cheap but you have to wait. There are people that are making a living by creating the secondary market (thats fine everybody has to make a living) i personally dont buy to many sticks secondary market (because they are out of my price range). so my advise to you (subdude) is get on his list it is worth the wait and you wont be paying crazy price.dont forget dennis is a very good player. my friend had two sticks on order with him and when he went to pick them up dennis noticed something wrong and broke them both in half and said he would make new ones. that is the type of perfectionist dennis is.
hope this helps john
IMHO if everybody would buy direct from the cue maker and not resell (and profit from it) the prices would stay reasonable dennis sells his sticks pretty cheap but you have to wait. There are people that are making a living by creating the secondary market (thats fine everybody has to make a living) i personally dont buy to many sticks secondary market (because they are out of my price range). so my advise to you (subdude) is get on his list it is worth the wait and you wont be paying crazy price.dont forget dennis is a very good player. my friend had two sticks on order with him and when he went to pick them up dennis noticed something wrong and broke them both in half and said he would make new ones. that is the type of perfectionist dennis is.
hope this helps john
While I agree with most of your post there is one issue.DukeofDBQ said:
That is that when you put something up in public you are gonna get reaction to it. The argument that people who balk at the prices for certain cues "just don't get it" is weak IMO. Maybe they get it just fine and determine that paying that much for a cue is ridiculous for them. I know that many of these super high end cues often end up in trade deals and more often than not the full asking price is never paid in cash. I know..I know sometimes guys just come with the cash but....everytime I see guys with cases full of Boti's, Searing's and Gina's there is usually trade talk involved.
Basically, if you advertise something far outside of the norm people are going to express their opinion. If you do not want the opinions keep the sales private. I believe this is why many who buy at the very high end require discretion. One reason is so they can protect their investment and I suspect the other may have something to do with not having to listen to the peanut gallery scream "You're Crazy !!!!"
9 on the snap said:So the market won't work if people have opinions? Now thats funny.
I guess that's your opinion, and I am glad you didn't keep it to yourself.
Perhaps my opinion was too strongly worded. Opinions should be epxress and they can be very informative and helpful. I don't think however it is constructive to state opinions in a vulgar, negative or condescending way.
This thread started out "..what is with Searing cues..overpriced as hell". You can insert any cuemaker name you choose and this is still a negative and inflammatory statement. "I can name 20 cues that play better and cost less" is also a blunt and crass way of stating your opinion.
Opinions?? Sure we all have them and we should feel free to express them. It would be a much nicer forum (read that world) if we could conduct ourselves and express our opinions using less cynicism and hostility.