no backpause= more english

S

Slh

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I play using a backpause. I have a very good player constantly telling me I shoud get rid of the backpause because he says "it's like jumping without taking a run-up and you create less english this way". This guy has been playing for 40+ years and he is a very good player ( averaging 1 in 3 cushions). He has the "old conception" of stroke: looser grip = more cb reaction, more follow-through more english, no backpause more english, etc.
I'm quite sure this is bs, but could somebody clarify this?
 
Think about it. There is still a back pause, even if you try to avoid it. You pull the cue back and even if you instantly start accelerating, there is a stop. In order to reverse the movement, even for a fraction of a second, your hand/cue will come to a pause, or stop. I think I learned it in the 2nd grade.

So what's the difference if you stop for 1/10 second or 1 second? Yeah, it's BS by him, but not intentional, he doesn't know better, and uses methods he thinks work better for him. To each his own.


- Margus.
 
Slh said:
I play using a backpause. I have a very good player constantly telling me I shoud get rid of the backpause because he says "it's like jumping without taking a run-up and you create less english this way". This guy has been playing for 40+ years and he is a very good player ( averaging 1 in 3 cushions). He has the "old conception" of stroke: looser grip = more cb reaction, more follow-through more english, no backpause more english, etc.
I'm quite sure this is bs, but could somebody clarify this?
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Ok easy shots say less than 1/4 to 1/2 ball hit with CB close to them at bottom half of the table, almost everyone can make them no matter how they stroke, pause no pause, just go down and shoot, ..etc, because the margin of error for pocketing is huge (aim margin is large, unless you have less than 1/2 pocket) compared to OB at end of table shooting at bottom corners then aim margin is very small, or larger than 1/2 ball cut.

Your friend is already there, he tried everything under the sun and for the time being he reached to this conclusion for obvious reasons, he shoots good, is it because his position play is excellent and all shots he make are easy after a hard key shot, or he continuously making hard shots, also is he gambling or sociable big difference.

Loose grip and follow through are a must so you must utilize the weight of the cue and be able to play position accurately in lieu of you hand and muscle trying to gauge speed.

Back to stroke, pause is critical IMO, depending when the pause takes place, i think pause with tip almost touching CB is critical to line up tip to exact tip contact point, Pause while your tip furthest from CB helps reset the muscles for forward motion.

What ever you do do not do fast back swing.
 
It is much easier to move the cueball without a noticeable pause in the backswing. Some time ago, I read an article that advocated that, written by a professional, and it definitely works. However, as pointed out, long shots require more accuracy, and it takes a lot of practice. It also definitely puts you in a rhythm. I have tried the long pause, and it causes me to tense up. As with most things, it is a matter of practice and personal preference, but for this subject, it is not bs. When everything is smooth and in rhythm, you can make that cueball talk.
 
When i'm in stroke I have a slight back pause, when i'm not sometimes the back pause goes away. I find I play better with a back pause, not as long as some guys, i lose the line if i stay back too long.

However I believe I can get more juice on the rock with a slight pause, If I just fire with no pause I dont hit the rock where I need/want to and therefore get less desirable results. Even using TOI(best I can, lots to learn there) I strike the CB better with a slight pause.

I had a shot come up the other night that was a variation of the 3 rails around the world get to the other end of the table for shape. I needed a bit more inside than the TOI system, I had to juice the rock lots, I was fairly straight, if I could spin it enough I was good because the spin would carry the CB around the box, the cloth was VERY dry. I told my friend "Watch you'll like this", I just saw the line, since I been playing around with TOI some my confidence was there. I'm kinda out of stroke too. POW!!! I fired it in 100 MPH when the CB hit the first rail it speed way up from the side spin and my line coming into shape was like a 3C player, I would have hit the ball I was playing shape for. Yeah i'm proud of that shot, wow. For a moment I looked like a champion, and to answer your question, I did pause at the top. If didnt it would have been a chop at that OB at best and I'm sure I wouldnt have hit the CB perfect as I did.

Sorry for the story but wow what a shot!! best shot I fired in since last December in London, As I typed this I was thinking and a slight pause in necessary IMO to reset your muscles so they fire right, the electrical impulses form your brain to body is what moves your arm & cue. if there is no pause at all and its one movement its a stretch followed by a contraction of your muscles, lots of moving parts. So anatomically speaking there has to be a pause.

I think the guy telling you what he did may have good intentions but might not be aware of what he really does, i seen thin many times before, great players who dont really understand why they play great. I'd like to have that problem, thats like being rich and stupid, how good would that be? all fun no stress.


you have to pause even if its .25 seconds there has to be a reset between the stretch and contraction(shot).


thats how i seee it,
eric:smile:
 
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Shane pauses but before his backstroke... that is something that I did naturally as well. I find this to be a bit better. I'm not big on SPF when it comes to pausing at the end of your backswing.

I really liked the analogy you used when it comes to running and stopping then jumping as oppsed to running and jumping.
 
There's nothing wrong with a backpause, depending on what is going through your mind in that extra time, if it's good .. then good, if it is uncertainty, then pause less. ;)
 
I pondered whether or not to reply to this post as I am certainly no expert or a PRO player. This is a subjective issue. Like wine, everyone has a different "taste."
I personally agree with what a lot of what has been said here, and can relate to what Naji & Fatboy have said concerning the pause. There are times I don't want any pause on my backstroke.

To the OP: (and this is why I posted), Are you trying to develop your own stroke,.... or one that is like his?? If the latter, I would listen to him, as experience would be your teacher.
 
Slh said:
I play using a backpause. I have a very good player constantly telling me I shoud get rid of the backpause because he says "it's like jumping without taking a run-up and you create less english this way". This guy has been playing for 40+ years and he is a very good player ( averaging 1 in 3 cushions). He has the "old conception" of stroke: looser grip = more cb reaction, more follow-through more english, no backpause more english, etc.
I'm quite sure this is bs, but could somebody clarify this?
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Show us a video clip of your swing....
 
With some exceptions ie Ceulemans, Butera.... every pro player has some length of pause at the the end of the backstroke. There are many that its not noticable but there. With a slow backstroke the pause comes naturally how ever long or short it might be.

This is anecdotal but as far as the back pause reducing applied english I challange anybody to top the ability of these 2 players when it comes to making the CB burn rubber.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tihmp1-T2Ko
 
Slh said:
I play using a backpause. I have a very good player constantly telling me I shoud get rid of the backpause because he says "it's like jumping without taking a run-up and you create less english this way". This guy has been playing for 40+ years and he is a very good player ( averaging 1 in 3 cushions). He has the "old conception" of stroke: looser grip = more cb reaction, more follow-through more english, no backpause more english, etc.
I'm quite sure this is bs, but could somebody clarify this?
Click to expand...

I think he is wrong. A pause should increase accuracy in your stroke which will aid in applying more spin.

I hate to look on the negative but is it possible that he may be trying to sabotage your stroke or does he truly believe that his way is better. Maybe it works for him because he has adjusted to his poor mechanics.

At any rate I would stick with the way you are currently doing it. especially if you are getting the desired results.
 
Slh said:
I play using a backpause. I have a very good player constantly telling me I shoud get rid of the backpause because he says "it's like jumping without taking a run-up and you create less english this way". This guy has been playing for 40+ years and he is a very good player ( averaging 1 in 3 cushions). He has the "old conception" of stroke: looser grip = more cb reaction, more follow-through more english, no backpause more english, etc.
I'm quite sure this is bs, but could somebody clarify this?
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I don't see any relation between the two.

Either you hit the intended spot of the cb, with the intended force of stroke......or you don't. Doesn't matter how you do it.

Personally, I actually increase my pause when I'm intending more cb action as it allows me to be even more precise with my cueing.
 
Slh said:
I play using a backpause. I have a very good player constantly telling me I shoud get rid of the backpause because he says "it's like jumping without taking a run-up and you create less english this way". This guy has been playing for 40+ years and he is a very good player ( averaging 1 in 3 cushions). He has the "old conception" of stroke: looser grip = more cb reaction, more follow-through more english, no backpause more english, etc.
I'm quite sure this is bs, but could somebody clarify this?
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I think the more you pause, they more time you have to change your mind about where to aim. Gives you too much time to choke on a shot.

Just screws up your rhythm and too much time to change your mind.

But whatever works for one person might not work for another.


And for real, I don't even think about it when I shoot. I might pause myself...don't know and don't care. And what ball I look at last before I shoot...don't know that either. I do think it depends on what shot it is though.


So no...it is not BS.
 
It's all about what makes you feel more precise with the cue ball. If no back pause does that for you, then that's something that works for you. I'm sure Niels Feijen would think otherwise because he's been doing something that REALLY works for him for years!
 
thanks for all the replies.
Cdryden said:
I think he is wrong. A pause should increase accuracy in your stroke which will aid in applying more spin.

I hate to look on the negative but is it possible that he may be trying to sabotage your stroke or does he truly believe that his way is better. Maybe it works for him because he has adjusted to his poor mechanics.

At any rate I would stick with the way you are currently doing it. especially if you are getting the desired results.
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no, no way he trying to sabotage me, he is genuinely trying to help me.

The problem is I don't want "piss him off" saying "thanks for your advice but I don't want to follow it" because the guy is sharing me a lot of knowledge
 
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You're still "running up to jump" with or without a pause, it's just that your not still running when you get to your starting point. You don't see any long jumper running to his "spot" and continue to the board. The analogy doesn't fit. Your starting point in this example IS where you start the forward stroke.

In that you're not making contact with the cueball during the pause or the lack thereof it doesn't matter.

It is your forward stroke and it alone that would affect what happens to whitey. Your pause/not may affect your stroke but ultimately develop consistency and pause or not and stick with it.

If this is your coach, listen to him, I'm sure a no pause can work for you.
 
Slh said:
thanks for all the replies.

no, no way he trying to sabotage me, he is genuinely trying to help me.

The problem is I don't want "piss him off" saying "thanks for your advice but I don't want to follow it" because the guy is sharing me a lot of knowledge
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Very few carom players have a pause at the back. Lots of snooker players do. I think it is hard to change -- I've tried to pause at the back and it screws up my timing at least for the limited time I've given it.

How about trying to play shots without a pause for a while and see how it goes. Try to do the practice -- not a match -- while your friend is around. If it goes poorly, ask him for suggestions.

In the end you will have to go with one set of timing. I think it is no good to choose between pause/no pause on each shot. You need to be consistent.

As for the more action, I don't believe it.
 
Slh said:
thanks for all the replies.

no, no way he trying to sabotage me, he is genuinely trying to help me.

The problem is I don't want "piss him off" saying "thanks for your advice but I don't want to follow it" because the guy is sharing me a lot of knowledge
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That's good. I hope you're able to work it out.

The only reason I mentioned that is that I have seen it happen before. Some people are petty and will do anything to get a edge on someone.
 
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