Straight In Shots

[CJ Wiley]

I recognize from watching and playing with guys like yourself

Thanks, John, I've said this in many, many, many ways and there's still some that think they can hit a straight, center ball all the time.....

I recognize from watching and playing with guys like yourself that you're creating a "zone" with your banks by "holding" them .......I do the same thing (using a touch of inside) on most of my shots.

I saw Truman and Vernon Elliot play and it looked like the balls were curving in the pockets on the slower, "nap" cloth.....I'm sure you can relate.

It might not help,but...The hardest shot to play in golf,is a straight shot. In golf.. it is better and easier to play a cut or draw than it is to play a dead straight shot. Not many can hit a pure straight shot in pool or golf. You need to find the best way for YOU to hit the shot..not someone else,imo. John B.

 

[CJ Wiley]

it's not possible to hit off center without creating "english"(?)

Yes. In this case, it is called "unintentional english." The resulting sidespin, even though it might be a small amount, and the associated squirt, swerve, and throw, can certainly cause a straight shot to be missed, especially a long shot with tight pockets.

So you're saying it's not possible to hit off center without creating "english"(?).....are you sure you want to take that position?

 

[genomachino]

Fun to see.........

straight in shots are pretty hard. specially when you twist your elbow or wrist

straight in shots your cb is contacting less of the ob.. as a cut shot your Actually hitting more of the ball depending how much of a cut shot you have

what i do is i find the contact point on ob an shot line

then i set the middle of my body on the shot line.

then lean into my shot not turn to the side or twist my body out of line.. you don.t want to turn away from the shotline what your doing here is your approaching your shot right. so you can get a better aim..

an make sure your thumb is pointing down to floor.. an your grip is loose from start to finish. the V grip works well. just picture a baby chick in your hand an you craddling it


if this don.t help you might be eye dominant.. check with Gene Albrecht he can fix it for you

hope this helps take care an god bless:grin-square::

It's fun to see when players like yourself remember something important that the learned.

Good luck there Rob...

 

[bdorman]

Yes. It probably means you tend to twist the cue with those two fingers. You have to retrain yourself to grip without twisting. I keep those two fingers very light on the cue. They don't do much at all. Any hand manipulation I do is done with the last three, like grab and release during breaking --- Last three only.

Other people don't play that way. I do.

Many thanks. I'll try the "last three" technique.

 

[John Brumback]

Thanks, John, I've said this in many, many, many ways and there's still some that think they can hit a straight, center ball all the time.....

I recognize from watching and playing with guys like yourself that you're creating a "zone" with your banks by "holding" them .......I do the same thing (using a touch of inside) on most of my shots.

I saw Truman and Vernon Elliot play and it looked like the balls were curving in the pockets on the slower, "nap" cloth.....I'm sure you can relate.

Yeah CJ and thank you,that does sound very similar. I do see where you are coming from by making that zone. You were doing something on me for 15hrs on my home court In Lexington. You were the only one to come in there and not lose:grin: John B.

 

[FranCrimi]

Oh man brutal- I should have took that lesson All the help i asked everyone for on that shot-no one ever mentioned that.

One of The most common advice i got was to cut it a little and throw it in with English. I never even tried it on a single shot- I wanted to do it "right" which i never did.

LOL! That was a gem that Gene Nagy shared with me. Most people wrote him off as a kook with all the experimenting he did. Not me. The guy was a genius. I was having trouble twisting certain shots so Gene went to the practice table to try to figure out a way of breaking me of the habit. It worked immediately. I never forgot it. The only difference was that Gene had me shoot only with my pinkie on the cue to break the habit. I found that you can do it with the last three fingers. It's less uncomfortable that way and still works exactly the same way (and also, the cue won't go flying out of your hand).

 

[Matt]

So you're saying it's not possible to hit off center without creating "english"(?).....are you sure you want to take that position?

Maybe it's just a touch of english (TOE).

 

[nobcitypool]

So you're saying it's not possible to hit off center without creating "english"(?).....are you sure you want to take that position?

Are you trying to say that you can hit the CB anywhere but dead center and not create at least some side spin? I'm wondering if this is another misunderstanding based upon semantics or if it is something else. If something else, I'd like to understand how to hit a spherical object anywhere but dead center on the vertical axis without creating side spin.

 

[Pidge]

Are you trying to say that you can hit the CB anywhere but dead center and not create at least some side spin? I'm wondering if this is another misunderstanding based upon semantics or if it is something else. If something else, I'd like to understand how to hit a spherical object anywhere but dead center on the vertical axis without creating side spin.

For you to understand this you would have to buy the DVD...and start your road to being brainwashed.

 

[Mikjary]

LOL! That was a gem that Gene Nagy shared with me. Most people wrote him off as a kook with all the experimenting he did. Not me. The guy was a genius. I was having trouble twisting certain shots so Gene went to the practice table to try to figure out a way of breaking me of the habit. It worked immediately. I never forgot it. The only difference was that Gene had me shoot only with my pinkie on the cue to break the habit. I found that you can do it with the last three fingers. It's less uncomfortable that way and still works exactly the same way (and also, the cue won't go flying out of your hand).

Hey, hey, hey! Let's stop right here! Between you and CJ, people are gonna start figuring out how to play this game. :grin:

You're dangerously close to giving up some big info here, Fran. I know you mean well, but if some of the players I pick on start reading all this, they might start putting it all together.

Oh, go ahead. You've said too much already. :grin-square:

Best,
Mike

 

[dr_dave]

Yes. In this case, it is called "unintentional english." The resulting sidespin, even though it might be a small amount, and the associated squirt, swerve, and throw, can certainly cause a straight shot to be missed, especially a long shot with tight pockets.

So you're saying it's not possible to hit off center without creating "english"(?).....are you sure you want to take that position?

I'm not sure how you define "english," but the standard definition is: "sidespin." Yes, when you hit the CB off center, even a small amount, the CB will have sidespin off the tip. Now, as the CB travels down the table, the sidespin is lost gradually (with the rate depending on shot speed and cloth conditions). Also, when the CB hits an OB at an angle, the CB will pick up a small amount of outside spin (based on how much the OB throws) or have any inside spin reduced (or converted to outside if the amount of inside spin is small enough). Therefore, whether or not a CB has sidespin when it hits a rail depends on how much spin there is to begin with, the spin's direction compared to the cut, the speed of the shot, the distance traveled before hitting a rail, and cloth conditions.

But again, "english" is "sidespin," and hitting the CB off center (even a small amount or "touch") creates sidespin (AKA "english").

Now, to get a reaction off a cushion (i.e., a change in rebound angle), the CB must have sidespin when it reaches the cushion.

Regards,
Dave

 

[Pidge]

I'm not sure how you define "english," but the standard definition is: "sidespin." Yes, when you hit the CB off center, even a small amount, the CB will have sidespin off the tip. Now, as the CB travels down the table, the sidespin is lost gradually (with the rate depending on shot speed and cloth conditions). Also, when the CB hits an OB at an angle, the CB will pick up a small amount of outside spin (based on how much the OB throws) or have any inside spin reduced (or converted to outside if the amount of inside spin is small enough). Therefore, whether or not a CB has sidespin when it hits a rail or not depends on how much spin there is to begin with, the spin's direction compared to the cut, the speed of the shot, the distance traveled before hitting a rail, and cloth conditions.

But again, "english" is "sidespin," and hitting the CB off center (even a small amount or "touch") creates sidespin (AKA "english").

Now, to get a reaction off a cushion (i.e., a change in rebound angle), the CB must have sidespin when it reaches the cushion.

Regards,
Dave

Checkmate?

 

[CJ Wiley]

we both got a "wake up call" that day, I could tell your game was rock solid.

I think we both got a "wake up call" that day, I could tell your game was rock solid......my forte was beating "unbeatable" players on their "home court," however, after our 15 hour match I decided it was easier action going on to Cincinnati and tanging with Gary Spaeth.

I finally got the best of him (he was brutally tough at home) although I didn't get the burning desire to play you anymore in Lexington - too tough......you have certainly proved yourself over the years, bud, we're lucky to have gone through the "action years" in Kentucky.

Yeah CJ and thank you,that does sound very similar. I do see where you are coming from by making that zone. You were doing something on me for 15hrs on my home court In Lexington. You were the only one to come in there and not lose:grin: John B.

 

[CJ Wiley]

.this creates what I call "The Pinning Effect" which has a distinct sound

I define "english" as spin, or side spin. A player will create that by hitting the cue ball off center, however, I wouldn't say that "hitting the cue ball off center" IS english. The reason there's a difference in my mind is "english" can also be created by a ball colliding with a cushion or another ball.

One is what it's called, the other is how it's applied.....I personally wouldn't consider them the same thing, and to each their own.

The Touch of Inside does spin (english) the cue ball slightly, however, the angle of the cue is the key......when someone uses TOI for the suggested 3 straight hours and calibrates their shots to the center of the pocket they will notice that their cue is angled very, very slightly towards the "contact point" of the object ball.

To spin the cue ball more with "inside english" requires a slightly different angle on the cue......it's because of this factor that the more precise someone's stroke becomes the LESS TOI will be needed to get the desired effect.

This is true because of the mechanical aspect of the player's stroke AND ALSO because the advanced player will be using the edge of their tip as opposed to the center......this creates what I call "The Pinning Effect" which has a distinct sound (higher pitched) and creates more response {from the cue ball} when applying "english". 'The Game is the Teacher'

]I'm not sure how you define "english,[/B]"

 

[Neil]

I define "english" as spin, or side spin. A player will create that by hitting the cue ball off center, however, I wouldn't say that "hitting the cue ball off center" IS english.

One is what it's called, the other is how it's applied.....I personally wouldn't consider them the same thing, and to each their own.

The Touch of Inside does spin (english) the cue ball slightly, however, the angle of the cue is the key......when someone uses TOI for the suggested 3 straight hours and calibrates their shots to the center of the pocket they will notice that their cue is angled very, very slightly towards the "contact point" of the object ball.

To spin the cue ball more with "inside english" requires a slightly different angle on the cue......it's because of this factor that the more precise someone's stroke becomes the LESS TOI will be needed to get the desired effect.

This is true because of the mechanical aspect of the player's stroke AND ALSO because the advanced player will be using the edge of their tip as opposed to the center......this creates what I call "The Pinning Effect" which has a distinct sound (higher pitched) and creates more response {from the cue ball} when applying "english". 'The Game is the Teacher'



So english is spin, but spin is not english. Yeah...

You state that "advanced" players hit with the edge of the tip, and not the center. I have asked this numerous times of you, as have others, never got a reply. So, I will ask again. Would you explain how the not advanced players manage to hit the cb off the vertical and horizontal center of the cb and DO hit with the center of the tip and not the edges of the tip? Simply put, how can one hit the cb with english using the center of the tip? And, how does hitting with the edge of the tip create more response?

 

[FranCrimi]

Hey, hey, hey! Let's stop right here! Between you and CJ, people are gonna start figuring out how to play this game. :grin:

You're dangerously close to giving up some big info here, Fran. I know you mean well, but if some of the players I pick on start reading all this, they might start putting it all together.

Oh, go ahead. You've said too much already. :grin-square:

Best,
Mike

Ha! Don't think I didn't think twice before posting it. People around here haven't exactly shown me the love.

Thanks Mike.

 

[Pidge]

I just miscued, does that make me an advanced player?

 

[The Renfro]

I'm not sure how you define "english," but the standard definition is: "sidespin." Yes, when you hit the CB off center, even a small amount, the CB will have sidespin off the tip. Now, as the CB travels down the table, the sidespin is lost gradually (with the rate depending on shot speed and cloth conditions). Also, when the CB hits an OB at an angle, the CB will pick up a small amount of outside spin (based on how much the OB throws) or have any inside spin reduced (or converted to outside if the amount of inside spin is small enough). Therefore, whether or not a CB has sidespin when it hits a rail depends on how much spin there is to begin with, the spin's direction compared to the cut, the speed of the shot, the distance traveled before hitting a rail, and cloth conditions.

But again, "english" is "sidespin," and hitting the CB off center (even a small amount or "touch") creates sidespin (AKA "english").

Now, to get a reaction off a cushion (i.e., a change in rebound angle), the CB must have sidespin when it reaches the cushion.

Regards,
Dave

So basically a touch of inside if there is any distance between the object ball and the cue ball may result in no english at contact or so little that the collision induced english will wipe out whatever little was left on it....

 

[Banks]

So basically a touch of inside if there is any distance between the object ball and the cue ball may result in no english at contact or so little that the collision induced english will wipe out whatever little was left on it....

So then there's no effect from the TOI other than the path of the CB? Trying to remember.. didn't he also suggest that a firm hit be used? From what I recall of watching one of videos, most shots were hit kinda firm, which would definitely not be letting the spin(or no spin, as some say) wear off.

Heaven help me if I hear a single person around me talk about this "system", because I'm going to kick them square in the nuts.

 

[naji]

When final back swinging after pause at CB, most of the times they are actually hitting center of CB, but side way not 100% perpendicular (depending on the speed could be between 3 to 15 degrees off the line of the shot) ! which causes the spin and steer, more evident on long follow through, and when using high deflection shaft..proper stance, straight stroke, good grip and finally, a solid bridge sure the way, but a player has to start from scratch, and extremely hard to start all over; it will take long long time to adjust; for those that shoot 3 to 5 hrs a week, it is not going to work? a small change like TOI really provide aid/fix why not.

Ok good boys! am i kinda right in what i said above??