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Visual targets for the pocket center (with pics)
- Thread starter iusedtoberich
- Start date
give you the "feel for the pocket" that so many Champion players talk about.
Players like myself and Johnny Archer will look at the pocket, then back to the object ball to "program in" the angle to our unconscious. Sometimes we even go around and look at the object ball and imagine it going in a certain part of the pocket, this serves to give us an additional "perspective" of the shot.
The time to concentrate on the object ball is right BEFORE we hit the cue ball and then FOLLOW the object ball in the pocket (with our eyes).
It's very important, in my opinion, to see exactly which part of the pocket the object ball goes in.....this process is what will give you the {visual} "feel for the pocket" that so many Champion players talk about.
Players like myself and Johnny Archer will look at the pocket, then back to the object ball to "program in" the angle to our unconscious. Sometimes we even go around and look at the object ball and imagine it going in a certain part of the pocket, this serves to give us an additional "perspective" of the shot.
The time to concentrate on the object ball is right BEFORE we hit the cue ball and then FOLLOW the object ball in the pocket (with our eyes).
It's very important, in my opinion, to see exactly which part of the pocket the object ball goes in.....this process is what will give you the {visual} "feel for the pocket" that so many Champion players talk about.
I agree with this. I think a mark in the pocket or some other visual clue is useful to help form the image, such as "the object ball going exactly along the rail groove on the left jaw of the pocket" to avoid an obstructing ball on the right side.
Lots of beginning players haven't learned to form any kind of image and for them I think a specific point, such as a donut, is useful for training.
FWIW, pool is a dynamic game. The balls move from point a to point b.
With this in mind, reconsider that the reinforcement is not where the center of the pocket is but is point b for the OB or in other terms the OB direction of travel end point. Refer to the drawing as my avatar.
If there is a end point, there must be a start point. Where is this start point? It is the ghost ball contact patch and not the CB/OB contact point nor the OB contact patch.
The OB contact patch is the pivot point for any adjustments needed from hitting center pocket. As you move the ghost ball contact along the aiming arc, the OB direction of travel line end point moves. This is why the OB direction of travel line starts at the ghost ball contact patch.
From this you can see that moving the ghost ball contact patch one way on the aiming arc, the OB direction of travel line moves in the opposite direction. How much the OB direction of travel end point moves for any change in the ghost ball contact patch is determined by how far the OB contact patch is from the end point.
The only time the OB direction of travel end point moves the same amount as the ghost ball contact patch is when the OB direction of travel end point is the distance from the OB contact patch is that of the CB diameter.
What this means is if the OB is 8 ft from the pocket and you need to make adjustments, there is only a very small range of adjust that can be use where as the closer to the pocket the OB gets, this range increases. This, coupled with the fact the margin of the OB contact zone( some call this the margin of error) increase is the reason why it is way easier to hit anywhere in the pocket when close to the pocket, but this ability decrease as the OB distance increase from the pocket.
This is really ghost ball aiming which is not to be confused with ghost ball visualization. The reason this is ghost ball aiming is because you will be making decisions on the shot based on understanding and applying these concepts to deciding on where the CB needs to be.
How you get it there is a whole other matter.
Following up on that, Babe Cranfield's Arrow's point is the ghost ball contact patch, so including this visual training device along with this seems idea like a natural. I mean if you got a end point, why not use something that gives you the start point to train with?
With this in mind, reconsider that the reinforcement is not where the center of the pocket is but is point b for the OB or in other terms the OB direction of travel end point. Refer to the drawing as my avatar.
If there is a end point, there must be a start point. Where is this start point? It is the ghost ball contact patch and not the CB/OB contact point nor the OB contact patch.
The OB contact patch is the pivot point for any adjustments needed from hitting center pocket. As you move the ghost ball contact along the aiming arc, the OB direction of travel line end point moves. This is why the OB direction of travel line starts at the ghost ball contact patch.
From this you can see that moving the ghost ball contact patch one way on the aiming arc, the OB direction of travel line moves in the opposite direction. How much the OB direction of travel end point moves for any change in the ghost ball contact patch is determined by how far the OB contact patch is from the end point.
The only time the OB direction of travel end point moves the same amount as the ghost ball contact patch is when the OB direction of travel end point is the distance from the OB contact patch is that of the CB diameter.
What this means is if the OB is 8 ft from the pocket and you need to make adjustments, there is only a very small range of adjust that can be use where as the closer to the pocket the OB gets, this range increases. This, coupled with the fact the margin of the OB contact zone( some call this the margin of error) increase is the reason why it is way easier to hit anywhere in the pocket when close to the pocket, but this ability decrease as the OB distance increase from the pocket.
This is really ghost ball aiming which is not to be confused with ghost ball visualization. The reason this is ghost ball aiming is because you will be making decisions on the shot based on understanding and applying these concepts to deciding on where the CB needs to be.
How you get it there is a whole other matter.
Following up on that, Babe Cranfield's Arrow's point is the ghost ball contact patch, so including this visual training device along with this seems idea like a natural. I mean if you got a end point, why not use something that gives you the start point to train with?
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This feedback registers the only way it can in the game of pool - through our.......
I use the center of the pocket for my "reference point".
The question that was coming up from players that hadn't really tried the TOI technique was "how can you tell you are aiming at the closest side of the pocket when applying the 3 Part Pocket System?"
This is actually an outstanding question, because, in the answer is the "secret" to why the TOI increases the margin of error in ball pocketing.
If we shoot any shot that has an angle and cue it inside of center it will deflect outside (the target line) slightly. This would mean if we cue it inside and hit the center of the pocket the "aiming point" would HAVE to be the side of the pocket closest to the object ball (the "under cut side").
This may not sound like a "big deal," however, it's a huge when you think in terms of the pocket being a target zone. That's why I don't want to change my "target zone" by hitting the cue ball easier (making the target zone slightly bigger) or hitting the cue ball firmer (making the target zone slightly smaller) - I want to hit the cue ball the same speed as much as possible, so the target zone is consistent.
One important factor about pool (and life for that matter), is there's a balance and if you seek to make it easier in one way, you will make it more difficult in another way.
I am convinced from my experience that it's always best to make all aspect of your game consistent, and develop a way that increases the margin for error consistently and also increases feed back.
This feedback registers the only way it can in the game of pool - through our feel, touch and overall connection to the game through our eyes, hands, and mind. The TOI Technique blends all the key playing factors* together in one "Playing System". 'The Game is the Teacher'
* playing factors are shot speed, specific ball/pocket angle, and cue ball "tip target"
I use the center of the pocket for my "reference point".
The question that was coming up from players that hadn't really tried the TOI technique was "how can you tell you are aiming at the closest side of the pocket when applying the 3 Part Pocket System?"
This is actually an outstanding question, because, in the answer is the "secret" to why the TOI increases the margin of error in ball pocketing.
If we shoot any shot that has an angle and cue it inside of center it will deflect outside (the target line) slightly. This would mean if we cue it inside and hit the center of the pocket the "aiming point" would HAVE to be the side of the pocket closest to the object ball (the "under cut side").
This may not sound like a "big deal," however, it's a huge when you think in terms of the pocket being a target zone. That's why I don't want to change my "target zone" by hitting the cue ball easier (making the target zone slightly bigger) or hitting the cue ball firmer (making the target zone slightly smaller) - I want to hit the cue ball the same speed as much as possible, so the target zone is consistent.
One important factor about pool (and life for that matter), is there's a balance and if you seek to make it easier in one way, you will make it more difficult in another way.
I am convinced from my experience that it's always best to make all aspect of your game consistent, and develop a way that increases the margin for error consistently and also increases feed back.
This feedback registers the only way it can in the game of pool - through our feel, touch and overall connection to the game through our eyes, hands, and mind. The TOI Technique blends all the key playing factors* together in one "Playing System". 'The Game is the Teacher'
* playing factors are shot speed, specific ball/pocket angle, and cue ball "tip target"
Ok. Now I understand, once again, a lot to do with semantics.
I aim at "a part of the pocket" you prefer a specific point.
To me, that says you are not as good at visualization as some are.
Nothing more, nothing less.
But like I said, if it helps...
Dale
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This thread helped me when I was playing yesterday. Especially Bob Jewett's and Dr. Dave's articles on the changing pocket size.
I realized that I wasn't aiming for a specific part of the pocket. Instead I was aiming for "center pocket" and I wasn't changing that location for angle or for speed.
For example, on a soft shot down the rail into a corner pocket (on loose equipment), I usually aim to catch the rail right before the pocket. This maximizes the effective pocket size. However, I realized that I wasn't adjusting my aim if I had to shoot the same shot firmly. So I tend to rattle a large number of those shots. I thought it was a stroke flaw that came out when I hit firmly. Yesterday I made a point of aiming to hit the pocket facing on these shots, and my pocketing percentage jumped.
So thank you all for this thread. It's made a small but noticeable difference in my game.
- Geoff
I realized that I wasn't aiming for a specific part of the pocket. Instead I was aiming for "center pocket" and I wasn't changing that location for angle or for speed.
For example, on a soft shot down the rail into a corner pocket (on loose equipment), I usually aim to catch the rail right before the pocket. This maximizes the effective pocket size. However, I realized that I wasn't adjusting my aim if I had to shoot the same shot firmly. So I tend to rattle a large number of those shots. I thought it was a stroke flaw that came out when I hit firmly. Yesterday I made a point of aiming to hit the pocket facing on these shots, and my pocketing percentage jumped.
So thank you all for this thread. It's made a small but noticeable difference in my game.
- Geoff
That's your opinion.
In mine you missed the pocket unless your telling me that you purposely aimed your shot specifically into the rail. Seems kinda of a silly thing to do when the "pocket" should be your target.
When you miss the pocket you aimed for and the ball still manages to fall in , I consider that slop. Perhaps my standards are too high. I can live with that.
P.S. I guess you consider the gutter part of the lane when bowling as well ?
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Just want to clarify what the point of this topic was in case you didn't read the first post.
The "point" was establishing a method for finding a center of pocket reference that applies equally from all possible angles on the table. You simply can not include points on the rail as a valid part of that equation. Or any other reference for that matter that does not apply to the criteria specified. (All angles on the table)
Sorry fire, I was with you on a lot, but you are "missing" on a vital point.
The problem is not at all that your standards are too high, but rather your
knowledge is too low.
To set things in perspective, I am FAR from being a champion, but I do
play at a decent level.
I can tell you without reservation that there are plenty of times I
intentionally shoot the ball to contact the rail before entering the pocket.
As does every accomplished player I have ever met. Mostly this is done
when you are at the edge of the envelope for getting position. Situations
of this type come up in the early stages of One Pocket games all the time.
It is very common, in order to run balls in a crowd, to thread the CB
around, between, and beyond intervening balls.
Dale
I updated the pictures and the text in the first post to:
1. Remove the error with the "donut" being the true center for every approach angle.
2. To also address cheating the pocket
3. To address hitting the rail first if you so choose
4. To more accurately pick the target that best coincides with the center for the example pictures.
I believe the new pictures are now much more accurate Thanks to all for helping set me straight.
Good shooting.
1. Remove the error with the "donut" being the true center for every approach angle.
2. To also address cheating the pocket
3. To address hitting the rail first if you so choose
4. To more accurately pick the target that best coincides with the center for the example pictures.
I believe the new pictures are now much more accurate
Thanks to all for helping set me straight.Good shooting.
Well, at the risk of jinxing myself, I believe I have made a measurable improvement in my game in the past month using this method of targeting a discreet part of the pocket. I've been keeping stats of 4 ball ghost attempts for years, and in the last 4 months, I've been doing it regularly on my home table and set up a spreadhseet. The data represents how many times out of 10 trials I beat the 4 ball ghost. So a score of 6 would mean I beat the ghost 6 games to 4. My 4 ball ghost is only with 4 balls on the table, not all 9, and must run all 4 in rotation. I throw 6 balls on the table and depending on how many fall into a pocket, I remove the lowest numbered balls until 4 remain. So I'm always running 4 balls.
The graph shows I did this 60 times from 10/29/2012 to 2/28/2013 in the last 4 months (graph only shows 59 due to odd number display, and I couldn't get the date to also display....). The blue line is the raw data. The red line is the raw data smoothed, by averaging the prior 5 data points (5 period moving average).
The black line represents when I started this pocket targeting on Feb 5, 2013.
You can see that before the black line, the rolling average is hovering around 5. After the black line, it is climbing and seems to eventually settle around 7.
I also played 2 sessions in the past 2 weeks, with a guy who I have never beaten before. I still did not win, but I broke even both times, and he even stroked my ego asking where have I been hiding and playing...
Your mileage may vary, but I'm happy with my results thus far.
The graph shows I did this 60 times from 10/29/2012 to 2/28/2013 in the last 4 months (graph only shows 59 due to odd number display, and I couldn't get the date to also display....). The blue line is the raw data. The red line is the raw data smoothed, by averaging the prior 5 data points (5 period moving average).
The black line represents when I started this pocket targeting on Feb 5, 2013.
You can see that before the black line, the rolling average is hovering around 5. After the black line, it is climbing and seems to eventually settle around 7.
I also played 2 sessions in the past 2 weeks, with a guy who I have never beaten before. I still did not win, but I broke even both times, and he even stroked my ego asking where have I been hiding and playing...
Your mileage may vary, but I'm happy with my results thus far.
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It helps me to have a specific small target to aim at... rather than "the pocket". I suppose that those who use CTE or something like that. I view the pocket from the angle of the ob and look for the center of the available opening. This gives me a much better idea of exactly where the ghost ball will be.
Congrats on your 2 ball improvement and thanks for taking the time to post this with detailed photos, I appreciate it. Steve
If you have a way of adjusting and your opponent doesn't, what's going to happen?
You're right, Dale, pool is a game of constant calibrating, observing, and adjusting. I want to know what part of the pocket the object ball is going on every shot so I can immediately make a slight adjustment if it's not hitting center (unless I'm not trying to hit center of course, but I usually am).
The problem short stops run into is they make several shots in a row, but they're hitting different parts of the pocket. Pretty soon some of those "near misses" become misses. This is because they didn't notice that their shots were "spraying" off line and they had no system of adjustment.
I favor the Inside of the cue ball for this reason - I want to have a way to constantly calibrate and adjust and if I'm cuing Inside I can cue it more or less Inside. If I'm trying to hit center what am I going to do? Hit is more center or less center?
Are you going to change your contact point or move your "ghost ball"? Think about it, how do you adjust if you're slightly over cutting or under cutting shots during a match?
Are you staring to see what an advantage I have using the "Touch" of Inside? If I have a way of slightly adjusting and you don't......what's going to happen sooner or later? I think you can guess.
These questions are easily answered by someone using the TOI System, what about your system? Do you have a built in way to calibrate your ball pocketing without changing your stoke? With TOI you can do it by changing where you cue the ball slightly and/or with shot speed.
'The Game is the Teacher' CJ Wiley
You're right, Dale, pool is a game of constant calibrating, observing, and adjusting. I want to know what part of the pocket the object ball is going on every shot so I can immediately make a slight adjustment if it's not hitting center (unless I'm not trying to hit center of course, but I usually am).
The problem short stops run into is they make several shots in a row, but they're hitting different parts of the pocket. Pretty soon some of those "near misses" become misses. This is because they didn't notice that their shots were "spraying" off line and they had no system of adjustment.
I favor the Inside of the cue ball for this reason - I want to have a way to constantly calibrate and adjust and if I'm cuing Inside I can cue it more or less Inside. If I'm trying to hit center what am I going to do? Hit is more center or less center?
Are you going to change your contact point or move your "ghost ball"? Think about it, how do you adjust if you're slightly over cutting or under cutting shots during a match?
Are you staring to see what an advantage I have using the "Touch" of Inside? If I have a way of slightly adjusting and you don't......what's going to happen sooner or later? I think you can guess.
These questions are easily answered by someone using the TOI System, what about your system? Do you have a built in way to calibrate your ball pocketing without changing your stoke? With TOI you can do it by changing where you cue the ball slightly and/or with shot speed.
'The Game is the Teacher' CJ Wiley