Why pool is different !!!

I'll never say never again...

SJDinPHX said:
Yes, Kevin Trudeau founded the IPT, and based its success on being able to wager on pool games!...
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I'd of bet my last dollar there was no one left on earth (besides Trudeau himself) who still buys that story.
 
Why so glum, chum?

JCIN said:
The reasons for pool going down the drain are many but this is what will be the big killer eventually. I dont see any way to stop it. The cost to market to the younger demographic is ridiculous because you are competing with everyone else on earth for their attention.

If every pool room in the country let kids play free it wouldnt make a dent. Kids dont WANT to play. They dont even play baseball anymore. They live online and do things that look cool when they post it on the facetwitter. No one wants to be a 9 Ball World Champion they want to be a social media star or play the newest video game.

Add in the stigma of pool where most parents wouldnt let their kid even walk in a pool room and I don't blame them a bit. Many of us that love the game were drawn as much to the lifestyle/dark side of the game as anything when we were teenagers. Almost everyone I know in the pro world fits that mold. All those kind of kids today are playing poker/fantasy sports in their bedrooms.

Pool will find its own level in this country and that level is going to be on tiny tables in bars and as furniture in McMansions to be dusted off a couple times a year. In a decade there won't even be a "pro" tournament thats not held in a pool room. Pool will never die but it sure as hell isn't going to grow from where we are now, no matter what the next big idea is because of the simple reason it bores the sh!t out of 99.9% of the people in this country.

We are living through a paradigm shift. Pool is the horse and buggy and its the early 1900's. It would be awesome if I was totally wrong but I don't see any indicators pointing the other way.
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If you're always looking down you'll miss the sunshine. But then again, you'll never fall into a big hole.
 
JCIN said:
The reasons for pool going down the drain are many but this is what will be the big killer eventually. I dont see any way to stop it. The cost to market to the younger demographic is ridiculous because you are competing with everyone else on earth for their attention.

If every pool room in the country let kids play free it wouldnt make a dent. Kids dont WANT to play. They dont even play baseball anymore. They live online and do things that look cool when they post it on the facetwitter. No one wants to be a 9 Ball World Champion they want to be a social media star or play the newest video game.

Add in the stigma of pool where most parents wouldnt let their kid even walk in a pool room and I don't blame them a bit. Many of us that love the game were drawn as much to the lifestyle/dark side of the game as anything when we were teenagers. Almost everyone I know in the pro world fits that mold. All those kind of kids today are playing poker/fantasy sports in their bedrooms.

Pool will find its own level in this country and that level is going to be on tiny tables in bars and as furniture in McMansions to be dusted off a couple times a year. In a decade there won't even be a "pro" tournament thats not held in a pool room. Pool will never die but it sure as hell isn't going to grow from where we are now, no matter what the next big idea is because of the simple reason it bores the sh!t out of 99.9% of the people in this country.

We are living through a paradigm shift. Pool is the horse and buggy and its the early 1900's. It would be awesome if I was totally wrong but I don't see any indicators pointing the other way.
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I wish I had a beer available right now so that I had something to cry into. :frown:
 
ChicagoRJ said:
You hit the nail on the head. I have a pool table in my home, and my son wants no part of it. He loves baseball, he loves karate, he loves track. He does not like pool. Oh, occasionally he will play some 8ball with me, he likes it for about 30 minutes and he's kinda done with it.

Though, he's got a couple of friends that come over and want to "try" pool, and they play a few games once in a blue moon... so who knows down the road, but at 16, between video games, girls, internet, Utube and other sports, it's a tough competition.
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I have a theory on why video games are more fun for kids. Actually there are a couple of reasons but I will focus on one of them in this post.


The theory is based on a teaching principle of early success. You can't overwhelm a student. One of the reasons video games are fun is because every game starts out on the easy level and then progresses from there. The game is fun from the beginning and provides just the right amount of challenge. Each level gets a little harder and more fun as you get better and the challenges become harder. When they beat the game they start online gaming against other players and then at the highest level video games offer head to head competition for dollars where the participants are masters.

When I learned to play pool I started at a rec center after school in the second grade. In fact it wasn't even pool, it was bumper pool. But the point is I started with success because I had just one ball to focus on and the task of kicking it towards the hole. It was fun. When I got a little older the center got a pool table and when we would play all we would do is just pocket balls most of the time. We wouldn't even play the real game but it was fun. Then when I got a little older I started going to a game room and that is when I really started focusing on the games. This place was a teenage hangout during afternoons and at night but during the day there were some real players that came in there. They had a regular golf game for old men and they would teach me plus this place had tournaments that real players would come too and I would play in those. On the other nights there was easy action. The point is I learned in levels and started with early success. The challenges came just at the right time.

To get kids to play there has to be an attraction. The game being overwhelming to them is not attractive to most. What if pool halls had competitions for kids who are complete beginners but the game was simply setting up different shots and seeing who could pocket the most balls? After a kid becomes a proficient ball pocketer then he can start playing in the real tournaments at the place but he has to be able to pocket at least at like a C+ level, if not higher. This gives him an early goal that is not too overwhelming and it is fun.


I think something like that would attract more kids to the game and keep them coming back once they start playing. The trick is getting them to come in and play in the first place. I started just because the rec center was where I hung out after school and the table was there but obviously getting kids to come to a pool hall for the first time is different.
 
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kids dont play baseball anymore.........bawhahahahahahahhaha

tell more jokes please. your killing me with laughter.
 
Funny how pool is much bigger in Asian countries than in America.

I guess they don't have video games over there.
 
BeiberLvr said:
Funny how pool is much bigger in Asian countries than in America.

I guess they don't have video games over there.
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No, they have plenty of them, in fact most of them are invented over there. The big difference is, they are just a diversion (ie; passtime) not an obsession, like it has become with our youth. It seems the Asian's, the Pinoy's and the European's still appreciate learning a game that requires time and dedication to master.

Its too bad so few of our kids don't have that mindset. Ours are all about 'instant gratification'! As others have pointed out, our playgrounds are virtually empty these days. Our kids are all holed up in their rooms, texting or playing video games! :sorry:
 
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You have to have lived there to understand it. I lived in Taiwan for three years and the Philippines for three years. Pool there is like it was decades ago in the U.S.A.

Their economy has a lot to do with it. A lot of young players don't go to school, have no jobs, and nowhere to go...so they hang out in the pool halls at an early age. The same background Efren came from.
 
HawaiianEye said:
You have to have lived there to understand it. I lived in Taiwan for three years and the Philippines for three years. Pool there is like it was decades ago in the U.S.A.

Their economy has a lot to do with it. A lot of young players don't go to school, have no jobs, and nowhere to go...so they hang out in the pool halls at an early age. The same background Efren came from.
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Yes. I'm sure that has a lot to do with it. But, where will our next crop of professional athletes come from, or pool players, for that matter? Do we have to wait until our economy is completely in the toilet again, like it was during the great depression? :frown:
 
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SJDinPHX said:
Yes. I'm sure that has a lot to do with it. But, where will our next crop of professional athletes come from, or pool players, for that matter? Do we have to wait until our economy is completely in the toilet again, like it was during the great depression? :frown:
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Quit feeding them. Sometimes in the PI, you don't eat if you don't win at pool or some other endeavor. They have kids standing in the middle of traffic in Manila selling cigarettes, one by one.
 
HawaiianEye said:
Quit feeding them. Sometimes in the PI, you don't eat if you don't win at pool or some other endeavor. They have kids standing in the middle of traffic in Manila selling cigarettes, one by one.
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Don't think that'll work. I lived the first 6-7 yrs. of my life during the depression. I remember meat, eggs, and sugar were a rare treat! We didn't really come out of it, 'til the end of WWII. (at which time I was 12-13).. My dad was in the moving business, and he couldn't even get gas for his truck!..I don't think we want to go back to those days again! :rolleyes:

PS..I never sold cigarettes, but I did sell apples!..:eek:
 
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SJDinPHX said:
PS..I never sold cigarettes, but I did sell apples!..:eek:
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I picked cotton as a kid, by hand, and pitched watermelons. Does that make me a slave? I need some reparations from somebody.

I learned to play pool as a kid and sometimes had $1,500 in hundreds in my pocket while my older brother was working 40 hours or more a week at an ice plant making about $2 an hour.

My mom used to ask me when I was going to get a job and I'd show her my cash and tell her I didn't need one at the time.
 
SJDinPHX said:
The game of pool is unique, in that there is some control over the mix of defense and offense, that will effect the outcome most of the time.
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Nope, Croquet is as well (hardly a surprise since it is pool's ancestor).

we need to do as the Brit's have done with snooker. Their success is obvious. There is only one game, one set of rules, and one size table.
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Everyone always has their own personal 'obvious' reason why two things achieve different success. Mine is that snooker allows betting by spectators as an integral part of the game. That is 'obviously' why it is doing better.

Pool is doing fine, just not in the USA. Any 'fix' needs to take that into consideration.

Thank you kindly.
 
JCIN said:
Yup. I'm just making it up. Me and the Wall Street Journal.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/why-baseball-is-losing-children-1432136172
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meh....maybe for you and the wsj.....we have more and more youth ball and travel teams and such growing every year down here. my little home town girls just won state.....highschool. lots of great players come out of louisiana. there is even a over 18 adult BASEBALL league/s quite a few people have asked me about making bats for themselves and their children.

maybe its just me
 
SJDinPHX said:
No, they have plenty of them, in fact most of them are invented over there. The big difference is, they are just a diversion (ie; passtime) not an obsession, like it has become with our youth. It seems the Asian's, the Pinoy's and the European's still appreciate learning a game that requires time and dedication to master.

Its too bad so few of our kids don't have that mindset. Ours are all about 'instant gratification'! As others have pointed out, our playgrounds are virtually empty these days. Our kids are all holed up in their rooms, texting or playing video games! :sorry:
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another great post
 
Contrary to some peoples thoughts , I have found that young boys and girls , {I have 3 children 11 grandchildren and 3 great grandchildren }. They all love to play pool or at least roll he balls around .
I see people bring their kid in to play pool and the same people that never spend a dime start talking like they are in a skid row bar.
They run them off in 15 or 20 minutes every time , same with the guys with their girlfriends, the deadbeats start sex talk when they come in.
I just can't fathom why the room owners allow these dregs of society to be there in the first place.
They don't spend any money, they knock everything, they get in everyone elses business , they run potential customers off and they are usually selling dope or stolen items in the pool room.
We have 4 or 5 of them that should be in a mental institution, they run all over the pool room screaming at the top of their lungs at each other from the time they hit the front door , until they leave.
I love pool , but I would never take any of my family in 95% of the pool rooms in the country that I have been to.
They all seem to be full of the same imbeciles.


They all seem to be full of the same imbeciles.
 
Corwyn_8 said:
Nope, Croquet is as well (hardly a surprise since it is pool's ancestor).



Everyone always has their own personal 'obvious' reason why two things achieve different success. Mine is that snooker allows betting by spectators as an integral part of the game. That is 'obviously' why it is doing better.

Pool is doing fine, just not in the USA. Any 'fix' needs to take that into consideration.

Thank you kindly.
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Legalised betting is definitely a factor, but perhaps because its legal here its not a big deal, whilst of course plenty of people do bet on games, in % terms its a very small minority of people and even then mostly for fun rather than serious bets.

Legalised gambling of course increases the prize pots through sponsorship, which helps, but before the betting companies starting putting down cash it was the cigarette companies (which isn't allowed now in Europe), so I think even if gambling was banned snooker in the UK at least would be fine (as someone else would step up to sponsor events).

I'm under the impression (and may be wrong) that there is a much larger betting culture in parts of Asia and it may well affect viewing figures there if you stopped gambling.

Anyway, the top snooker players are all multi-millionaire's, that is why its a popular game...with good prize money on offer a lot of people want to play, hence a lot of people come into contact with the game and there is general interest.

Also, perhaps a big factor is that the WC and the Masters are on free to air TV not cable/satellite, so everyone can watch for free.
 
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SJDinPHX said:
Wrong..Thats why God created 'alternate break'! ;)
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"God" didn't create the alternate break. It was dreamed up by a bunch of ninnies from Europe who decided to participate at the upper levels & found they couldn't compete so they cried until the format changed turning a gunslingers game into safety pool, an extremely boring version of what it was.
 
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