Pretty profound Lux....
And I agree. I mean, send the guy an old cue lying around and put your autograph on it and call it a day.....
AZ member screwed by Bill Stroud of Josswest
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Pretty profound Lux....
And I agree. I mean, send the guy an old cue lying around and put your autograph on it and call it a day.....
No its not. I'm sure that Bill wishes that everyone felt that way.
This isn't like the break up of a nasty relationship, where that advice can be given to your best buddy.
After the first couple of threads, Bill posted that the DYD cue would be built before his equipment would be sold.
Hammi finally posted and gave his true feelings toward Bill and the cue.
Hammi hasn't been around for a while. I wonder why.
Some seem to think that because of Bill's rep, he should get a pass for one mistake. Not a chance. As far as I'm concerned, I hope these threads keep popping up as a reminder to both Bill and others who may not know what went down.
All it would take is for Bill to post his reasons, appologize, and maybe send Hammi a JW
to make up for it. Then I could say it fair to let things drop.
Living Legend
Banned
so what ever happen with the situation when the guy burned you with the chalk?
I hear ya, but there is nothing that you or I can do to make BS step up and do the right thing.
After two years, I'll bet you $100 he isn't going to either!!!
I finally got my money back but I still lost a bit on it.
Even at the end, the guy tried to make it seem that he was doing me a huge favor by returning my money. He never returned it, Pay Pal did. Much more to it than that. I'd never do business with him again in a hundred years. Nothing but BS and lies. For me, lesson learned.
Thanks for remembering and asking.
Even at the end, the guy tried to make it seem that he was doing me a huge favor by returning my money. He never returned it, Pay Pal did. Much more to it than that. I'd never do business with him again in a hundred years. Nothing but BS and lies. For me, lesson learned.
Thanks for remembering and asking.
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The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
Amen! well said. You are not a cynic but a person of character who does not fit in with the people you described in your previous post. Others see it as well.
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I LOVE dld's posts. Always very well documented and well written...
LOL ...melt some sugar under your tongue buddy, you're way to sour.
To OP: Bill was probably to proud to make a free cue for a "nobody". Your friend's loss is not even close to his on this. IMO.
Chris
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
LOL ...melt some sugar under your tongue buddy, you're way to sour.
To OP: Bill was probably to proud to make a free cue for a "nobody". Your friend's loss is not even close to his on this. IMO.
Chris
Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2
" you make it right " thats what my Dad always taught me....
Ive always wondered how bad do you beat his ass when you see the cue you designed for the contest, for sale at his booth. god knows there were no good ones.
Happy Fall 2012.
Well, it's now closing in on 2 years since az'er mhaimi won the "Design Your Dream" contest and Bill Stroud still hasn't presented him with his dream cue. For all we know, there may not have even been one turn on the wood for this cue.
Sad that Bill whipped so many members here into a frenzy, or at least excited us, over the possibility of being chosen to have one of our designs chosen and built by him, for free.
Why hasn't he come through for the winner? Why has there been such a lack of communication? Only Bill Stroud knows the answers..
What is known is that Bill has claimed to be going out of cuemaking and was advertising his equipment for sale.
And we know he said he is recommitting himself to be a tournament player and spending much of his time on that quest.
Bill posted in a thread he started just before he began the DYD thread that it shouldn't take a cuemaker longer than 8 weeks to build a cue, start to finish. So the DYD design might take a little longer but c'mon, not 2 years.
The bottom line is that Bill, unilaterally, decided he wanted to run a contest and he has failed to keep his end of the bargain.
I think it stinks and should leave a black mark on his legacy.
At this point, I don't think my opinion of him would change any even if he were to award the cue to mhaimi tomorrow. For me, the damage is done.
How insulting.
best,
brian kc
I have kept quiet out of respect for Bill in the faint hopes that he would come through.
It escapes my why a cue maker who has such an accomplished career would crap on his own legacy in the end.
I can tell you from many years of business experience that there is a certain mentality asociated with charitable donations, doing something for free. The mentality goes something like "I'm doing it for free, so shut up and take what I give you and be grateful, and aren't I great for doing it".
While I am sure his intentions were originally sincere, I believe Bill overestimated his personal motivation to deliver a "free" dream cue. Free is the key word.
Lol, this crap is'nt even gonna leave a scratch in Bills legacy. He's done waayyyy more good for this sport than bad, and his cues will undoubtedly bring Gus money after he's gone. He's a living legend, and deserves a great deal more respect, than you're showing him, even if he did'nt come thru with a free cue. For all we know the doctor may have told him he has mos. to live due to hazards of building cues for years, and he better make the most of them.
I guess you guys won't be voting for president either as, no matter who you vote for, you can bet your a$$ there will be lies told, and promises broken.
I'm so sure y'all are such better men than Mr. Stroud is, and have every right in the world to throw stones, since apparently you've never told a lie, nor broken a promise.
Mayhap to some, you're coming off like heros, but to me, you're nothing but zeros:sorry:
I guess you guys won't be voting for president either as, no matter who you vote for, you can bet your a$$ there will be lies told, and promises broken.
I'm so sure y'all are such better men than Mr. Stroud is, and have every right in the world to throw stones, since apparently you've never told a lie, nor broken a promise.
Mayhap to some, you're coming off like heros, but to me, you're nothing but zeros:sorry:
Lol, this crap is'nt even gonna leave a scratch in Bills legacy. He's done waayyyy more good for this sport than bad, and his cues will undoubtedly bring Gus money after he's gone. He's a living legend, and deserves a great deal more respect, than you're showing him, even if he did'nt come thru with a free cue. For all we know the doctor may have told him he has mos. to live due to hazards of building cues for years, and he better make the most of them.
I guess you guys won't be voting for president either as, no matter who you vote for, you can bet your a$$ there will be lies told, and promises broken.
I'm so sure y'all are such better men than Mr. Stroud is, and have every right in the world to throw stones, since apparently you've never told a lie, nor broken a promise.
Mayhap to some, you're coming off like heros, but to me, you're nothing but zeros:sorry:
I play with a JW. I attended his cue show. I collected his cues. I have studied his innovations and admired his work.
Sorry, but his failure, or moreso the lack of accountability and explanation, has left me scratching my head wondering what would make an otherwise accomplished man do this to himself.
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If anyone has one of these devalued cues...Please let me know...
Everyone I see for sale is usually priced at top dollar...
I'd love to have another one...or two...
Please send pics and devalued price.
BS may have made a bad decision, but I was raised to forgive everyone for whatever they have done (go figure, I'm a Christian, and I'll let God judge people for their actions), but I guess crucifixion, is just part of the normal world that YOU live in.
Obviously, You want a judge and jury, and a lifetime sentence for a single mistake...as compared to the 40 years of historical value that he has brought to our beloved sport.
I've got an ex-wife that has the same mentality as you, obviously, neither of you will ever grow up, or mature to the point of moving on, and living your own life...so, go ahead and continue your plighted efforts to degrade the legacy of JW cues.
Why can't you move on...it's part of life...good things happen to bad people, and bad things happen to good people, it's all part of the book that was written long before we ever existed.
And, again, Please send pics and devalued pricing...I'll be happy to add a few more to my collection.
Everyone I see for sale is usually priced at top dollar...
I'd love to have another one...or two...
Please send pics and devalued price.
BS may have made a bad decision, but I was raised to forgive everyone for whatever they have done (go figure, I'm a Christian, and I'll let God judge people for their actions), but I guess crucifixion, is just part of the normal world that YOU live in.
Obviously, You want a judge and jury, and a lifetime sentence for a single mistake...as compared to the 40 years of historical value that he has brought to our beloved sport.
I've got an ex-wife that has the same mentality as you, obviously, neither of you will ever grow up, or mature to the point of moving on, and living your own life...so, go ahead and continue your plighted efforts to degrade the legacy of JW cues.
Why can't you move on...it's part of life...good things happen to bad people, and bad things happen to good people, it's all part of the book that was written long before we ever existed.
And, again, Please send pics and devalued pricing...I'll be happy to add a few more to my collection.
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bill has always been a stand up guy and kept his word. so my guess is what happened is he got fed up with making cues and quit cold turkey. then forgot about the free cue and never looked back at making it. and doesnt want to and probably cant at this time.
so what can he do? the only right thing is to have another top cue maker make something for the winner, or find an older joss and have it refinished and present that with pride.
bill is not a poor man and can afford to make the prize whole and leave him in good graces with the pool community as he retires in peace.
so what can he do? the only right thing is to have another top cue maker make something for the winner, or find an older joss and have it refinished and present that with pride.
bill is not a poor man and can afford to make the prize whole and leave him in good graces with the pool community as he retires in peace.
I think something is lost on many of you. Folks who probably never read the original thread.
This isn't simply a case of some guy offering a cue for a prize, and renigging on it. Bill Stroud not only started the contest, he promoted it here. He was a constant contributor to the process, and talked about cue making and the need for fresh ideas incessantly throughout the contest. This was indeed all about him, and then he dropped the ball. When it came time to deliver.
So for all you folks who think this is no big deal, and not a black mark on his character, go and read that entire thread, and see if you feel the same way.
For the record, I did not have an entry in the contest, so its not sour grapes from me. I followed the contest because it interested me. The way this has ended is really crappy. And it should be brought up now and again.
This isn't simply a case of some guy offering a cue for a prize, and renigging on it. Bill Stroud not only started the contest, he promoted it here. He was a constant contributor to the process, and talked about cue making and the need for fresh ideas incessantly throughout the contest. This was indeed all about him, and then he dropped the ball. When it came time to deliver.
So for all you folks who think this is no big deal, and not a black mark on his character, go and read that entire thread, and see if you feel the same way.
For the record, I did not have an entry in the contest, so its not sour grapes from me. I followed the contest because it interested me. The way this has ended is really crappy. And it should be brought up now and again.
justadub and luxury both make good points, imo.
for those who may not have had the chance and are so inclined, below is the link to the original DYD thread that garnered over 17,500 views and more than 800 responses. Also worth noting is that it went on for m-o-n-t-h-s, and yes, Bill was there the entire way, making his periodic "cuts" that disappointed some and excited others. The idea behind this was brilliant, fun, and should not finish like it is. thanks dub for bringing up the original thread.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=203624&highlight=design+dream
I don't think Luxury's point can be emphasized enough. That being how Bill has the opportunity to make this right every day he wakes up - or not. It's still his choice. And you can bet your last nickel that even though he may have sold off all of his cuemaking equipment, he still has plenty of friends in the biz who would gladly let him use their shops to finish this up.
No one has brought it up but some of you are aware that I have a small wager with my pal iba over whether Bill will complete this cue by year's end. I already lost once with it not being done by June.
So there will be no appearance of impropriety over this thread going up, I will make the following pledge and would do it in a transparent way for all to see:
If the cue were to be made and I won, I would give the winnings to charity PLUS I would match it so the charity will receive the bet x 2.
The only motivation I have for 'not letting this go' is that a large number of az'ers, including myself, were played for fools.
Contest winner, mhaimi, should get his dream cue.
best,
brian kc
for those who may not have had the chance and are so inclined, below is the link to the original DYD thread that garnered over 17,500 views and more than 800 responses. Also worth noting is that it went on for m-o-n-t-h-s, and yes, Bill was there the entire way, making his periodic "cuts" that disappointed some and excited others. The idea behind this was brilliant, fun, and should not finish like it is. thanks dub for bringing up the original thread.
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=203624&highlight=design+dream
I don't think Luxury's point can be emphasized enough. That being how Bill has the opportunity to make this right every day he wakes up - or not. It's still his choice. And you can bet your last nickel that even though he may have sold off all of his cuemaking equipment, he still has plenty of friends in the biz who would gladly let him use their shops to finish this up.
No one has brought it up but some of you are aware that I have a small wager with my pal iba over whether Bill will complete this cue by year's end. I already lost once with it not being done by June.
So there will be no appearance of impropriety over this thread going up, I will make the following pledge and would do it in a transparent way for all to see:
If the cue were to be made and I won, I would give the winnings to charity PLUS I would match it so the charity will receive the bet x 2.
The only motivation I have for 'not letting this go' is that a large number of az'ers, including myself, were played for fools.
Contest winner, mhaimi, should get his dream cue.
best,
brian kc
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Bill has also always marched to his own drum and done things his way. He's also a very proud man. It's possible that all questioning his integrity here on AZ has caused him to shut down totally on this project.
Sean------->not condoning what happened either, just saying
Whoever thinks it isn't a big deal is crazy. It's not like everyone here on azb drew a ticket and hoped their number was picked. As a community, we prob had hundreds and hundreds of hours invested into designing our cues--- some of which were really detailed and professionally rendered. Many of us had to fade our wives/girl friend's BS of why we were in front of the computer instead of at the dinner table (while either feverishly working on last-minute details in our graphics/design app or checking to see if we made a final cut).
Regardless of what anyone says on here, I don't consider this a FREE SHOT---- unless all of you work for free and don't think your time is money. I think if there's any contest where you have to DO SOMETHING to win a cue, it's the SAME as PAYING FOR IT.
I know when I won the Pierce Logo Cue, I had a TON of hours invested in PhotoShop and countless logos submitted. I felt as though I paid for it.
Nice of you guys to just say "Ah screw it -- it was only a broken promise." I'm SHOCKED (stress SHOCKED) the winner hasn't paid Bill a personal visit to offer him a little encouragement. If any of you paid for the cue -- bet you wouldn't--- and that's how I view it. Mhaimi PAID for that cue with his TREMENDOUS wasted time.
Regardless of what anyone says on here, I don't consider this a FREE SHOT---- unless all of you work for free and don't think your time is money. I think if there's any contest where you have to DO SOMETHING to win a cue, it's the SAME as PAYING FOR IT.
I know when I won the Pierce Logo Cue, I had a TON of hours invested in PhotoShop and countless logos submitted. I felt as though I paid for it.
Nice of you guys to just say "Ah screw it -- it was only a broken promise." I'm SHOCKED (stress SHOCKED) the winner hasn't paid Bill a personal visit to offer him a little encouragement. If any of you paid for the cue -- bet you wouldn't--- and that's how I view it. Mhaimi PAID for that cue with his TREMENDOUS wasted time.
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