Maybe he should have sent Mark Trainer to negotiate for him. 
Tell 'em like it is, Alex!
- Thread starter JAM
- Start date
Behind Alex. But he really should get some good representation for himself. I don't know why these players aren't getting publicists and trying to get names for themselves... everyone is hoping for their game is going to be enough to get them famous in pool... it's not going to happen, the best player in the world isn't very famous here in the states.
I feel that just about every aspect of pool is just ran so poorly. Every person behind a pool organization seems to be some Joe-shmo -- not necessarily an idiot, but I don't see any really bright minds behind anything. I could be dead wrong, I don't know everyone -- but from what I see that's my stand.... I get so sick thinking of the potential of the sport, and where it is.
I feel that just about every aspect of pool is just ran so poorly. Every person behind a pool organization seems to be some Joe-shmo -- not necessarily an idiot, but I don't see any really bright minds behind anything. I could be dead wrong, I don't know everyone -- but from what I see that's my stand.... I get so sick thinking of the potential of the sport, and where it is.
<< BSCP president Ernesto Fajardo told Viva Sports/Manila Standard Today that Pagulayan was replaced because he was ?clowning around too much in the semi finals of the Singapore leg? of the tour. >>
what a LAME excuse! I think it even helps the sport more exciting to the viewers...
what a LAME excuse! I think it even helps the sport more exciting to the viewers...
Here's the BSCP's response regarding Alex' allegations:
BSCP Responds To Pagulayan?s Allegations
The Billiards & Snooker Congress of the Philippines has responded to the allegations of 2004 World Pool Champion and former US Open Champion Alex ?The Lion? Pagulayan that the organization got back at him and replaced him for the Shanghai leg of the Guinness 9-Ball Tour because he had refused to participate in a local TV pool show claiming the producers were going to make money by using his talent but were not prepared to pay him.
The BSCP stated that Pagulayan was replaced after a review of his conduct during his semi final match against Ibrahim Amir of Malaysia in the Singapore leg last July 15 when Pagulayan lost a close match 11-13 and not for any other reason.
In an official statement sent to Viva Sports/Manila Standard Today which reported the allegations of Pagulayan on AZ Billiards , the BSCP said it found Pagulayan?s actuations during the match ?unworthy and unacceptable for a representative of a country that is regarded today as ?the epicenter of pool. His antics amounted to ?sharking? ? the pool term for acts to disrupt and disarm one?s opponent in order to win. So gross were his actions that in the end Ibrahim repaid him in kind.?
The BSCP said it believes that Pagulayan?s behavior demanded ?at the very least that he no longer be sent to the tournament that he had disrespected. His presence in Shanghai would only serve to remind our Asian neighbors of his behavior.? Because of this the BSCP executive committee and the board of directors decided to replace Pagulayan with Jeffrey de Luna who, the BSCP claimed, was a Filipino player ?much prized by the tour organizers.?
The BSCP stated that playing in the Guinness Tour ?is a privilege not a right? and it was the sports body?s policy to ?choose players who can do honor for our country and our sport and allocate spots as fairly as possible.? It noted that Pagulayan was accorded the privilege in two of the four legs but both times he failed and it is ?doubly unfortunate that he did not play and lose with grace.?
The claim that he was replaced because he refused to play in a TV program was branded as ?false? and the supposed meeting and the supposed invitation alluded to by Pagulayan ?never took place.? The BSCP conceded that there was an attempt to arrange a meeting with him but Pagulayan said he could not talk until he returned from a tournament in Cebu. The BSCP said it was clear that Pagulayan did not know what they wanted to discuss which included his Singapore behavior and the billiards program among others, adding ?we did not hear of his mercenary demands.?
The BSCP branded as ?bewildering? Pagulayan?s statement about being used to make money off him on the TV show pointing out that in the two BSCP national championships Pagulayan participated in, neither the sports body nor the promoter made money adding that ?this charge of exploitation is both absurd and incredibly ungrateful for someone who earned over a million pesos from our billiards program.?
Citing future programs which include the 2007 World Pool Championships, the San Miguel Beer Asia-Pacific 10-Ball Pool Tour, the 2008 WPA World 10-Ball Championship, the Philippine Pool Tour and the Pool Showdown, a reality TV show the statement made it clear that the BSCP and the promoters will not offer money guarantees ?to any player no matter how inflated his ego.? It concluded by saying that ?it would be unfortunate, given Pagulayan?s mercenary demands, if he will miss these major pool events.?
BSCP Responds To Pagulayan?s Allegations
The Billiards & Snooker Congress of the Philippines has responded to the allegations of 2004 World Pool Champion and former US Open Champion Alex ?The Lion? Pagulayan that the organization got back at him and replaced him for the Shanghai leg of the Guinness 9-Ball Tour because he had refused to participate in a local TV pool show claiming the producers were going to make money by using his talent but were not prepared to pay him.
The BSCP stated that Pagulayan was replaced after a review of his conduct during his semi final match against Ibrahim Amir of Malaysia in the Singapore leg last July 15 when Pagulayan lost a close match 11-13 and not for any other reason.
In an official statement sent to Viva Sports/Manila Standard Today which reported the allegations of Pagulayan on AZ Billiards , the BSCP said it found Pagulayan?s actuations during the match ?unworthy and unacceptable for a representative of a country that is regarded today as ?the epicenter of pool. His antics amounted to ?sharking? ? the pool term for acts to disrupt and disarm one?s opponent in order to win. So gross were his actions that in the end Ibrahim repaid him in kind.?
The BSCP said it believes that Pagulayan?s behavior demanded ?at the very least that he no longer be sent to the tournament that he had disrespected. His presence in Shanghai would only serve to remind our Asian neighbors of his behavior.? Because of this the BSCP executive committee and the board of directors decided to replace Pagulayan with Jeffrey de Luna who, the BSCP claimed, was a Filipino player ?much prized by the tour organizers.?
The BSCP stated that playing in the Guinness Tour ?is a privilege not a right? and it was the sports body?s policy to ?choose players who can do honor for our country and our sport and allocate spots as fairly as possible.? It noted that Pagulayan was accorded the privilege in two of the four legs but both times he failed and it is ?doubly unfortunate that he did not play and lose with grace.?
The claim that he was replaced because he refused to play in a TV program was branded as ?false? and the supposed meeting and the supposed invitation alluded to by Pagulayan ?never took place.? The BSCP conceded that there was an attempt to arrange a meeting with him but Pagulayan said he could not talk until he returned from a tournament in Cebu. The BSCP said it was clear that Pagulayan did not know what they wanted to discuss which included his Singapore behavior and the billiards program among others, adding ?we did not hear of his mercenary demands.?
The BSCP branded as ?bewildering? Pagulayan?s statement about being used to make money off him on the TV show pointing out that in the two BSCP national championships Pagulayan participated in, neither the sports body nor the promoter made money adding that ?this charge of exploitation is both absurd and incredibly ungrateful for someone who earned over a million pesos from our billiards program.?
Citing future programs which include the 2007 World Pool Championships, the San Miguel Beer Asia-Pacific 10-Ball Pool Tour, the 2008 WPA World 10-Ball Championship, the Philippine Pool Tour and the Pool Showdown, a reality TV show the statement made it clear that the BSCP and the promoters will not offer money guarantees ?to any player no matter how inflated his ego.? It concluded by saying that ?it would be unfortunate, given Pagulayan?s mercenary demands, if he will miss these major pool events.?
BSCP Official Statement
The Official Statement as released to the press here locally. (and since I've been busy with non-billiard stuff, had no clue what was going on till the news broke)
Personally, I hope this gets resolved soon.
****
BSCP STATEMENT ON ALEX PAGULAYAN?S CASE
29 July 2007
Last Thursday, July 26, the Billiards & Snooker Congress of the Philippines, through its Executive Committee and Board of Directors, decided to withdraw the name of Alex Pagulayan as Filipino participant from the Shanghai Leg of the Guinness Pool Tour on August 3-5.
That decision was made after a review of Pagulayan?s conduct during his semifinal match with Malaysia?s Ibrahim Amir in the Singapore Leg last July 13-15. We found his actuations during the match unworthy and unacceptable for a representative of a country that is regarded today as ?the epicenter of international pool.? His antics amounted to ?sharking? ? the pool term for acts to disrupt and disarm one?s opponent in order to win. So gross were his actions that in the end, Ibrahim repaid him in kind. To many, including not a few Filipinos, it seemed only just that the Malaysian won the match.
The BSCP believes that Pagulayan?s behavior demanded at the very least that he no longer be sent to the tournament that he had disrespected. His presence in Shanghai would only serve to remind our Asian neighbors of his behavior. Hence, the decision to replace him with Jeffrey de Luna, a Filipino player much prized by the tour organizers.
Playing in the Guinness Tour is a privilege, not a right. It is our sports body?s policy to choose players who can do honor for our country and our sport, and allocate slots as fairly as possible. Two times out of four legs, Pagulayan was accorded the privilege; both times he failed. And it is doubly unfortunate that he did not play and lose with grace.
With respect to the wild statements that Pagulayan has made to the media following his recall, we have this to say:
1. His claim that he was being replaced as Philippine representative in the Guinness Tour because he refused to play in a TV program is false. The supposed meeting he alludes to ? and the supposed invitation made to him ? never took place. There was an attempt to arrange a meeting with him, but he said he could not talk until he came back from Cebu on July 28. So he does not know what we wanted to discuss with him (his Singapore behavior and our billiards program, among others), and we did not hear any of his mercenary demands.
2. His claim that he sacrificed a place in the International Pool Tour (IPT) in 2005 for the sake of playing for the Philippines in the Southeast Asian Games is a lie. He was not invited to the IPT then. He only became an IPT member in 2006. When he became an IPT member, he promptly told the BSCP that he would not play for the country in the Asian Games in Doha in 2006. Later, he dangled the possibility of playing if he would be given money. The money request was turned down.
3. His statement about being used by BSCP in order to make money off him is bewildering. In the two BSCP national championship events he participated in, neither the sports body nor the promoter made any money. We do our utmost to find sponsors and benefactors to sustain major events in the country, but so far income has not been enough to cover costs. So this charge of exploitation is both absurd and incredibly ungrateful for someone who has earned over a million pesos from our billiards program.
That program continues with the 2007 and 2008 World Pool Championship, the San Miguel Asia-Pacific Pool Tour, the 2008 WPA World 10-Ball Championship, the Philippine Pool Tour, and Pool Showdown, a reality TV show. In all these, the format is always competitive pool. The BSCP and the promoters will not offer money guarantees to any player, no matter how inflated his ego. It would be unfortunate, given Pagulayan?s mercenary demands, if he will miss these major pool events in the international pool calendar.
The Official Statement as released to the press here locally. (and since I've been busy with non-billiard stuff, had no clue what was going on till the news broke)
Personally, I hope this gets resolved soon.
****
BSCP STATEMENT ON ALEX PAGULAYAN?S CASE
29 July 2007
Last Thursday, July 26, the Billiards & Snooker Congress of the Philippines, through its Executive Committee and Board of Directors, decided to withdraw the name of Alex Pagulayan as Filipino participant from the Shanghai Leg of the Guinness Pool Tour on August 3-5.
That decision was made after a review of Pagulayan?s conduct during his semifinal match with Malaysia?s Ibrahim Amir in the Singapore Leg last July 13-15. We found his actuations during the match unworthy and unacceptable for a representative of a country that is regarded today as ?the epicenter of international pool.? His antics amounted to ?sharking? ? the pool term for acts to disrupt and disarm one?s opponent in order to win. So gross were his actions that in the end, Ibrahim repaid him in kind. To many, including not a few Filipinos, it seemed only just that the Malaysian won the match.
The BSCP believes that Pagulayan?s behavior demanded at the very least that he no longer be sent to the tournament that he had disrespected. His presence in Shanghai would only serve to remind our Asian neighbors of his behavior. Hence, the decision to replace him with Jeffrey de Luna, a Filipino player much prized by the tour organizers.
Playing in the Guinness Tour is a privilege, not a right. It is our sports body?s policy to choose players who can do honor for our country and our sport, and allocate slots as fairly as possible. Two times out of four legs, Pagulayan was accorded the privilege; both times he failed. And it is doubly unfortunate that he did not play and lose with grace.
With respect to the wild statements that Pagulayan has made to the media following his recall, we have this to say:
1. His claim that he was being replaced as Philippine representative in the Guinness Tour because he refused to play in a TV program is false. The supposed meeting he alludes to ? and the supposed invitation made to him ? never took place. There was an attempt to arrange a meeting with him, but he said he could not talk until he came back from Cebu on July 28. So he does not know what we wanted to discuss with him (his Singapore behavior and our billiards program, among others), and we did not hear any of his mercenary demands.
2. His claim that he sacrificed a place in the International Pool Tour (IPT) in 2005 for the sake of playing for the Philippines in the Southeast Asian Games is a lie. He was not invited to the IPT then. He only became an IPT member in 2006. When he became an IPT member, he promptly told the BSCP that he would not play for the country in the Asian Games in Doha in 2006. Later, he dangled the possibility of playing if he would be given money. The money request was turned down.
3. His statement about being used by BSCP in order to make money off him is bewildering. In the two BSCP national championship events he participated in, neither the sports body nor the promoter made any money. We do our utmost to find sponsors and benefactors to sustain major events in the country, but so far income has not been enough to cover costs. So this charge of exploitation is both absurd and incredibly ungrateful for someone who has earned over a million pesos from our billiards program.
That program continues with the 2007 and 2008 World Pool Championship, the San Miguel Asia-Pacific Pool Tour, the 2008 WPA World 10-Ball Championship, the Philippine Pool Tour, and Pool Showdown, a reality TV show. In all these, the format is always competitive pool. The BSCP and the promoters will not offer money guarantees to any player, no matter how inflated his ego. It would be unfortunate, given Pagulayan?s mercenary demands, if he will miss these major pool events in the international pool calendar.
The BSCP releases this statement AFTER Alex Pagulayan goes public, and in order to save face for their decision to take him off the four-man Team Philippines, they come up with this lame excuse that Alex disrespected the sport and doesn't lose gracefully.
I say hogwash. Show me the proof. Where is the video where Alex disrespected the sport and did not lose gracefully? They come with these allegations AFTER they dismissed Alex.
When they phoned Alex to talk to him initially, why didn't they tell him that they were going to can him then? They waited until right before the event, and Alex's monies he invested to go to this tournament are lost. Alex is stuck big time financially. The whole thing looks like a conspiracy to alienate Alex Pagulayan because they were angry with him going public.
I stand by Alex Pagulayan on this one.
JAM
I say hogwash. Show me the proof. Where is the video where Alex disrespected the sport and did not lose gracefully? They come with these allegations AFTER they dismissed Alex.
When they phoned Alex to talk to him initially, why didn't they tell him that they were going to can him then? They waited until right before the event, and Alex's monies he invested to go to this tournament are lost. Alex is stuck big time financially. The whole thing looks like a conspiracy to alienate Alex Pagulayan because they were angry with him going public.
I stand by Alex Pagulayan on this one.
JAM
1. I stand by Alex.
2. Alex needs a manager
3. Alex is replaced by an other entertainer, so I just say, go Jeffrey De Tuna! Ehh, Luna...
2. Alex needs a manager
3. Alex is replaced by an other entertainer, so I just say, go Jeffrey De Tuna! Ehh, Luna...
Ooops, double-post.
Why does the double-posting happening? Have happened to a lot of posters recently, it didn't happen before, did it?
Why does the double-posting happening? Have happened to a lot of posters recently, it didn't happen before, did it?
I agree
The one responding always looks like sour grapes and covering their butt however in this case I fully agree with you. I have seen Alex lose and I have seen him win and I have never seen him behave inappropriately. I'd also have to see him deliberately sharking on tape to believe it.
Looks like Alex will have to suck it up and make nice with these folks if he wants to play in their events but I do think it stinks.
Hu
The one responding always looks like sour grapes and covering their butt however in this case I fully agree with you. I have seen Alex lose and I have seen him win and I have never seen him behave inappropriately. I'd also have to see him deliberately sharking on tape to believe it.
Looks like Alex will have to suck it up and make nice with these folks if he wants to play in their events but I do think it stinks.
Hu
JAM said:
ShootingArts said:
I have seen Alex win and lose. The two times I saw him lose up front and close, he was a perfect gentleman after the match. Nobody likes to lose, but I have never seen Alex behave in a manner that the BSCP is portraying with their press release. It just doesn't sound like the Alex Pagulayan that I know. I cannot imagine him "disrespecting the sport," and as far as losing, he never holds a grudge. Five minutes later after a loss, he's in fine spirits, even joking around with the person who just beat him.
Maybe Alex should reconsider which country he wants to represent. Then again, this organization isn't the only pool organization in the Philippines. Alex is a WPC champion, and he is heralded around the world as a very accomplished pool player. The BSCP has just stained the sport for their country by the way they handled this situation.ShootingArts said:
Though I know Alex is very proud of his Filipino heritage, he would be welcome in any country. They would consider it lucky to have a player like Alex Pagulayan on their team, even here in the United States. Come to America, Alex. USA, all the way! Alex Pagulayan is definitely one of the good guys!
JAM
JAM said:
Totally agree with Jen. I was watching the said game between Alex and Bin
Ahmir via Sopcast/TVU and that was the best 3 hours of pool I have seen!
The audience was predominantly on Alex' side because they want to see
more of Alex in action.
I hope that Guinness will sign Alex next year to play in all legs. They have
all the power to do this, just like what they did to Alcano, who's in it in
every leg, even though he kept getting himself eliminated in the group stages.
That will be a big slap in the face for BSCP...
I totally agree with Alex. Why shouldn't he be compensated for his expenses? This is just more bad publicity for pool and it's a shame that the BSCP decided to remove one of the best players in the world from the 4 man Philippine team because he asked for some expense money!JAM said:
Come to the United States, Alex, where you are loved and appreciated.
I can see the Mosconi Cup now. Team America consisting of Alex Pagulayan, WPC Champion.
Any country in the world would be proud to have Alex Pagulayan representing them.
Shame on the BSCP for insulting one of the best players in the world, and doing so without proof-positive evidence and presenting vague descriptions of what they perceive as Alex's behavior. This is a sham job here by the BSCP.
I don't believe the BSCP press release one bit.
JAM
I can see the Mosconi Cup now. Team America consisting of Alex Pagulayan, WPC Champion.
Any country in the world would be proud to have Alex Pagulayan representing them.
Shame on the BSCP for insulting one of the best players in the world, and doing so without proof-positive evidence and presenting vague descriptions of what they perceive as Alex's behavior. This is a sham job here by the BSCP.
I don't believe the BSCP press release one bit.
JAM
They have been robbing the players for years, just say "NO MORE". Way to go "A"(Alex). These people really think we are stupid, well guess what "NO MORE". I can't believe that he even has to pay to get there, thats incredible. Yeaa, why not. Pay everything, and don't get paid. Well you know what, you cant kick everyone out, without these great players you have nothing......So lets start paying these guys for there exceptional talent that they have.
"NO MORE"
"NO MORE"
I am sick
I am watching the Pro Angler Tour, guess what first place is???? $125 big numbers. I have been playin quit some time now, I'm not a monster, but I can hold my own. 125 for fishing???????? Something's wrong in the Billiards World.
I am watching the Pro Angler Tour, guess what first place is???? $125 big numbers. I have been playin quit some time now, I'm not a monster, but I can hold my own. 125 for fishing???????? Something's wrong in the Billiards World.
frankwhite said:
Yeah. I'll bet that hot-dog eating champion makes more money than pool players. He's already got MasterCard and beer commercials on TV.
This organization has slapped Alex Pagulayan in his face by stating that he loses disgracefully and should not represent Philippines. The nerve of them. I say boycott the whole organization, and everybody should be writing letters of support for Alex to the sponsor.
Alex Pagulayan deserves some respect, and this organization prevented Alex Pagulayan from making a living. He could have competed in other events if the BCSP had notified him well in advance of this tournament. They waited to the last minute to tell him he wasn't going to represent the Philippines and then disgraced Alex in a public manner. Shame on them. Shame, I say!
JAM