John Schmidt - how do you rate his one-pocket game?

[Roy Steffensen]

John Schmidt, the Derby Ciy Classic one-pocket Champion 2009. Went undefeated through a field of 350 players, including ALL the top one-pocket players.

How good is he? On a top ten list of the best in America (and the world), where would he be on that list?

I watched him in only one match at the DCC and that was in the final. I tried to get a bet on that match against many people, but just like me, all of them wanted to bet on Scott Frost. In the end I thought what the heck, so I made a bet on John instead.

Luckily for me, John won, but based on the impressions from the people I wanted to bet with, what I read on here etc., people rate Scott Frost as a much better one-pocket player.

I am watching the second All-Around Action Challenge now, in one-pocket, and when watching John Schmidt play against Danny Harriman I have to say that I feel Danny is playing better one-pocket than John, but John still does the job and he wins the set 10-9.

I know the other match also went 10-9, so they are obviously playing very even, but my impression is that Danny plays the game more correct, while John is more of a run-out player. I had the same feeling after the final of DCC. He won because it became a run-out match. He takes some chances, and most of the time he succeeds and runs the balls he needed.

I feel John's game is very aggressive, and it's obviously working ok for John. I kind of like that game, but I have the feeling that most of the one-pocket people prefer another kind of play...

So, how do you rate him in one-pocket compared to the other players, and do you think he would be a better player by not attacking as much?

 

[ShootingArts]

one pocket

Several times before, one-pocket has been redefined. Efren is not a good one-pocket player according to the standard before he came along. He doesn't really know how to play one-pocket, he just keeps being the world's best because he doesn't know any better!

Corey Dueul placed second in the DCC one-pocket division a few years back, not really playing a one-pocket game. He lost to Efren who doesn't really play "smart" one-pocket either.

I would say that there are probably over a dozen players that understand the game of one-pocket as it is currently played better than John, to say they know more moves, more escapes, and just have more knowledge of the game. As we saw at the DCC, that doesn't necessarily mean that they can beat him on a given day. Too, he may redefine the game in coming years as others have done before him.

I don't like putting my money on a coin toss so I wouldn't bet John in a long ahead set of one-pocket against the top few one-pocket specialists but I wouldn't bet against him either.

Hu

 

[s0lidz]

I watched the Action All Around II live and I got a somewhat similar impression. I couldn't say Danny is the better one pocket player. He may be a bit more patient at the table. That was definitely helping him during the match, though John still won.

I can't knock an aggressive style that produces results, and that is what John has done. Under most circumstances I would say the safer route is better, but John knows what his odds of success are with each of the decisions he makes. Apparently those decisions are correct for him more often than not, so I cannot agree that Danny plays the game "more correct". If John has good odds on making an aggressive shot, then that is "correct" for him. They have played 20 games of one pocket are dead even at this point, so it is very difficult to tell who is better.

The one thing that did stand out to me was Danny seemed to have more control over his emotions than John. But it still wasn't enough to sway the outcome of the match.

John was running out from everywhere during the Frost match. We only saw one moving battle and you can't really judge who is a better mover based on one battle. I can only come away with one conclusion and it was that John was better than Scott that night. If you take Scott and Danny's one pocket reputation into consideration, you have to conclude that John is up there with the best. Top 5-10 maybe.

This is just my opinion. It is based on the same 2 matches you saw.

 

[SpiderWebComm]

I think there might be a select few people in the U.S. who John would admit has a slight advantage in 1P, but that doesn't mean John can't beat them on any given day. When John's "on" - it gets pretty scary.

 

[Roy Steffensen]

Thanks for the inputs.

I have the same feeling, that John is capable of beating anyone on any given day.

When I was watching Bustamante-Feijen playing one-pocket too, it was the same thing. Very few moves, then Feijen ran 8 and out. he did that in 3 games, and won 3-0 in no time.

That's so scary with the top guys. They can run 8 and out even if you don't do big mistakes against them...

 

[Johnnyt]

Like was said before, if John is on, nobody has to like it...and that includes 10-ball, 9-ball, 8-ball, 1-hole, 14.1, and I'm not sure about banks. There is no tournament in the world that he wouldn't be one of the favorites to win. IMO. Johnnyt

 

[corvette1340]

He plays a hair better than I do.

 

[Bobby]

I don't think Scott Frost is "way better" than John Schmidt at one pocket as some people seem to think but he is the favorite probably by a ball. I'd rate Schmidt as maybe the 8th best in the U.S. and maybe top 12 in the world in one pocket.

 

[enzo]

i have been truly astonished over the last 5 or so years at how big shooting has become. i guess if you think of it like this it all makes sense: if efren averages 6 when he gets a shot, and his opponents 3. well, dont they have to play twice as good as him to win? in general anyway. and that is why i guess shooting is so big. i see shooters winning all the time now over far superior movers. accuracy tends to lend itself to better cb movement to though, so the shooters can be given an edge in that regard as well.

 

[sjm]

John must be counted as one of the superstars of one pocket at this point. Yes, there are a handful that move better than him, but John executes the offense as well, and perhaps better, than anyone. John is still developing as a one pocket player, too, and the sky is the limit as to how far he can go.

As a US Open 9-ball Championship winner, a Derby City One Pocket Champion, and a sure bet to win a world 14.1 championship at some point, John is in the process of putting together the kind of resume that the BCA Hall of Fame will have to stand up and notice.

 

[jtompilot]

I've got some extra money to put on John against Scott.

 

[jay helfert]

John must be counted as one of the superstars of one pocket at this point. Yes, there are a handful that move better than him, but John executes the offense as well, and perhaps better, than anyone. John is still developing as a one pocket player, too, and the sky is the limit as to how far he can go.

As a US Open 9-ball Championship winner, a Derby City One Pocket Champion, and a sure bet to win a world 14.1 championship at some point, John is in the process of putting together the kind of resume that the BCA Hall of Fame will have to stand up and notice.

Thanks for this. You read my mind. We're talking about a guy here who may well be the best all around player in the United States. John plays ALL games good! I don't care what game (except maybe Banks) you're talking about, I put John in the top ten. He has the firepower to put heat on anyone, from here or abroad. I'd love to see him visit the Philippines for a few weeks. He would get a lot of respect over there, and probably become an even better player.

If John has a weakness it may be a strange lack of confidence in his own ability. He seems to have a need to be the underdog. Bad news John, you aren't the underdog any more! You might even be the overdog! :thumbup2:

 

[Deadon]

If you think John is offensive, you should have seen Cole, Richie Florence, Keith and of course, Ronnie Allen. Cole, Richie and Keith would should at shots few people could even make and then run out, consistenly. John is right there with that style of play, and good at it. Don't count on better moves overcoming that kind of firepower.

 

[Deadon]

Hey Jay;

Ain't it so......

 

[jay helfert]

If you think John is offensive, you should have seen Cole, Richie Florence, Keith and of course, Ronnie Allen. Cole, Richie and Keith would should at shots few people could even make and then run out, consistenly. John is right there with that style of play, and good at it. Don't count on better moves overcoming that kind of firepower.

Ronnie said it best years ago, "The best move in One Pocket is eight and out!" And no one ever did it any better (or more frequently) than Ronnie.

 

[Roy Steffensen]

Thanks for this. You read my mind. We're talking about a guy here who may well be the best all around player in the United States. John plays ALL games good! I don't care what game (except maybe Banks) you're talking about, I put John in the top ten. He has the firepower to put heat on anyone, from here or abroad. I'd love to see him visit the Philippines for a few weeks. He would get a lot of respect over there, and probably become an even better player.

If John has a weakness it may be a strange lack of confidence in his own ability. He seems to have a need to be the underdog. Bad news John, you aren't the underdog any more! You might even be the overdog! :thumbup2:

I totally agree that his results shows that he is one of the very best all-around players, but I was more interested in inputs on his game, shot-selections etc.

I am told all the time to shoot one-pocket the "old" way, but imo John is definitely not doing that. He is going his own way and "firing off at everything". But he succeeds, and it is fun to watch him when he fires those shots off.

(I can only imagine the voices of JoeyA and Freddy The Beard during DCC, if I would try some of those shots John is shooting at )

John plays a game of one-pocket that I very much like, but I know it is not correct for me, though...

EDIT: One example that comes to mind was one that he DIDN'T succeed with, against Danny. It was a spot-shot with ball in hand, with 2 balls close to Danny's pocket. Both needed 2 balls, and he tried to pocket the spotted ball and play position for one of the 2 balls close to Danny's pocket. John missed the spot-shot and lost the game since Danny made the 2 balls close to his pocket the next shot.

The commentators said that John should absolutely not shoot the spotshot there, but get rid of the ball closest to Danny's pocket.

 

[Ken_4fun]

If you think John is offensive, you should have seen Cole, Richie Florence, Keith and of course, Ronnie Allen. Cole, Richie and Keith would should at shots few people could even make and then run out, consistenly. John is right there with that style of play, and good at it. Don't count on better moves overcoming that kind of firepower.

The sad thing was this all happened before video cameras. All those matches now are just a memory in a few minds.

Now we video tape are kids in all kinds of embarassing moments.

My mom was a great softball player about 35-40 years ago. I think of the lack of video often. Just not too often because it makes me sad....

Ken

 

[jay helfert]

I totally agree that his results shows that he is one of the very best all-around players, but I was more interested in inputs on his game, shot-selections etc.

I am told all the time to shoot one-pocket the "old" way, but imo John is definitely not doing that. He is going his own way and "firing off at everything". But he succeeds, and it is fun to watch him when he fires that shots off.

(I can only imagine the voices of JoeyA and Freddy The Beard during DCC, if I would try some of those shots John is shooting at )

John plays a game of one-pocket that I very much like, but I know it is not correct for me, though...

Roy,

I think John chooses the shot that is right for him. Reminds me of a famous Jim Rempe quote, "You can choose the 'wrong' shot, but if your execution is good, it doesn't matter."

 

[Roy Steffensen]

Ok, just for the fun of it:

Scott Frost, John Schmidt, Corey Deuel, Gabe Owen, Tony Chohan, Danny Harriman and Cliff Joyner in a group, round-robin race to 5.

Who do you think would win?

 

[MJR77]

Roy,

I think John chooses the shot that is right for him. Reminds me of a famous Jim Rempe quote, "You can choose the 'wrong' shot, but if your execution is good, it doesn't matter."

How do you remember all of these quotes? lol