What would YOU do?

jimmyg

jimmyg

Mook! What's a Mook?
Silver Member
Just wondering!!

If you were the owner of a pool room, and you knew everything about the IPT that was publically available, would you host a IPT qualifyer TODAY?

Bear in mind that:
1) You have to make a living
2) Maybe you already have the equiptment.
3) You may only get two - four players.
4) Knowing that the players have not been paid for almost a month.
5) It's possible that there may not be another IPT tournament.
6) KT just sent out an e-mail saying that the checks are going out

Which would win out, self-preservation, trust or ethics?
 
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No, I wouldn't. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but I can't see a qualifier generating very much revenue. Maybe if it was full of great players like some of the earlier qualifiers but how can 2 to 4 people showing up generate enough revenue to make any difference at the end of the day?

Quite honestly, at this point...if I were in the pool industry I would be very wary of supporting the IPT as it is today. Why risk my reputation because they don't have their act together?

A new owner and a new TD would be what it would take for me personally to involve my business with the IPT.
 
Your questions are confusing

jimmyg said:
Just wondering!!

If you were the owner of a pool room, and you knew everything about the IPT that was publically available, would you host a IPT qualifyer TODAY?

Bear in mind that:
1) You have to make a living?
2) Maybe you already have the equiptment.
3) You may only get two - four players.
4) Knowing that the players have not been paid for almost a month.
5) It's possible that there may not be another IPT tournament.
6) KT just sent out an e-mail saying that the checks are going out?

Which would win out, self-preservation, trust or ethics?
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What does "have to make a living" have to do with holding a qualifier?
The cost is negligent.
Holding a qualifier is no reflection on a room owner, let the players decide on those questions. Those are more for a player to answer.
For a room owner it is free publicity. Maybe new customers.
But considering the state of affairs now mini-qualifiers to a qualifier would be the better way to go.
 
Timberly said:
No, I wouldn't. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but I can't see a qualifier generating very much revenue. Maybe if it was full of great players like some of the earlier qualifiers but how can 2 to 4 people showing up generate enough revenue to make any difference at the end of the day?

Quite honestly, at this point...if I were in the pool industry I would be very wary of supporting the IPT as it is today. Why risk my reputation because they don't have their act together?

A new owner and a new TD would be what it would take for me personally to involve my business with the IPT.
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Have to agree with you there.

However, some have comited to this months ago and now are really torn. I feel very badly for a couple of them. Either way, they haven't done much for any of the pool rooms exceprt cost them a lot of money.

These guys bought racks, balls, {of which many have never recieved, go figure} cloth, and chalk. The tables then had to be recovered.

A friend has hosted three q's which have yeilded 22,14, and 2 players.

Why, would they get any better?
 
Those items are part of every day operations which are bought or replaced all the time. From a business sense that is not a ton of money and all useable equipment or resellable. Big deal.
 
jimmyg said:
Just wondering!!

If you were the owner of a pool room, and you knew everything about the IPT that was publically available, would you host a IPT qualifyer TODAY?

Bear in mind that:
1) You have to make a living?
2) Maybe you already have the equiptment.
3) You may only get two - four players.
4) Knowing that the players have not been paid for almost a month.
5) It's possible that there may not be another IPT tournament.
6) KT just sent out an e-mail saying that the checks are going out?

Which would win out, self-preservation, trust or ethics?
Click to expand...


If i had committed, I'd go ahead with it. If I hadn't I wouldn't and would wait for them to get on better footing before considering it. As has been said, there really isnt much in it fo the owner at this point so why bother? It's not like you will be rewarded down the road for your loyalty. That is highly unlikely.
 
nfty9er said:
Those items are part of every day operations which are bought or replaced all the time. From a business sense that is not a ton of money and all useable equipment or resellable. Big deal.
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Big Deal? Nfty, you must have never owned a pool room. Take an average sized room with 18 tables. To recover all of them is minimum $4,500 and well over 5K if you use Simoniz. Eighteen new sets of balls, minimum $1,250 up to $1,500. Good balls ain't cheap. Good racks are about $10-15 each, no big deal. And a box of chalk about $25.

So we're talking six to seven thousand here. Any pool room owner I know would consider that real money. If you're making $1,500 to 2K a week running the place, that's almost a months earnings. Just wanted to give you the perspective from someone who has paid these bills more than a few times.
 
IPT qualifier in my poolroom

I own a pool room in Cary, North Carolina. We hosted a miniqualifier for the IPT Las Vegas event with 8 players with the winner advancing to play in the main qualifier in Raleigh NC. Sam Monday finished first in our qualifier and second in the main qualifier advancing to Las Vegas. Sam made it to the third round in Vegas earning $10,000. He received his check for $9000 a couple of weeks after the Las Vegas event. I filed all the appropriate paperworld with the IPT as a sponsor and still have not received one red cent. I am owed $1100 by the IPT and have been given the run around for over three months. End of that story.

The IPT charges $250 per table for rooms that host a qualifier. For this you get cloth, (not installed), IPT balls, (which they said were not available at the time), Sardo rack and a gross of IPT chalk. They require at least 8 tables for a qualifier so the investment is right at $2000. The cost of the cloth is a break even since the price is comparable to Simonis which we now currently use. The balls can be resold (but they don't have any) sardo racks are worthless in my opinion. (give them away as door prizes). Chalk is ckalk.

The IPT has approached me about running a qualifier but until they pay me what they owe me NO WAY. On September 28 I received a package from the IPT with all the forms etc. to run a qualifier. Qualifiers for the tour card events have been averaging 4 players. On the weekend of Sep. 23, I hosted a qualifier for their National Amateur championship to be held in Atlanta in November. (130 players). The following weekend we hosted the NC Senior games billiards competion. (106 players). We host our own NC Senior 9 Ball Open in October and expect a full field of 64 players. I'm rambling.

Would I host an IPT qualifier. Why bother. The exposure and publicity generated would be negligible.

When the IPT came on the scene I was all for it and still hope they succeed. But the bad publicity associated with their non-payment of prizes is of deep concern. Their lack of communication and apparent fraudulent activities give me no reason to support this tour until all their past financial obligations have been met.

I'm not one to air my grievances online but this whole IPT thing has me very frustrated.
 
We are hosting a qualifier next weekend.

Have already bought the equipment, and I still believe the IPT will succeed.

Regarding the equipment we were going to change the cloth anyway, so the costs were minimal. However, haven't received the balls yet, guess they are in the mail. lol

Btw, the Sardo's are crap. The chalk is really good!

However, I have told everyone who wanted to sign up for the tournament that they should call me in a week because of the check issue. If I then haven't heard that the checks has arrived, at least the players will know it and their action is based on what they know...
 
nfty9er said:
Those items are part of every day operations which are bought or replaced all the time. From a business sense that is not a ton of money and all useable equipment or resellable. Big deal.
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To many who take pride in their equipment, it would be a "big deal". Who needs 16 Sardo racks lying around since not many people like them anyway. Who wants to have The"IPT CLOTH" on their tables all the time. Why replace balls if not needed? With 10-20 players or less shwing up for the qualifiers, how much is this going to increase business?

Why would someone want to facilitate something which is garunteed, but then again, who knows?

It is a "BIG DEAL" for those who have pride of OWNERSHIP.
 
All of the IPT Players I know say that the cloth sucks! Gorina isn't comparable to Simonis in any way. They all said over 50% of the breaks were dry and "You could find better felt on the bottom of your lamp at home."

They did send a Diamond Table set up exactly as the ones they play on to Mike Sigel and set it up in Pro Billiards here in Orlando before his first event. He played on it a few games and wouldn't play on it anymore, he switched to a house table for all of the practice he got until the event.

IPT Site:

Gorina IPT Tournament Cloth
The finest quality, slow nap woolen cloth is what the IPT Professional Players play on during the major tournaments. Gorina IPT Tournament Cloth is the most difficult cloth in the world on which to master playing, and one of the most difficult cloths to manufacture. Only the longest strands of wool fiber are expertly woven to create this traditional slow-nap cloth. Playing on this cloth requires having a superior stroke and the best mechanics, which is why the IPT uses it and why only the best players in the world excel on it. Room owners who choose this tournament cloth for their tables will be giving their customers a taste of what life is like on the IPT tour!
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Instead of spending money on a dead end qualifier you may want to up what you add to your in house tournaments. It would make those that actually pay your bills much happier. :)
 
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Roy Steffensen said:
However, I have told everyone who wanted to sign up for the tournament that they should call me in a week because of the check issue. If I then haven't heard that the checks has arrived, at least the players will know it and their action is based on what they know...
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Great way to approach it. Good luck to you.
 
You are not fooling me Jay

jay helfert said:
Big Deal? Nfty, you must have never owned a pool room. Take an average sized room with 18 tables. To recover all of them is minimum $4,500 and well over 5K if you use Simoniz. Eighteen new sets of balls, minimum $1,250 up to $1,500. Good balls ain't cheap. Good racks are about $10-15 each, no big deal. And a box of chalk about $25.

So we're talking six to seven thousand here. Any pool room owner I know would consider that real money. If you're making $1,500 to 2K a week running the place, that's almost a months earnings. Just wanted to give you the perspective from someone who has paid these bills more than a few times.[/QUOTE

Jay, there are a few things wrong about your response.
1. I own a pool room and have for 30 years.
2. The idea that I would recloth 18 tables is ludicrous. However I would do 8 since I probably could find 8 that needed it at any one time or if not sacrifice the couple of months I would do it anyway. So basically it is not costing me anymore than usual.
3. Balls are not available and I do not believe are required to be used at this time. Even if they were they are useable if needed or resellable. Everything sells eventually no matter what it is and I can prove it.
4. Sardo racks not required, regualar racks I have tons of. In fact I probably have enough Sardo racks to get through a tournament with 4 people. Ha?
5. If I were to recloth 18 tables with Simoni, which I wouldn't, I changed to Championship, it would cost me 4500 not well over 5000.
6. You know you never recloth all tables at once.
So Jay as a former room owner, you know there are ways to get around a lot of costs. You have done it so please don't make me look like a fool and I don't know what I am talking about.
I will say it again, not that I want to until I see it is all going to work out, but it is no big deal and will not cost me what you are trying to tell me in your exaggerated b.s.
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You have no idea

ironman said:
To many who take pride in their equipment, it would be a "big deal". Who needs 16 Sardo racks lying around since not many people like them anyway. Who wants to have The"IPT CLOTH" on their tables all the time. Why replace balls if not needed? With 10-20 players or less shwing up for the qualifiers, how much is this going to increase business?

Why would someone want to facilitate something which is garunteed, but then again, who knows?

It is a "BIG DEAL" for those who have pride of OWNERSHIP.
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I take a lot of pride. What are u talking about 16 sardo racks? Where do u get that info. You smokin something. IPT cloth is about the same as most pool rooms put on some tables for the bangers that have no idea. I have 12 tables with pro championship and 8 with cheaper cloth for the cloth wreckers or people who don't know and believe me there are plenty of them. Balls are sellable and replaceable but as of now there is no requirment. So if you are going to argue the point or dispute it at least get some facts right and know what your talking about. I am not saying I want to have one but if I do it sure is not going to hurt me even though it may or may not help.
Thank you.
 
I will say it to you too

Ruthless said:
All of the IPT Players I know say that the cloth sucks! Gorina isn't comparable to Simonis in any way. They all said over 50% of the breaks were dry and "You could find better felt on the bottom of your lamp at home."

They did send a Diamond Table set up exactly as the ones they play on to Mike Sigel and set it up in Pro Billiards here in Orlando before his first event. He played on it a few games and wouldn't play on it anymore, he switched to a house table for all of the practice he got until the event.



Instead of spending money on a dead end qualifier you may want to up what you add to your in house tournaments. It would make those that actually pay your bills much happier. :)
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I don't get it, do you people not realize that cloth can be fine for your bangers and tables not used for action or good players. Most rooms have two sets of cloth or if they don't they should. Like I said if I had a tournament, 8 tables with Gorina if I had to and 12 with my pro championship. That is not a hardship and no big deal. Get it through your head folks.
 
Most places do have tables for bangers and mostly 8' tables or coin-ops, but it would be a waste to cover any 9' tables with bad cloth in this area where decent rooms have a waiting list by 7pm.

I too have been in this business for about 3 decades. Not owning rooms, but managing them. I am also a table mech., I have even built rooms (complete ground up) that have made the cover of P & B Mag., and also played most Pro Tours since the early 80's........ So I believe I am also qualified :)

But this isn't a mine is bigger than yours contest...... The bottom line is that the IPT offers very little if anything to a room owner to even answer their calls.
 
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Yes Gorina cloth is different and most like Simonis. Gorina cloth rolls different and the reults using english are different. I thought because of this Hohmann bought Gorina cloth and started to practice on it before Las Vegas - the result speaks for itself.

Kinda like nine ball players practicing 8 ball so they could play better in the IPT.
 
nfty9er said:
I take a lot of pride. What are u talking about 16 sardo racks? Where do u get that info. You smokin something. IPT cloth is about the same as most pool rooms put on some tables for the bangers that have no idea. I have 12 tables with pro championship and 8 with cheaper cloth for the cloth wreckers or people who don't know and believe me there are plenty of them. Balls are sellable and replaceable but as of now there is no requirment. So if you are going to argue the point or dispute it at least get some facts right and know what your talking about. I am not saying I want to have one but if I do it sure is not going to hurt me even though it may or may not help.
Thank you.
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As matter of fact, the balls, cloth, chalk, and racks are required.
Maybe it is you who is smoking something..
 
You just can't stand being wrong

ironman said:
As matter of fact, the balls, cloth, chalk, and racks are required.
Maybe it is you who is smoking something..
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First it doesn't make any difference, they are resuseable for your business or resellable and no big deal.
Second, in the letters and phone calls I got from them to help promote the IPT not once have they mentioned those requirments. And how can you require something that is not available yet. And you just don't get it, using the cloth and installing it is no more expense than the regular cloth I use already on other tables.
So go back to your joint, or read my posts.
 
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