Why is it that average players always feel like they should instruct you.

Bishop

Bishop

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Before you flip out AZ don't get me wrong I'll learn something from anyone no matter what their speed is, I've always enjoyed a productive conversation. Its just that I don't get the player that I beat for 3 or 4 hours straight but still insists on critiquing my game and advising me on each shot while cursing out each and every mistake they make. Not just good advice its simple no brainer novice advice....I don't need a coach for every shot.

Is this some Y2K half assed attempt at sharking?

You know the type...Mr. Excuse Maker. For some reason the pool world is full of people that go above and beyond friendly advice. They want to instruct your every move but then simply can't play the game well themselves. I'm no stud myself but I'm at least tactful and respectful of my opponent.

Anyway Here's to you Mr. Excuse Maker Instructor Guy. Teaching the world at any given drunken moment. Thanks for everything.
 
Me play pretty pool someday.

Seriously though, it sounds like you had a fish on the hook. You shoulda reeled him in. ;)
 
Black-Balled said:
Dum pepil allways think their smart
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Vary smert ;)

I run into the same thing on the golf course....20 handicap with horrific swing decides he's just the one that is gonna coach me over the hump to finally shoot par today :D

Someone gave me this quote....can't remember whom, but it works, "I appreciate your help, but I've been working with a coach....he's got me working on a few things I need to concentrate on, so I won't be paying attention to any of your tips.....thanks though", or something like that....it works...at least at the golf course....

That, or you could just tell them to STFU :D
 
Bishop said:
Before you flip out AZ don't get me wrong I'll learn something from anyone no matter what their speed is, I've always enjoyed a productive conversation. Its just that I don't get the player that I beat for 3 or 4 hours straight but still insists on critiquing my game and advising me on each shot while cursing out each and every mistake they make. Not just good advice its simple no brainer novice advice....I don't need a coach for every shot.

Is this some Y2K half assed attempt at sharking?

You know the type...Mr. Excuse Maker. For some reason the pool world is full of people that go above and beyond friendly advice. They want to instruct your every move but then simply can't play the game well themselves. I'm no stud myself but I'm at least tactful and respectful of my opponent.

Anyway Here's to you Mr. Excuse Maker Instructor Guy. Teaching the world at any given drunken moment. Thanks for everything.
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About 2 years ago I was coaching a player on the Ladies Spirit Tour. She had two heartbreaking losses the day before, and we had gone to a quiet pool hall in Titusville for a short session on several issues the very next day. I was adjusting her algnment and posture while she was in her jump stance, when out of nowhere - this lady interrupts me.

"Excuse me, but I play in 2 leagues!" she proudly told us.

Now, this player is still over the cue ball ready to jump when this lady announces that to us. We just look at each other. Then the lady says...

"let me show you the right way to do that... he's teaching you the wrong way. I've been playing for a long time."

I was humored and smiled while she insulted me! :p But hell, I was curious. Perhaps she does know more than I do. Maybe she will have the pearls of wisdom that will change my young player's life... lol (not likely).

This lady gets out her jump cue, gets over the cue ball and stabs down into the ball... it was ugly. The cue ball jumped like a frog that had its ass superglued to a rock. That didn't stop her from setting it up 3 more times, getting the same exact result every single time. Eventually she let a heavy sigh and said, "There must be something wrong with your cue ball. and why does it have all of those red dots on it?"

:p
 
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Big Perm said:
Vary smert ;)

I run into the same thing on the golf course....20 handicap with horrific swing decides he's just the one that is gonna coach me over the hump to finally shoot par today :D

Someone gave me this quote....can't remember whom, but it works, "I appreciate your help, but I've been working with a coach....he's got me working on a few things I need to concentrate on, so I won't be paying attention to any of your tips.....thanks though", or something like that....it works...at least at the golf course....

That, or you could just tell them to STFU :D
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LOL I quit playing golf with a group of guys because of a guy like that in the foursome. I asked him to stop on several occasions and he still kept it up, so I politely excused myself from our weekly competition and haven't looked back.
 
I was polite for a long a time. I just told him "I'm not capable of digesting your advice because my mind is prewired to only listen to my Wife or the guy who buys the beer, you are neither".
 
Funny, got to be a shark move. But I learned from a master that it's more effective and devious to simply COMPLIMENT the opponent. Just say something like: "I really like the way you stay down and finish on those kinds of shots." They'll start thinking themselves right out of the zone, lol.

Not that I would ever do that. But when it was done to me on the tennis court, I tell ya, my topspin backhand started finding the net in a hurry.:D
 
Blackjack said:
"Excuse me, but I play in 2 leagues!" she proudly told us.
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Yeah, but does she know how to play pool?

I have a co-worker exactly like that. :D
 
Bishop said:
I was polite for a long a time. I just told him "I'm not capable of digesting your advice because my mind is prewired to only listen to my Wife or the guy who buys the beer, you are neither".
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What a great reply! Rep to you.
 
A good teacher doesn't mean it's a good player. Also a good player isn't always a good teacher. The one who thought me how to pool was once a good player but doesn't knew the basis. He told me one of the world champion insulted him being a worse player, while he just won a big tournament.

I'm also an average player, but I know the basis quite well. The one who thought me how to drive says the same thing. His succeed rate is above the 95%, that's quite high in the country where I live. He told me, a good teacher isn't always a good driver. He isn't a good driver, but he is one of the best carteacher I've ever seen.

If someone teaching you like everyshot, it's quite annoying. But someone who teaching you some shots, you should always listen to that. He might be a player with a lots of knowlegde which you can learn from. A good teacher can always tell you why he teach you that way. If he can't, it's a bad teacher, and you shouldn't listen.
 
Because:

Jeesh, don't you know anything: :D

1) They are a 'Greenhorn' and don't know it.
2) They want to 1-up you, and satisfy their ego.
3) And if they knew that much, they wouldn't try to give you
10 second instructions because they already know it wouldn't
do any good unless you had 1-2 hour instruction sessions.
4) They are trying to be funny when you are not in the mood.

Besides every good instructor evaluates your form and stance and
stroke first, it's called the 'Basics' for a reason.
 
It's something you see in many different sports; always good for a laugh.

An extreme example was on view at the 2006 DCC; witnessed by several of us in the AZB room. On the Saturday of the IPT qualifier, Jerry Briesath had watched Jeanette Lee's match, and found a flaw in her breaking technique. As soon as the match ended, they hustled over to the AZB room for a quick correction.

As Jerry (one of the top instructors in the world) starts to show Jeanette (one of the top players in the world) the element of the break that she had been neglecting, one of the fellows sitting in the room (a B or C player from onepocket.org) jumps up and GRABS THE CUE BALL off the table, and proclaims, "here, let me show you how I do it; I've found if I think about snapping my wrist at the cue ball I get tremendous results." Everyone just smiled and watched a couple of his powder puff breaks, but it was fairly embarrassing for the room organizers.
 
I have to reply again because I figured out why they do this to you.

They are "average", you are not!

I play sometimes with a guy(Chinese) here in China sometimes who plays OK but not great. In every set we play he tries two or three complicated masse shots and wants to teach me to do do them.

I haven't seen him be successful on a single shot in over a year. Go figger!

I just respond to his instruction with " Uh Huh, thanks" and promptly forget everything he said.
 
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I think it's largely an ego thing.

I was chatting with a couple of friends about this just this weekend, during a small tournament. Pool is just one of those games/sports that reaaaally brings out the ego in people. I suspect it's largely due to it's solo nature - when you're playing, it's pretty much just YOU - there's no teammates playing at the same time, etc.

I also suspect that films like TCOM reinforce this idea - all the main characters (Characters! Not necessarily the ACTORS who portray them) in that film (and others like it) are all a) fantastic players and b) sport HUGE egos.
 
Sometimes the "average" players can give better advice than an expert because they have had to try very hard to learn what they do know, whereas an expert can have the knowledge and ability come so naturally to them that its hard for them to teach it or relay it to someone else. JMO.

Southpaw
 
Yeah, try this one. "Your suggestions might help me, I have a lot of bad habits I've picked up over the years. One is listening to too many people, not everyone plays the same style. I always revert back to my bad habits when I'm under pressure. I'll tell you what, I'll give you the eight for _______ bucks a set, and you'll see what I mean. Terrible habits just come right to the surface."
 
I somewhat agree with Mike. Around here there are lots of players too willing to give advice about what to do and most, given the same situation, wouldn't be able to do it. That said, I do believe in the saying that a good player does not a good teacher make, as well, those that can't, teach.

I remember several years ago I was called in to ref a shot and the player was attempting a jump shot. He scooped under the ball, I called the foul. He flipped and said how could I be a ref if I didn't understand how to do a jump shot. Needless to say, my point was proven. I actually look for these mini-lessons as they happen. I find them humorous to observe.
 
I think that there are a couple of things going on here. First a joke:
Those who can do.
Those who can't, teach.
Those who can't teach, teach teachers.

I am a Professor (really) and the joke is not true. Only a few people who are really good at what they do can also teach well. There are far more teachers who can do something but cannot teach well.

Good teaching is about sharing. Good teachers want to show others new and exciting things for them to try. Good teachers revel in watching you grow, that is why they teach. It is a profession unto itself.

The guy with all the advice may be a budding teacher, he may be a jerk. It is true that some people have the ability to teach a skill but do not have excellent (pro) abilities in the use of that skill. These would be people who study everything, instead of playing, and they know about all of the nuances. Jack Kohler for instance.

So when I meet the guy with all the advise I first try to figure out if he is sharing or if its ego. If its ego I ignore but you can learn good things in the strangest places.

We are all ignorant ? we are just ignorant about different things.

Here is a sign from the department where I went to graduate school. It took us (the grad students) years to figure out this key to knowledge.

The ability to withstand ambiguity is a sign of creativity.
 
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