Opinions on Joss cues?

Nate08 said:
excludes warpage only on replaceable parts.... sounds to me like the butt should be covered... IMO
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Further down in the warranty it states the following:
"We have no control over how the cue is used or the environment in which the cue is stored, we assume NO responsibility for warpage, breakage or any type of water damage."

Does anyone know if it is possible for a cue to warp for reasons other than exposure to water or the sun?
 
PoolSharkAllen said:
Does anyone know if it is possible for a cue to warp for reasons other than exposure to water or the sun?
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Yes.

Wood warps. It can happen even in a stable environment with wood that was of proper moisture content and age etc.

In other words, a natural process.

If you check a cue on a lathe you will often see slight variation over the course of months. Slight movements with the seasons would be likely and common I would say. Minimize this by controlling the storage environment as much a possible. But that goes out the window when you take the cue out to play.

If you warranty against warpage, like McDermott does, it does not mean it won't happen. It means you figured in a certain amount of warranty repairs/replacements into the costs of the products.

In spite of best efforts of the cue maker in materials and craftsmanship any cue can warp. Using the best materials, preparation, and craftsmanship minimizes this, but it can and does still happen. The best cues made by the best makers of the best materials using the best makers generally are very stable. When they do move it is minimal generally.


.
 
I had a custom that Dan made for me in the '70s. One of the few cues out of the many I've owned that I wish I could have back. The production models, while they are popular with many people, have nowhere neat the hit and feel of the one I had. If they did, I'd own one. I believe they now make a wood to wood joint that I would love to try but haven't encountered one yet. I'm not knocking the production models, I just don't like them myself.
Regarding Buckzapper, I've known him over twenty years and if he says it happened that way you can take it to the bank. Too bad and I'm personally surprised that Dan Janes reacted the way he did and I'm sure Buckzapper was also.
 
Chopdoc said:
Yes.

Wood warps. It can happen even in a stable environment with wood that was of proper moisture content and age etc.

In other words, a natural process.

If you check a cue on a lathe you will often see slight variation over the course of months. Slight movements with the seasons would be likely and common I would say. Minimize this by controlling the storage environment as much a possible. But that goes out the window when you take the cue out to play.

If you warranty against warpage, like McDermott does, it does not mean it won't happen. It means you figured in a certain amount of warranty repairs/replacements into the costs of the products.

In spite of best efforts of the cue maker in materials and craftsmanship any cue can warp. Using the best materials, preparation, and craftsmanship minimizes this, but it can and does still happen. The best cues made by the best makers of the best materials using the best makers generally are very stable. When they do move it is minimal generally.


.
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I would never keep my cue in a stable with all the animals.Come on Doc you know better.
 
Chopdoc said:
Yes.

Wood warps. It can happen even in a stable environment with wood that was of proper moisture content and age etc.

In other words, a natural process.

If you check a cue on a lathe you will often see slight variation over the course of months. Slight movements with the seasons would be likely and common I would say.


.
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You described slight, normal and natural variations. What would cause a cue butt to warp 1/2" in three months, as Buckzapper claims?
 
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I'm another fan of Joss Cues and Dan Janes. Top notch all the way and the best hit of any cue i've tried, and i've tried mnay.

I went to see Dan at his shop and bought a nice steel jointed custom from him. After playing with it for a few hours i wasn't sure i liked the feel of the shaft so i took it back to him for his input. It was a 12.5mm shaft and i was used to playing with a 13.25mm Dufferin. He said No problem, if your not happy with it then it's no good, I'll make you a new one, what do you want. 3 weeks later i picked my 14mm Euro taper shaft and OMG what a cue i have now!! I still have the original shaft as a backup.

As far as warpage, your cue is made of wood. It used to be a tree, now it's a cue. Some woods like being cues but occasionally some don't. There's no way a manufacturer can tell what will happen with the wood or how the cue is cared for, hence the warrenty disclaimers.

Brian :) <<<<<<<<<<Happy Joss Owner :thumbup:
 
bhale said:
I'm another fan of Joss Cues and Dan Janes. Top notch all the way and the best hit of any cue i've tried, and i've tried mnay.

I went to see Dan at his shop and bought a nice steel jointed custom from him. After playing with it for a few hours i wasn't sure i liked the feel of the shaft so i took it back to him for his input. It was a 12.5mm shaft and i was used to playing with a 13.25mm Dufferin. He said No problem, if your not happy with it then it's no good, I'll make you a new one, what do you want. 3 weeks later i picked my 14mm Euro taper shaft and OMG what a cue i have now!! I still have the original shaft as a backup.

As far as warpage, your cue is made of wood. It used to be a tree, now it's a cue. Some woods like being cues but occasionally some don't. There's no way a manufacturer can tell what will happen with the wood or how the cue is cared for, hence the warrenty disclaimers.

Brian :) <<<<<<<<<<Happy Joss Owner :thumbup:
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How is that thor break cue working out for you ?
 
JoseV said:
How is that thor break cue working out for you ?
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It' got a Very firm and sure feel to it, i can get a lot of feel as soon as i hit the cue ball and i'll know if it's a true hit or not. Dan suggested i try the lite version but i'm going to go back and have him load it up to something closer to my player, perhaps 22oz. The balance point is a tad further forward than my player and that feels good in the hand. I must admit i'm not goo goo over the look of the cue and i told him so, just my preferance, and he picked out one where the colors were a bit more muted than the pics you see on his site. It's the Ironwood verision. Initially i wanted one to match my player but $800+ was a bit much for a cue i don't use all that much. Yes, i rack more that i break.... :o

I've had the chance to shoot a few other breakers, mostly ones from 15-20 years ago, and i like the feel of this one better. JMPO

Brian :)
 
Dan Janes

Buckzapper said:
Reply to Xnotedgeanymore:

As a matter of fact, I wasn't. My son was and he was serving in Saudi Arabia at the time in the US Air Force and he felt it would be easier for me to contact Joss and see what could be done.
For those that doubt Joss has a warranty that sucks, I heard it directly, person to person from Danny James. If you can't stand behind a warranty on a cue 3 months old, its pretty sad.
I've talked quite a few young players out of buying a Joss cue and I don't intend to stop.
Tell Gary I said hi.
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I have known Dan since 1971 and consider him a good friend. Having said that Buckzapper is absolutely Full of S$$T.

Wedge
 
PoolSharkAllen said:
You described slight, normal and natural variations. What would cause a cue butt to warp 1/2" in three months, as Buckzapper claims?
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Outside of exposure to unusual forces, I have no idea.

Wood that was not properly aged/dried etc could do it I guess. But JOSS cues are all cored...so even that is less likely.

Probably best to ask a wood person or cue maker I would think.

So....I dunno....
 
bhale said:
It' got a Very firm and sure feel to it, i can get a lot of feel as soon as i hit the cue ball and i'll know if it's a true hit or not. Dan suggested i try the lite version but i'm going to go back and have him load it up to something closer to my player, perhaps 22oz. The balance point is a tad further forward than my player and that feels good in the hand. I must admit i'm not goo goo over the look of the cue and i told him so, just my preferance, and he picked out one where the colors were a bit more muted than the pics you see on his site. It's the Ironwood verision. Initially i wanted one to match my player but $800+ was a bit much for a cue i don't use all that much. Yes, i rack more that i break.... :o

I've had the chance to shoot a few other breakers, mostly ones from 15-20 years ago, and i like the feel of this one better. JMPO

Brian :)
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The color scheme dont bother me i been so waiting to pull the trigger and get one my self just for perrmisson from the wife
 
JoseV said:
The color scheme dont bother me i been so waiting to pull the trigger and get one my self just for perrmisson from the wife
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Aww, just do it, you'll be happy you did.

It's always eaiser to get forgivness than permission :)

Brian :)
 
I ordered a Joss cue from Long's Billiards in Newport News, Va. around 15 years ago. I went to Long's and picked out exactly what I wanted dealing with Tony Long (owner). I payed for the cue in advance and he ordered my cue.

Several weeks went by and Tony called me to come and pick up my cue. After picking it up I went straight to Pockets to hit some balls. After arriving in pockets I open the package and something noticed something wasn't right. We looked at the cue and realized it wasn't new but had been refurbished. With the help of another patron we were able to figure out who had owned the cue and when he traded it in to Long's, a week earlier by the way.

Being that Long's had been in business for 20+ years I never imagined this would've happened. I went back and talked to Tony and he denied it was used and refused to do anything about it. I left and called Joss Cues and ended up speaking with Dan Janes. He asked me to send him the cue which I did. After a week or so Dan called me and told me that the cue was made the year before and was not one of the 5 identical cues he sent to Long's.

He sent me the cue back and after receiving it I went back to Long's. Again Tony refused to take the cue back and give me the cue I ordered or refund my money. Dan Janes called me the next day to see if my issue had been resolved. After explaining to Dan that Tony refused to give me the cue I ordered or refund my money he got off the phone and called Long's. After a few minutes Tony was calling me asking me to come in and get my cue or a refund. I went there and he told me to pick out which Joss I wanted and told me to keep the other cue. I picked out my cue gave him the other one and left.

I like their cues and have nothing but positive remarks about the company. I would put Joss as one of better production cues makers out there.
 
Chopdoc said:
:D

Yeah, well....the cows need to play pool too ya know...
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The last time the cows played they left an udder mess around the table.
And i think Joss makes a fine cue. I tried one out once and passed on it. I did not like the shaft taper and it too stiff for me.
 
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