Ralph Greenleaf -- a rummy?

9BallPaul

9BallPaul

Banned
I've been reading this board faithfully for nearly a decade, yet I've never heard mention of Ralph Greenleaf being a drunk. This quote came from R.A. Dyer, writing in Billiards Digest:

"One other detail about the pool legend - and an extremely important one at that: Ralph Greenleaf was a raging alcoholic. His heavy and often out-of-control binges cut his life short, and no doubt diminished his playing ability. Greenleaf would sometimes go missing for days or even weeks. And yet he still managed to dominate pool for nearly 15 years. Incredibly, there's also plenty of evidence that Greenleaf was playing drunk during many of his title runs. This is an astonishing fact. Make of it what you will."

So what do you make of it?

Source:
http://billiardsdigest.com/new_current_issue/apr_10/untoldindex.php
 
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9BallPaul said:
I've been reading this board faithfully for nearly a decade, yet I've never heard mention of Ralph Greenleaf being a drunk. This quote came from R.A. Dyer, writing in Billiards Digest:

"One other detail about the pool legend - and an extremely important one at that: Ralph Greenleaf was a raging alcoholic. His heavy and often out-of-control binges cut his life short, and no doubt diminished his playing ability. Greenleaf would sometimes go missing for days or even weeks. And yet he still managed to dominate pool for nearly 15 years. Incredibly, there's also plenty of evidence that Greenleaf was playing drunk during many of his title runs. This is an astonishing fact. Make of it what you will."

So what do you make of it?
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Common knowledge.

He died at age 50 from an acute internal hemorrhage while waiting to be seen at the emergency room. He had refused to go to the hospital for several days. This is very common occurrence in the later stages of severe alcoholism. Very sad.
 
It's true. Greenleaf was a huge drunk, often time binging between matches for the world championship. The only problem for everyone else was that he could play better drunk than the rest of the world could play sober.
 
Just to clarify my earlier post - internal hemorrhaging is caused by the use of substances that contain ethanol - which is not made for human consumption. Many alcoholics turn to the use of products that contain ethanol because they cannot afford consumable alcoholic beverages, or because they don't get the same effect from consumable alcoholics beverages anymore.
 
9BallPaul said:
I've been reading this board faithfully for nearly a decade, yet I've never heard mention of Ralph Greenleaf being a drunk. This quote came from R.A. Dyer, writing in Billiards Digest:

"One other detail about the pool legend - and an extremely important one at that: Ralph Greenleaf was a raging alcoholic. His heavy and often out-of-control binges cut his life short, and no doubt diminished his playing ability. Greenleaf would sometimes go missing for days or even weeks. And yet he still managed to dominate pool for nearly 15 years. Incredibly, there's also plenty of evidence that Greenleaf was playing drunk during many of his title runs. This is an astonishing fact. Make of it what you will."

So what do you make of it?

Source:
http://billiardsdigest.com/new_current_issue/apr_10/untoldindex.php
Click to expand...

He was way more than a drunk. Only "mostly" a drunk because alcohol was the easiest to get. Ralph also loved smoking his opium (and ANYTHING that basically got him high).

His quality of play didn't suffer much with the alcohol. Hal told me that Ralph wouldn't really warm up until after quite a bit of whiskey was down the pipe.

I recall one story where Hal and Ralph went into a pool room looking for 14.1 action (imagine that.. that tells you how long ago this was). Ralph was constantly broke and looked like a bum. No one really knew who he was -- he certainly looked NOTHING like the posters hanging up on the wall. When the locals got a look-see at the tattered and disheveled drunk looking to play whoever (after witnessing shot after shot disappearing *of whiskey*), they literally got into fist fights over who got to play him first.

It doesn't take a swami to figure out what happens next. The guys who lost the fight to play him soon figured they had actually won. At one point on the road, Hal told me that Ralph hadn't missed in a week --- and he said "literally." Meaning, shots he tried to make--- not including safeties.

He loved his "stuff" --- just like a lot of modern day players. It is what it is and it doesn't tarnish his image or achievements at all, imo. He's a pool player, not a priest.
 
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Blackjack said:
Just to clarify my earlier post - internal hemorrhaging is caused by the use of substances that contain ethanol - which is not made for human consumption. Many alcoholics turn to the use of products that contain ethanol because they cannot afford consumable alcoholic beverages, or because they don't get the same effect from consumable alcoholics beverages anymore.
Click to expand...

Dave:

A minor detail -- "ethanol" is a pseudonym for ethyl alcohol, which is the drinkable alcohol. Perhaps you instead meant methanol (methyl or wood alcohol), which is the deadly type that causes internal hemorrhages?

Isopropanol (isopropyl alcohol) is another non-potable/non-drinkable alcohol that causes severe gastric disturbances, and can cause hemorrhage as well if ingested in large quantities. In either wood or isopropyl alcohols, the stomach literally rips itself apart trying to get rid of it.

How do I know? Navy medical training (required for a particular collateral duty I had while on active duty).

-Sean
 
Blackjack said:
Just to clarify my earlier post - internal hemorrhaging is caused by the use of substances that contain ethanol - which is not made for human consumption. Many alcoholics turn to the use of products that contain ethanol because they cannot afford consumable alcoholic beverages, or because they don't get the same effect from consumable alcoholics beverages anymore.
Click to expand...

A lot of things can cause internal hemorrhaging. Too much asprin and the like is one of the biggest causes. Johnnyt

PS: There were and still are many great players that are drunks and drugies. I think Mosconi made Greenlief famous for the drinking by always talking and writing about it.
 
His life would make a great movie, full of glamour, glitz and tragedy. Esophageal hemorrhaging is also very common due to frequent vomiting and dry heaves...don't know if that was the cause or not, probably everything together contributed.
 
sfleinen said:
Dave:

A minor detail -- "ethanol" is a pseudonym for ethyl alcohol, which is the drinkable alcohol. Perhaps you instead meant methanol (methyl or wood alcohol), which is the deadly type that causes internal hemorrhages?

Isopropanol (isopropyl alcohol) is another non-potable/non-drinkable alcohol that causes severe gastric disturbances, and can cause hemorrhage as well if ingested in large quantities. In either wood or isopropyl alcohols, the stomach literally rips itself apart trying to get rid of it.

How do I know? Navy medical training (required for a particular collateral duty I had while on active duty).

-Sean
Click to expand...
You are correct, sir! Typo! lol
 
Willie and Ralph

When asked about his matches with Ralph Greenleaf, Willie Mosconi
replied "I will only say this....when I beat him, they said he was drinking.
But every time he beat me....he was drinking too."
 
He was from a different time. Back then drinking and drugging was thought of differently. You either sank with the addictions or you swam. Mr. Greenleaf was a swimmer when it came to playing pool, The rest of his life may have been a train wreck but when it came to playing pool he didn't offer no excuses.
 
Johnnyt said:
A lot of things can cause internal hemorrhaging. Too much asprin and the like is one of the biggest causes. Johnnyt

PS: There were and still are many great players that are drunks and drugies. I think Mosconi made Greenlief famous for the drinking by always talking and writing about it.
Click to expand...

JT:

Yup, I would tend to agree about Mosconi inflating the stories about Greenleaf, because Mosconi, in his need to always be the center attraction, was trying to put the final nails in the coffin in attempts to overshadow him.

-Sean
 
Absolutely. I've read this in many different places and Hal Houle told me about numerous time he had to go find Greenleaf, dead drunk usually, before an exhibition.
 
Greenleaf didn't just age, he shrivelled....

sfleinen said:
JT:

Yup, I would tend to agree about Mosconi inflating the stories about Greenleaf, because Mosconi, in his need to always be the center attraction, was trying to put the final nails in the coffin in attempts to overshadow him.

-Sean
Click to expand...

Most of us can recognize a shrivelled up drunk. Mosconi didn't have to do much convincing, it was obvious. Greenleaf deserves respect, but he did look like a 50 year old man with 100 year old integument. My sack looks better than he did.
 
sfleinen said:
Dave:

A minor detail -- "ethanol" is a pseudonym for ethyl alcohol, which is the drinkable alcohol. Perhaps you instead meant methanol (methyl or wood alcohol), which is the deadly type that causes internal hemorrhages?

Isopropanol (isopropyl alcohol) is another non-potable/non-drinkable alcohol that causes severe gastric disturbances, and can cause hemorrhage as well if ingested in large quantities. In either wood or isopropyl alcohols, the stomach literally rips itself apart trying to get rid of it.

How do I know? Navy medical training (required for a particular collateral duty I had while on active duty).

-Sean
Click to expand...

U R 2 Fing smart, but I like it. :D
 
9BallPaul said:
I've been reading this board faithfully for nearly a decade, yet I've never heard mention of Ralph Greenleaf being a drunk. This quote came from R.A. Dyer, writing in Billiards Digest:

"One other detail about the pool legend - and an extremely important one at that: Ralph Greenleaf was a raging alcoholic. His heavy and often out-of-control binges cut his life short, and no doubt diminished his playing ability. Greenleaf would sometimes go missing for days or even weeks. And yet he still managed to dominate pool for nearly 15 years. Incredibly, there's also plenty of evidence that Greenleaf was playing drunk during many of his title runs. This is an astonishing fact. Make of it what you will."

So what do you make of it?

Source:
http://billiardsdigest.com/new_current_issue/apr_10/untoldindex.php
Click to expand...
He was a drunk, end of story. Interestingly enough Hal Houle, who claimed to have started pool lessons with him, told me during one of his aiming lesson phone calls that Greenleaf was also a junkie. Don't know how valid that statement is.
 
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