It matters to him, because he bet SVB -3.
He loses $50, and suddenly, SVB has no killer instinct.:thumbup:
The USA and a complete lack of killer instinct.
- Thread starter Celtic
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It matters to him, because he bet SVB -3.
He loses $50, and suddenly, SVB has no killer instinct.:thumbup:
I have seen Shane absolutely fvck pound (Big Nasty Trademark term) world champions in tournament sets. Also seen him lose tournament matches to people he "should" beat. I can say the exact same thing for every top payer. Anyone with any sense knows thats just how it goes.
I wonder what people will pick apart about Shane when he wins a world title?
"That dude is just too nice. I can't stand it. Its total bullshit."
"Ok so he has three opens, a world title and a truck load of other wins but he just cant win a 14.1 event."
"Sure he is a great player but he can't beat every player in Taiwan, China and Mongolia without losing."
I wonder what people will pick apart about Shane when he wins a world title?
"That dude is just too nice. I can't stand it. Its total bullshit."
"Ok so he has three opens, a world title and a truck load of other wins but he just cant win a 14.1 event."
"Sure he is a great player but he can't beat every player in Taiwan, China and Mongolia without losing."
tHIS GAME IS EASY FROM THE CHEAP SEATS AND HAVING NEVER BEEN THERE.
He does not have to play at HIS place over here. Or his game.
Both of their games are 10 ball. They just have inferior equipment there for the most part. HUGE pockets, and super SPEED cloth. Makes pool pretty simple and can make you let your guard down.
There's no one player on this earth, that's beating SVB day in day out playing 10 ball. It does not matter what the races are if he's playing that person multiple sets. I'd prefer a super neutral location, with no stream. Just play pool as SVB says
Like I said, you mentioned this, why not step up and stake some of them. ?????
I like how you internet guys never get involved, in anything.
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I think it's a shame to see Celtic kind of being shouted down in this thread, as he raises some very valid points.
It seems sometimes that you aren't (in the eyes of many) allowed to criticise SVB on here in the way you are allowed to with other players.
Is he a great player? Of course. Does he beat anyone in the world playing a long set of ten-ball? Most likely yes. Is he one of the best players in the world? Definitely. Does he lack a certain killer instinct compared to other elite players? I think he does.
And as Celtic has pointed out, it's not just SVB he's referring to. It's something you notice a lot with American players in general. It's not a massive difference between them and their Asian or European counterparts, but it is there.
I wonder how much it has to do with the American attitude to short races sometimes. You see it on here, where people claim they aren't a true test of skill, and how it's all about who does best in the marathon sets that determines who the best really is. If you have thoughts like that in your head when you're up 7-1 and your opponent is closing the gap on you, you're basically giving yourself a chance to lose and still feel okay about it.
I don't know, I think it's a conversation worth having. Others may disagree.
It seems sometimes that you aren't (in the eyes of many) allowed to criticise SVB on here in the way you are allowed to with other players.
Is he a great player? Of course. Does he beat anyone in the world playing a long set of ten-ball? Most likely yes. Is he one of the best players in the world? Definitely. Does he lack a certain killer instinct compared to other elite players? I think he does.
And as Celtic has pointed out, it's not just SVB he's referring to. It's something you notice a lot with American players in general. It's not a massive difference between them and their Asian or European counterparts, but it is there.
I wonder how much it has to do with the American attitude to short races sometimes. You see it on here, where people claim they aren't a true test of skill, and how it's all about who does best in the marathon sets that determines who the best really is. If you have thoughts like that in your head when you're up 7-1 and your opponent is closing the gap on you, you're basically giving yourself a chance to lose and still feel okay about it.
I don't know, I think it's a conversation worth having. Others may disagree.
You can bash him. Of course he hasn't won over there. But he handily wins the big ones here. Can you name anyone from overseas that's been coming over here winning? ANYONE.
You think something like jet lag and all that come into play ever?
You can't say Thorsten, DAZ, Mika, those guys LIVE here the majority of the year. They are not traveling over here winning events. The only ones traveling overseas anywhere consistently winning is the same ones that's been doing it forever. THE PINOYS.
Who's bashing anybody?
You said your not allowed to criticize SVB like others. I don't see why not. I will critique anyone of them. If they don't like the facts who cares.
I've critiqued SVB before plenty, on his wild casino habits. As has others. Then some say who cares it's his money. Yes it is. He can do as he pleases.
I'm just saying the short racks overseas thing is not something to really criticize him on, because no one from over there comes here and wins either.and outside of SVB, there is no other American pro that's an elite player. NOONE. PERIOD
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Everyone's ability to judge and evaluate is limited by the depth of knowledge he or she has. SVB record speaks for itself, in SVB mind he calculates risk based on his experience he has confidence in his ability, this is pool, luck is a factor too. I bet $100 he will dismantle Busty tonight, not sure about Niels though, we know Ralf is not going to make it unless pool God interveens
no comments on SVB/Morra match tonight.
but i will point out, in general, that i observed @ the EUROs -
SOUQUET was down by wha - ? Saturday? and is now in the semi finals after last night.
FEIJEN beat who - ? at neck & neck for 3 hrs? (oh, that would be EFREN REYES) and is now in the semi finals. (massive upset!)
these Euros "got down on it" & persevered. robots. killer instinct!
but i will point out, in general, that i observed @ the EUROs -
SOUQUET was down by wha - ? Saturday? and is now in the semi finals after last night.
FEIJEN beat who - ? at neck & neck for 3 hrs? (oh, that would be EFREN REYES) and is now in the semi finals. (massive upset!)
these Euros "got down on it" & persevered. robots. killer instinct!
But wait, what about this MATCH?
Carlo ends up winning, but he was up 6-1 (in a race to 9), and Shane came back to lose double hill.
I guess Carlo also lacks killer instinct.
The thread is stupid because it singles out one player. It's stupid because it was only made because Celtic lost a bet. If Shane was up 6-1, and ended up winning 11-7, this thread would never have been made. There isn't a player alive that closes out every single set when they get off to a head start.
I like most of Celtic's posts, but I don't think he realizes that a 6-1 lead (going to 11), is NOT a big lead.
I kind of think it's unfair to compare US players to the Asian and Euro players. The Euro's and Asian players are backed by their governments, given stipends and have coaches. That might have something to do with that lack of "killer instinct" or what could be considered lack of consistency. Some of the US players mentioned are in school, work a full time job, run businesses etc.
It takes a serious lack of killer instinct to win multiple US Opens, every pro agrees with this no?
And agreed, this thread was stupid.
No, Jaden up there said I was choked the Canadian kid lost and that was the reason for the thread...?
Obviously that bet is a part of the thing, but it is not the first match that type of thing has happened in this Bigfoot and it is simply a sign of issues in the game.
People who would ask "who cares how he got there" when it comes to a win. Do you also agree that not practicing with the same focus and control that you plan to compete with? When you mess around in matches like this and barely squeak out a win how does that affect the times when you are playing in a tough match in the world 10-ball championships and you are up on Wu 7-1. You let off on him and suddenly you never get back to the table and you have now lost 13-7. It happens, hell Kou in the finals kept the pressure on and lost from up 16-12 because he never got back to the table after hitting the hill.
People who think it "does not matter" are not aware of WHY a guy like Mosconi completely dominated the sport for so long and was champion for such a long period. He was known to demolish players every chance he got, if he could beat you 150 to -1 he would do it, he destroyed his opponents as badly as he could and kept a psychological edge over them that lasted decades.
That is what a top pro in any sport does. If Tiger Woods can be 10 strokes up on the next closest guy in the Masters then he DOES win by that much, he does not start screwing around and let it get close. If Nadal can win a match in Tennis 6-0 6-1 6-0 then he wins it that bad, he does not start messing around and let his opponent get close. That is the way sport should go, professional players keep the pressure on as best they are able from beginning to end, and if they don't or cannot do it then that is a problem for them. Which is why this thread exists, it clearly "is" a problem for SVB.
So in short set killer instinct do you think SVB is right at the top in that aspect of his game compared to some other world class players?
He IS one of, if not THE best pool players on this planet, but he does not seem to win too many of the tough matches 11-2, 11-1, ect... There are some elite players who can play world class players and when they are on they simply demolish them. In events in Asia in the Guinness Tour scores were normally lopsided because the player who caught a gear first usually went for the throat and ended their opponent. I simply do not see that same intensity and focus and determination to absolutely crush your opponent as badly as possible on American soil.
I don't see that in SVB, he is a guy that totally has the skills and ability from a game playing point of view to demolish opponents in normal length tournament sets, but his matches are more often then not closer then they should be, even if he still wins them. It works often, because as I have said 14,000 times he IS that good, but there IS a weakness there that keeps him from being even more dominant and I think that skill and his success have made people unable to see how he could possibly be better, but there IS even more dominance there for SVB if he was to get more killer instinct.
Did you watch that match? Have you read the thread? That match was discussed on this thread...
Biado did not "let" Ralf back into that match, Ralf TOOK that match out of Biado's hands. Biado had very little control over what happened there.
This is actually part of what I said in the initial post that some people are oblivious to. THIS is why you do not let up on people even for an instant. There are guys out there that you can be beating 7-1, you let off on them for each a instant and you can never get an open shot on a ball for the rest of the match and get yourself beat. You do not let off on people, when you have an opponent down and shooting bad you do everything possible to keep them there, make them pay for every mistake, make those nerves they have increase, make them think you are going to beat them 11-0. You do not let someone up when you have them down, you finish them.
If Biado had one moment in that match where he thought he was good and took it a little easy on Ralf and half assed a shot instead of putting his all into it and that led to Ralf baring down and getting into the gear he got into and demolishing Biado then yes, that is exactly what I am talking about. You don't want to let a person like Ralf have even a slight chance, you don't want to give that guy an inch because no matter how bad you think you are beating on him and no matter how much you think you have the match well in hand he IS dangerous.
This is the kind of thing where statistics would be able to quickly separate
anecdotal stuff, like "I got this general impression from watching 1 or 2 matches"
from actual valid and insightful observations.
You can say "Seahawks defense at home is outstanding" and there's hard numbers
to back it up. Sadly pool lacks that kind of recordkeeping.
Still, Shane vs. morra (which he won) and TAR 7 are slim evidence
that shane blows leads more than the typical player.
Pool is a game of managing your failures better than the other guy.
Like golf, it is not a game of perfect.
If Shane wins more than Wu, but Wu has a higher percentage of dominating wins,
is it really sensible to say wu's killer instinct tops shane's?
11-2 is not Standard Operating Procedure for any player or country.
It's unusual and only happens when someone has unusually strong play,
or weak play, or abnormal numbers of rolls.
anecdotal stuff, like "I got this general impression from watching 1 or 2 matches"
from actual valid and insightful observations.
You can say "Seahawks defense at home is outstanding" and there's hard numbers
to back it up. Sadly pool lacks that kind of recordkeeping.
Still, Shane vs. morra (which he won) and TAR 7 are slim evidence
that shane blows leads more than the typical player.
Pool is a game of managing your failures better than the other guy.
Like golf, it is not a game of perfect.
If Shane wins more than Wu, but Wu has a higher percentage of dominating wins,
is it really sensible to say wu's killer instinct tops shane's?
11-2 is not Standard Operating Procedure for any player or country.
It's unusual and only happens when someone has unusually strong play,
or weak play, or abnormal numbers of rolls.