tight pockets bad for pool?

[jalapus logan]

There. I said it. I love playing on my tight a$$ Diamond pro and have enjoyed shimmed gold crowns as well. All egos aside (you know the common woof: you may be able to beat me on this loose table, but let's switch to a table with 0.00025" pockets and I'll rob you...), it could benefit pool substantially in my opinion if pro tournaments were played on tables with pockets at least as large (or angle, facing specs or whatever) so as to allow for the pocketing of more balls. Straight pool high runs would increase, the number of packages in rotation based games would increase, AND SO WOULD VIEWERSHIP AND HOPEFULLY THE POPULARITY OF OUR SPORT. Let's face it, high runs and packages are sexy. Let's encourage more of them.

Now, I'm not advocating playing on tables with big buckets or anything. Rather, just a reversal of the attitude that smaller is better. Maybe specs similar to the gold crowns that Earl ran that 10 pack on back in the day. I went to the last DCC on the last day of the 9 ball event. I watched the final couple dozen players or so for about 8 hours. In all that time, I only watched one player break and run more than one rack in a row. That was Adam Smith with two b&r's in a row. That was it. And these were the best in the world. Still in the field at that time were SVB, Archer, Corteza, and too many other world class players to mention. I say let's make our sport more interesting to average, casual players by making tables play like they did 20 years ago (incorporating modern, improved design elements of course, just not super tight pockets...).

What say you all?

 

[Swede59]

agreed...............

 

[Johnnyt]

It's getting so now with some of the under 4 1/2" pockets, watching 9 or 10-ball is like watching 1-hole...everyone is afraid to shoot shots that require juice or are long off-angle. To me it's not pool anymore on those table...it's more like snooker. Johnnyt

 

[pt109]

It's POOL,not snooker

I would like to see 4.5 inch pockets with a 'Clean' fall.

Pool should be dangerous and exciting.

pt..< thinks grinders have too much to say about conditions

 

[poolplayer2093]

It's getting so now with some of the under 4 1/2" pockets, watching 9 or 10-ball is like watching 1-hole...everyone is afraid to shoot shots that require juice or are long off-angle. To me it's not pool anymore on those table...it's more like snooker. Johnnyt

a buddy of mine hit me with a 3 pack at least twice on his home table with 3 7/8" pockets

 

[Nostroke]

......Yep.

 

[ottersbro]

bigger pockets = more runs,less ducking

 

[pt109]

bigger pockets = more runs,less ducking

Actually,i think 'ducking' is taken to a new level on loose pockets.

You have to park whitey on a dime,not a manhole cover.

 

[the77club]

i think its a different game on the tight pocket, super sensitive rubber, tables that most players and tournaments seem to be moving to......i agree..

 

[Thecoats]

I kind of agree and disagree, I think whatever size the pockets are on a standard Diamond Pro is the perfect all around size for all games. I have seen several players run plenty of racks on those tables playing 9 and 10 ball. I also think they are tight enough to play very competitive one pocket. I think pockets over 4.25 are not good for one pocket, there is a lot more that can be done with regard to kicking balls out of the hole and strategic moving.

Just my two cents, good topic for discussion positive rep to the thread starter.

-don

 

[Cuebuddy]

Or.....we could move in this direction


J/k I like watching high level pool on the tight pockets. I play on the same equipment as most of these streamed events are being played on so I can appreciate what the competitors are able to do. As for the getting the general public more into the game, well I think you are into it or you are not so let the tables and game change in the direction they are currently moving and lets see where that takes us.

 

[Gerry]

my GC4 is right at 4-3/8" and it plays perfect for me.....put the ball in the hole or get punished. When I go to the pool rooms all the pockets seem like buckets, and when I get action on the "wedged up gaff table" I'm right at home.

Now, if you are talking about average Joe player......make it easy to enjoy it more I guess......but I also don't want to see balls clearly missed go in.

I guess the better the player the tighter they like the pockets IMO.

G.

 

[seether]

what is that?

Or.....we could move in this direction


J/k I like watching high level pool on the tight pockets. I play on the same equipment as most of these streamed events are being played on so I can appreciate what the competitors are able to do. As for the getting the general public more into the game, well I think you are into it or you are not so let the tables and game change in the direction they are currently moving and lets see where that takes us.

What a funny looking pool table.

 

[jalapus logan]

Actually,i think 'ducking' is taken to a new level on loose pockets.

You have to park whitey on a dime,not a manhole cover.

Good point. I hadn't thought of that.

 

[jalapus logan]

It's getting so now with some of the under 4 1/2" pockets, watching 9 or 10-ball is like watching 1-hole...everyone is afraid to shoot shots that require juice or are long off-angle. To me it's not pool anymore on those table...it's more like snooker. Johnnyt

I think that this is a good point as well. Players play with more timidity. Also, there are advantages and disadvantages to both tight and not so tight (again, I'm not advocating buckets) pockets. I think that one's pattern play can be different on the "looser" pockets, more pocket cheating, etc. Some shots I would play on a gold crown make me think twice on my Diamond at home...

 

[Tbeaux]

bigger vs smaller

This is a very old argument and the facts are still the same as always.
With the exception of Diamond most table manufacturers pockets run anywhere from 4 3/4" to 5" in the corners. The manufacturers tournament tables run 4 1/2" to 4 9/16" in corners. The WPA and BCA specify tournament pockets in this range, while APA and TAP and other Am. leagues specify 5" usually (but will allow play on tighter). Ther players are great about "SAYING" they want tighter pockets but then you get a couple of events like the US Open a few years back and another tournament in Europe that slips my mind at the moment that were played on very tight pockets and players begin singing a different tune.

Some tables seem easier and some tougher and yet they may have "MOST" of the same specifications in common regarding pockets.
Diamonds and Gold Crown Tournament tables are not that different as far as specs but most people can tell the difference and would likely have a preference. Differences mainly being.....K55 vs K66 rubber....flat rail profile vs curved profile.......slate pocket hole setback. Any standardization beyond what exists now would require the table manufacturers cooperating. This cooperation ain't likely to happen because each manufacturer has substantial financial investment in their current and past product lines.

 

[ChatTownBanger]

World and BCA specifications call for 4 1/2" pockets. Why not just meet the specifications? Too many geniuses out there thinking they know better. I have a Gold Crown IV with 4 1/2" pockets at home. I play quite well on it. It completely changes my game when all of a sudden I go someplace and they have gaffed tables with tighter pockets. I lose a lot of weapons in my shot making arsenal. For example, you are strictly limited on being able to shoot at a portion of the pocket to slightly change the angle for better controlling your cue ball. Or, are you going to attempt to shoot at half a pocket when the pocket is barely 2 balls wide? Or, try to cheat a pocket? I think it takes a lot more away from the game than it adds.

 

[realkingcobra]

I've said it before, I'll say it again. It's not the size of the pockets, the kind of cloth, cushions...or even the tables that is killing this sport...it's the rules!!!

Look, people that don't know a damn thing about boxing, or the ART of it, are switching to MMA fighting....because it's REAL. I understand the "Safety" play in pool....but to a novice audience....it's boring. Pool needs to drop all safety play in 9 & 10 ball and go for your hole...ALL out, if you want to make it more exciting for viewers, and increase attendance! But, most of you are so stuck on the "ART" of pool, that you're missing out on the "ALL OUT WAR" in a match between players. As I've said before, award multiple wins in the game, make the races longer, single enemination....and go for the win....over power your opponent, beat him down....make it a slugfest....but get RID of the safeties all together in rotation games. No one wants to watch a 26 mile marathon, except marathon runners, but they love watching who the FASTEST man on the planet is in a 100 meter dash!!!!

Glen

Glen

 

[jalapus logan]

I've said it before, I'll say it again. It's not the size of the pockets, the kind of cloth, cushions...or even the tables that is killing this sport...it's the rules!!!

Look, people that don't know a damn thing about boxing, or the ART of it, are switching to MMA fighting....because it's REAL. I understand the "Safety" play in pool....but to a novice audience....it's boring. Pool needs to drop all safety play in 9 & 10 ball and go for your hole...ALL out, if you want to make it more exciting for viewers, and increase attendance! But, most of you are so stuck on the "ART" of pool, that you're missing out on the "ALL OUT WAR" in a match between players. As I've said before, award multiple wins in the game, make the races longer, single enemination....and go for the win....over power your opponent, beat him down....make it a slugfest....but get RID of the safeties all together in rotation games. No one wants to watch a 26 mile marathon, except marathon runners, but they love watching who the FASTEST man on the planet is in a 100 meter dash!!!!

Glen

Glen

Interesting! I appreciate and obviously engage in safety play, but I would pay to see a 9 or 10 ball tournament like this. Perhaps like they did the old sudden death 7 ball events. Pure offense would be interesting and super fun to watch. We would get to see who are the purest of shot makers and we would certainly get to see more creative and inventive shots and patterns.

 

[cueman]

Or.....we could move in this direction


J/k I like watching high level pool on the tight pockets. I play on the same equipment as most of these streamed events are being played on so I can appreciate what the competitors are able to do. As for the getting the general public more into the game, well I think you are into it or you are not so let the tables and game change in the direction they are currently moving and lets see where that takes us.

That would be a great table to play banks on. :smile: