TAR 25 and the forums

I bought the PPV package, but only got to watch the 2nd day. I really enjoyed the match - so much so that I live-tweeted it. (http://twitter.com/stlJohnnyPool)

I haven't had too much time to spend on the forums and I didn't participate in the chat, but I recall some simply amazing shots from both players as well as some amazing outs. There was plenty of banter back and forth - but nothing really unnerving and the under-the-breath comments were exactly what any pool player would expect to hear. Usually self-talk and a few snide comments when things don't go well for one player after an extended amount of time.
 
Now that's what I'm talking about. Well said, Neil! I agree with you 100 percent. Gosh, maybe there's hope for pool's survival in the States after all. You actually have hit the nail on the head. :cool:

USA, all the way!

Thanks for the read! :smile:
 
Neil,

Agree with you across the board. FYI, Dennis' dad passed away many years ago. From my point of view, both act(ed) childishly. Not the first time for either. Seen it up close way too many times playing on the Joss Tour. As far as underestimating Mike's ability, played Dennis in Syracuse a few weeks ago. Even when I took the lead at six to five, he continued to send and receive text messages. Didn't say anything to him as it was visibly affecting his game. I want to win too! Anyway, thanks for sharing your thoughts with the forum.

Lyn
 
Neil said:
Someone isn't professional, not because of their play, but because they have some trait you don't happen to like, is B.S. of the first order.
Click to expand...



Have to agree with pretty much all you said except for this part ^^^^


You can be a character and still show respect for your opponent. Sure you can joke around make fun of yourself (and only yourself) to be entertaining but this is total BS... Im not saying you have to be a saint or sit there and never say anything but check your ego at the door. Belly up and play and STFU!!! Simple as that. Entertainment??? PIFT!!!! If I wanted to go to a circus I would call Blacked-Balled not watch a TAR match!!!

Straight shark moves is just disgraceful and a pathetic tactic to throw yoru opponent off. Therefore this MOVE falls into the cheating category.

If you like that type of crap than fine you go right on supporting the sludge that cripples our sport. I think it complete and utter shite and I have no room for people that act in this matter. Maybe they should all were diapers and suck on pacifiers!!!

I took down a really nice post I put on Mike's FB wall because I felt like I was deceived about who or what he was all about. Shame really because I had high hopes of seeing something great. Too bad he screwed that up!!
rolleyes.gif
 
Neil said:
I have to say, I am rather disappointed in the forums response to TAR 25. Not just disappointed, but somewhat baffled by the responses to the match. I didn't get to watch the match, wish I could have. The updates on the match were next to non-existent. Wonder why that is??

Then, I read a lot of posts about the match. Strangely enough, all were about one of two things- a possible bad hit, or the two players acting unprofessional. What, are a number of people on here ticked off because they bet on the wrong guy to win?? I can't help but wonder just WHY some of you bothered to watch it in the first place?? For entertainment value?? Well, then why complain, sure seems like you were entertained. What is up with all this nonsense about them not acting like pros?? What, you want them to just sit there like Soquet does, and you find that entertaining??

First off, this wasn't even a pro match. It was a money matchup between two pros. Why are they pros? Because they are that blame good at the game. Seems like that is exactly why they were given this opportunity and a lot of others will never get the chance to play there. So, are you watching for the so called professional attitude, or are you watching for the professional caliber of play??

If you actually watched it for the caliber of play, then why hasn't there been a single comment that I can find about the actual games on here? Where there no great outs? No great safes? Nothing at all that surprised anyone in pattern play?? Nothing at all pool worthy of even mentioning on a pool forum??

Why all the talk about them not acting professional?? Really, who gives a rip how they acted?? Some are saying they couldn't watch anymore because one of the players actually was talking! Really? Do some of you even play out in the real world anymore? Guys talking is the least of the problems one has to face out there anymore.

Really, all you guys can talk about is how they dress and act?? You wonder why pool will never make it big, look no farther than yourselves, the fan base. You don't even care about how the game is played, just how the actors talk, act, and dress. What entertainment do you possibly find in a couple of guys wearing a tuxedo and being mute? What's next, at every players meeting the players have to sign a form verifying that they have read a manual on etiquette?? Apparently many of you have never seen the likes of Keith McCready at a table. Now, THAT is entertainment!

As to Dennis, and I really hope you are reading this- Shame on you! You were a road player for many years, you have a ton of experience. Yet you allowed yourself to fall for the oldest tricks in the book?? Come on man, you deserve to get slapped in the back of the head by your dad for what you did!

First off, you underestimated your opponent. Doing that, you lost day one. Day two, you used your experience to win. Day 3, head totally up your rear! You once again underestimated Mike because you won day two, and to top it off, you committed the cardinal sin of a road player...you actually let Mike get into your head! With all your experience, how on earth did you fall for that one???? You actually let him make you mad KNOWING it would affect your game.??? For THAT, yeah, you deserved to lose. You know better than that! Yeah, it stings like crazy, but now all you can do is learn from it and go back to your roots.

I imagine that if Mike were to take you up on your offer, he wouldn't like it. But....ONLY if you actually USE your experience and don't act like you are green at this stuff.

Back to the forum members... when I first started playing, it was in the room in Va. Beach where Lassiter would practice from time to time. Don't have a clue of the name of the place, but the counter guy was the ref at a number of Lassiters exhibitions. Ten foot tables, and if you talked above a whisper, you were asked to please leave. All you heard in the place was the click of the balls. Fast forward to today. Music so loud you have to shout to talk to the person next to you. Balls flying all over the place, people running into you, waitresses asking you if you want anything while you are down shooting the case 9 ball.

It's a different world out there today. I have had a tough time dealing with it. I like the quiet atmosphere myself. But, saying no talking allowed, have to wear a certain type of clothes because some snob doesn't happen to like the clothes I like to wear, can't smoke when I want to, ect, it's all things we have to adapt to. To say something or someone isn't professional, not because of their play, but because they have some trait you don't happen to like, is B.S. of the first order.

You guys say you don't like to watch Soguet because he's too boring. Then, when you get something a little different, you complain because they aren't boring enough. Sheesh. Make up your minds already! Some of you sound like a bunch of old hens at the fence chatting away saying nothing of substance.
Click to expand...

Excellent post, I enjoyed reading your thoughts on this.
 
Neil said:
What entertainment do you possibly find in a couple of guys wearing a tuxedo and being mute?
Click to expand...

Ten million people here in the UK are just about to settle down to the final session of the World Snooker Championships.

ps you don't want it loud, you don't want it quiet - what DO you want?
 
Neil said:
Why all the talk about them not acting professional?? Really, who gives a rip how they acted??
Click to expand...

Really? Sorry but no, I am going to go against the grain of all the high fives on this thread and say no, there is a limit to how people should act in professional pool, and this WAS professional pool. Neither player put up a stake in this, it was an invite that was 100% paid for by TAR and both players disrespected the game, the opportunity that was offered to them, and the people who made it possible (TAR). It is "not" OK any more then it is OK when Earl does his antics.

Neil said:
You wonder why pool will never make it big, look no farther than yourselves, the fan base. You don't even care about how the game is played, just how the actors talk, act, and dress.
Click to expand...

If anything the threads say the COMPLETE opposite of what you state there. People DO care and you simply want to attempt to act as if they don't.

Neil said:
What entertainment do you possibly find in a couple of guys wearing a tuxedo and being mute?
Click to expand...

What is it I am finding entertaining about watching the World Snooker Championship finals between Ronnie O'Sullivan who was considered over the hill in his career and wrote off as never again being likely to win a worlds? What is it I find interesting about watching Dennis Orcullo play SVB in the finals of the Hardtimes shooting phenomenal pool while SVB sits quietly in his chair waiting for his chance? If you need to ask that is actually pretty sad Neil. What do YOU watch pool for? Simply the drama and not the game played? Did you find the match between Dennis and SVB boring?
 
If you want to be called a pro and paid like one ACT like one. Dennis shot himself in the foot for future matches with TAR and Mike should feel lucky if he gets to play again.

If you can't act like a pro don't expect to get treated like one. Time to grow up boys.
 
TheThaiger said:
Ten million people here in the UK are just about to settle down to the final session of the World Snooker Championships.

ps you don't want it loud, you don't want it quiet - what DO you want?
Click to expand...

Some of us poor yanks are watching, too. I quite enjoy the way they go sit down and shut up when they miss. Personally, I prefer the quiet version.

Plus, the crowd (yes, crowd. they draw crowds over there) actually knows when to clap and/or cheer.

-s

/starts in 15 minutes, Ronnie's up 15-10
 
Niel, I was the OP of the SHARKING post and I stand by it. No I didn't bet wrong, I bet on Mike. All the crap about loud music, cloths, balls flying, waitreses asking for drink orders has nothing to do what the thread was about. Altough I loved to play in those old bucket of blood places. It's about SHARKING. IMO sharking is cheating. If you distract the other player while he's shooting to win a game or a match you cheated. I have never heard someone say about a player, "He's the best sharker in the country. His sharking makes him a ball better than Joe Blow." Johnnyt
 
Neil said:
[...]
Really, all you guys can talk about is how they dress and act?? You wonder why pool will never make it big, look no farther than yourselves, the fan base. You don't even care about how the game is played, just how the actors talk, act, and dress. What entertainment do you possibly find in a couple of guys wearing a tuxedo and being mute? What's next, at every players meeting the players have to sign a form verifying that they have read a manual on etiquette?? Apparently many of you have never seen the likes of Keith McCready at a table. Now, THAT is entertainment!
[...]
Click to expand...

Neil:

Good post. A little over the top on the exaggeration factor, but you shared your thoughts well -- whether people generally agree with them or not.

However, I had to respond to the bolded part above. I can't help but think what you wrote was a dig at Justin, specifically for this post of his:

JCIN said:
Looks like my whole "Treat these guys like professionals, expect them to act like it and dont treat them like children" theory didnt work out so well this weekend. Yeah I am that dumb.

One thing I know for certain there will be a contract written for all future matches. In that contract will be rules of conduct backed up by fines. I dont mind guys showing emotion in the heat of the moment but tonight was just stupid and I let both guys know it. The thing is I dont think either one really understands what they did wrong. I like both guys personally but the jury is out on if either one will be back. Lot of that will depend on the feelings of the people who watched and especially the sponsors.

End of the day its my fault. I keep trying like hell to want to believe that if you do the best you can to treat people like pro's they will act like it. Doesnt seem to work out that way though.

I apologize to anyone who was offended or annoyed by the conduct. I know at several points I certainly was. I guess really disappointed is the best way to put it. Thank you to everyone who did support the match. It was a success and validated the new format to us. All the nonsense from TAR 25 will be sorted out and changes made. Thanks to the people who are behind us we can focus on things like the US Open 1Pocket and 10 Ball events next week as well as TAR 26 with Shane and Johnny at the end of the month. The ride gets rocky at times but I cant thank everyone enough for going along with us on the journey.
Click to expand...

There *are* certain expectations of proper behavior on the part of the participants. What folks are complaining about, and what you're trying to compare to (i.e. Keith McCready) are two totally different things. There's a big difference -- no, make that a HUGE difference -- between the boisterous woofing of a Keith McCready (that adds to the entertainment), versus nit-picking about shots and in general opportunistically causing delays with gratuitous whining. But then again, that's the patented Neil exaggeration factor to make a point. ;)

I don't think it's unreasonable to set expectations about proper behavior before a match begins. I, for one, wish Scott Smith were back, because he wouldn't put up with this crap. With Scott, if you caused delays with the rack or disputing a shot or whatever, you got one warning. Just one. After that, you paid the price -- right on the spot -- with a bead slid over to your opponent's side. And Scott would dare you to open your mouth again! This is the type of control that needs to be exercised in these matches -- whether one-on-one challenge matches, or full-blown tourneys. I don't think Justin's unreasonable for suddenly realizing the need for this, so, IMHO, I think your sarcasm towards him is a little uncalled-for.

-Sean
 
Neil said:
First off, you underestimated your opponent. Doing that, you lost day one. Day two, you used your experience to win. Day 3, head totally up your rear! You once again underestimated Mike because you won day two, and to top it off, you committed the cardinal sin of a road player...you actually let Mike get into your head! With all your experience, how on earth did you fall for that one???? You actually let him make you mad KNOWING it would affect your game.??? For THAT, yeah, you deserved to lose. You know better than that! Yeah, it stings like crazy, but now all you can do is learn from it and go back to your roots.
Click to expand...

Neil, here's a suggestion ... If you are going to do commentary on a match, you should at least watch it first.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top