Matlock vs Keith

JAM

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
If AzB's info is correct, Keith was born 4/9/1957.

That means that his 19th birthday was in 1976 and his 25th birthday was in 1982.

That's a pretty young and brief "prime." But perhaps he wasn't far from prime in a bunch of other years.

I know you're the pool stats guy, so to speak, but Keith's prime, meaning his highest level, was between those years, according to Keith. Keith still had a pool streak after that time, but those years were his strongest. He peaked as a teenager, mainly because he had been playing pool, hitting THOUSANDS of balls every day, as a young boy.

Keith played championship-level pool after '82, especially in gambling. In fact, this is where he may have shined the brightest, in my opinion. Nobody knows how strong he played for sure. He won the BC Open in 1985 for 25K, defeating quite a few name-brand pool stars, but tournaments, as we all know, are usually short races. They don't really illustrate a player's capabilities sometimes. With the break and rolls, 9-ball especially can come down to a game of luck. Heck, he would have won the 2003 U.S. Open if it hadn't been for getting food poisoning the morning of the finals. And he hadn't picked up a stick in a month before that tournament.

When you've hit thousands of balls every day of your life since the age of 10, you tend to live and breathe pool, and that was Keith's life, literally. He used to sleep under the tables at Bob's Billiarsd as a young boy. They would lock the pool room up at night with him in it to keep him safe. At one time, young Keith's baseball game was so strong that he had contemplated getting into baseball, but when his home life deteriorated after the death of his mother, the pool room became his home and its regulars were now his family.

Action is what separates the lions from the lambs in ahead sets and multiple races. Keith's problem when on the road in pool was he didn't know when to quit. He would stay up multiple nights in a row if there was action still available. Many players would watch Keith in this mode and wait for the third or fourth day when Keith was burned out to ask him to play some. That was the only way they had a chance at winning. A fresh Keith would have pulvarized them, and they knew it. That was the well-known secret how to trap Keith McCready. Sometimes it worked; sometimes it didn't, thanks to chemical warfare. :(

I remember reading Grady Mathews' posts on AzBilliards years ago. People, especially trolls and newbies, would sometimes pummel Grady with ugly words, and it would incense Grady to no end, often triggering a reply that was, well, over the top. I understand more today why Grady reacted the way he did back then. When you are a lifetime pool player, it is upsetting to read words written by nobodies that have no respect for your pool strengths in life. Oftentimes, this is all a pool player has to cling onto when they grow old. Grady was fortunate to have a loving wife and family; others aren't so lucky. No matter what the trolls and nobodies write, the legend of Grady Mathews lives, and so, too, does Keith McCready's. As long as I'm alive, I won't allow trolls and nobodies to denigrate Keith's legacy.
 

JAM

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Such high praise:







And this is, of course, assuming that is even Keith posting for himself.

The rest of your post is just sniping and name calling (some would even call it trolling), so I won't respond to it.

Trolling, trolling, trolling. Keep those fingers trolling, SakuTroll. Keith has given David high praise. You should copy-and-paste the other paragraphs Keith wrote praising David, as well, if you're going to quote him. But then that wouldn't be as much fun for a troll, would it?
 

JAM

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Im not kidding....

WTH is Charlie-car?

Ken

I've learned a lot of pool jargon from Keith, some expressions I hadn't heard before. That "Charlie-car" is one of them. I will ask him when he wakes up what it means. :p

One thing about this thread, at least a few new pool slang has come to the fore: "Charlie-car" and "buzzer."

Recently, when I posted the '88 World Brunswick Open McCready v. Reyes match, I heard Keith say something at Counter 22.14, and I asked him about that, "Georgie Pine." He said it means something good, like "George." I'm not sure what the "Pine" has to do with it, though. :grin-square:

Efren commits a foul at Counter 21:25, and then Keith mentions the Georgie Pine at Counter 22:14 ---> HERE
 
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I'm not the one trying to drag Keith thru the mud for something that should have been laughed about.

Isn't he merely expressing his opinion that one player was/is better than another? Is he not entirely justified in making that claim?

Quite why this degree of protectionism is allowed to continue is anyone's guess. The reason is laughable; censorship and tyranny the outcome.

All players are fair game - past, present and future. Find me the perfect player and I'll make an exception.
 

JAM

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member

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Ken_4fun

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I've learned a lot of pool jargon from Keith, some expressions I hadn't heard before. That "Charlie-car" is one of them. I will ask him when he wakes up what it means. :p

One thing about this thread, at least a few new pool slang has come to the fore: "Charlie-car" and "buzzer."

Recently, when I posted the '88 World Brunswick Open McCready v. Reyes match, I heard Keith say something at Counter 22.14, and I asked him about that, "Georgie Pine." He said it means something good, like "George." I'm not sure what the "Pine" has to do with it, though. :grin-square:

Efren commits a foul at Counter 21:25, and then Keith mentions the Georgie Pine at Counter 22:14 ---> HERE



I remember a few years ago Keith came on AZ and told about shot he called loopy lou or something like that....:rolleyes:

Another question.

I never got to see Louie Roberts play but in Memphis the owner of the room backed Louie many times. He said that Louie couldn't care less about money. He said Louie was an "action junkie". Money was the enabler so Louie could get in action. He wasn't looking for the next big score, he was looking to play and beat someone.

My take on Keith he is kind of a hybrid of looking to make money, but he was an action junkie too.

LR and KM gave out spots not so much to entice, they gave spots to see if they could outrun the nuts.

Take CJ, no disrespect meant here, but I get the feeling that CJ was about the money.

Is that fair or accurate?

Not many of those guys. The ones I can think of like that is Tony Watson (maybe a few years ago). But today, players aren't as much of action junkies and are more interested in;
a) not losing money
b) having such a good game that they should make money.

Ken
 
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JAM

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I remember a few years ago Keith came on AZ and told about shot he called loopy lou or something like that....:rolleyes:

Another question.

I never got to see Louie Roberts play but in Memphis the owner of the room backed Louie many times. He said that Louie couldn't care less about money. He said Louie was an "action junkie". Money was the enabler so Louie could get in action. He wasn't looking for the next big score, he was looking to play and beat someone.

My take about Keith he is kind of a hybrid of looking to make money, but he was an action junkie too.

Is that fair or accurate?

Not many of those guys. The ones I can think of like that is Tony Watson (maybe a few years ago). But today, players aren't as much of action junkies and are more interested in a) not losing money, b) having such a good game that they should make money.

Ken

I'd agree with that observation. Sadly, I think "action junkie" can be interpreted as also being a "gambling addict."

Me personally, I love sweating action matches, especially when I'm in with one side, which of course makes it interesting. ;)

Some folks, though, can't stop. Like eating potato chips. They will win, win, win, and can't quit until the money runs out. Unfortunately, I think that's kind of how Louie and Keith used to roll. I'm not saying they didn't make a couple big scores and enjoy the fruits of their labor, but I have noticed with players of this ilk that they will keep gambling after a win, bet higher, double the bet, keep betting until the money dries out.

I'm sure Keith is going to love reading this post when he wakes up. LOL

Me, I go to a casino or a track or a pool room with a money number in mind for waging action. Once that number is expended, I'm done. That's it. I ain't reaching for more money to bet, and I ain't going to that ATM, though I have had my arm twisted a few times at the horses. In one case, we were in at an OTB facility in a pool room on Route 50 in Cambridge, MD. We lost 300 betting, and I was ready to go back to our luxury hotel room. We were staying at a beautiful restort on the waterfront. I loved that place, still do, but I digress.

Anyway, I wanted to leave the OTB, and Keith begged to stay. Just one more C-note, and that was it. I gave in and agreed to expend one more C-note. The next bet, Keith hit for over a thousand on an exacta. A long shot came in. Of course, as we all know, that only happens once in a blue moon; in other words, Keith got lucky. :D

Tony Watson loved the action. I like Tony. He's the epitome of a Southern gentleman. Really sweet. Tony used to have a backer with very deep pockets, which enabled him to bet it as high as the Georgia Pine. And, man, Tony could sure put on a show when he was in heat on a field of green. I love watching him play.

As far as the best jump-ball mechanic, I'd have to put Tony right up there. We didn't know about Tony's jumping prowess one year at the Open. Tony and Keith got into a barkfest, and they finally agreed on playing a race for a dime. When the majority of the pool room bet on Tony, I started to realize we'd been had. :embarrassed2:

Every time Keith played safe, Tony would jump a ball like it had eyes. To this day, I have never seen anyone jump a ball with such precision. Shannon, Michael Coltrain, and others were betting on the side, licking their chops, as Tony barbecued Keith in the one-pocket match. It was over in minutes.

Lesson learned: NEVER play Tony Watson unless you enforce the no-jump-ball rule. ;)
 
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Here you go. :smile:

It was a genuine question, Jen. You've just had a go at SakuJack for 'being a little green when it comes to pool'. You can put me in that category, too, as you can much of the rest of the world when it comes to American pool prior to the internet. We rely on legend, legacy and personal testimony for our information.

So, was doping unusual or was it routine?
 

JAM

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I remember a few years ago Keith came on AZ and told about shot he called loopy lou or something like that....:rolleyes:

It was the Dipsy-Do shot. :D

You can read about it here in this InsidePOOl article ---> HERE

It goes like this: This shot was in my bag of tricks. I practiced it consistently back home. It was my dipsy-do, also known as the inside kill shot. You must aim downward on the cue ball with follow-through and slide the cue ball over to the back rail with inside english, just shaving the object ball ever so crisply, so the cue ball will deaden off that back rail.

Learn the “feels” for this shot. If you hit the ball too full, it might be because your hand is too tight on the back end of the stick. Stroke downward using less pressure, with a longer stroke. If you over-cut it, it is because your grip is too loose on the butt end of the cue. You need to over-compensate for hitting the ball too full or over-cutting it. Try to lengthen your hand on the cue stick, making sure you don't pull or jerk it too much. I like to twirl my fingers around the butt to get a better “feel” for that longer stroke. This is an advanced shot, and most pros have difficulty in executing this shot. Practice with shorter distances, and make adjustments until you have mastered the “feels.”
 

JAM

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
...Heck, he would have won the 2003 U.S. Open if it hadn't been for getting food poisoning the morning of the finals. And he hadn't picked up a stick in a month before that tournament....

Might as well create a record for the pool archives on this thread for future reference. Here is an article about that tournament ---> Earthquake in the Final Four at the U.S. Open.

OMG, I just got called in. The government shutdown may be ending. Not sure. Later, gators!
 

peteypooldude

I see Edges
Silver Member
Isn't he merely expressing his opinion that one player was/is better than another? Is he not entirely justified in making that claim?

Quite why this degree of protectionism is allowed to continue is anyone's guess. The reason is laughable; censorship and tyranny the outcome.

All players are fair game - past, present and future. Find me the perfect player and I'll make an exception.

Dammit Thaiger...... They are going to ban your British a$$ again
That.... I would bet on
 

sonny_burnett

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
When I will stay coursing the term charliecar was used. I always assumed it was fast Eddies stake horse/stooge/pardner Charlie because they drove around in his car. Could be wrong be nice to see what the earthquake says.

JAM, there was a huge legend that Keith had a business card he handed out after a victory something like don't worry you've just been beaten by Keith McCready world greatest pool player?

Did you ask Keith if that is true? Don't let the trolls get to you this is a great thread. I never knock any world class player at any time. Everyone had their strength and weakness but they were an artist in my humble opinion. Take care Sonny.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk 2
 

clint3612

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I'm not the one trying to drag Keith thru the mud for something that should have been laughed about.
No one dragged him through the mud. Pool players are not beyond reproach, especially if they say something that one might not agree with and if you're looking to set up a game with as well.
 

clint3612

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I've spent A LOT of time talking to A LOT of old champions, at least 75 of them, and I've always asked them who the 3 best 9 ball players were. The 3 names that I by far heard the most were Lassiter, Buddy, and Keith, a lot for Earl and Efren, Siegel etc.... A pretty high % of them said that the best 9 ball they ever seen played was Keith..... I did the same for best all around player, Keith was in a few of their top 3's, Efren, Varner, Siegel would come up a lot, with a slew of others. But one name I never heard in anyone's top 3 in either category was Dave Matlock.

I could see that. I gave Keith props on the 9 foot 9 ball game and the early one pocket days. You know, David didn't make many tournaments in the past. So his overall influence wasn't as big as the guys you mentioned. However, two guys you mentioned, David beat even on the bar table, Earl and Buddy. You mention Buddy. I guess you knew David has winning record against him. Big table and bar table. Not many people know that. David offered to play Captain Hook and Sigel never took the bait. I remember you, it's too bad we couldn't have put Corey in the box with David a few years ago.
 
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CJ Wiley

ESPN WORLD OPEN CHAMPION
Gold Member
Silver Member
the cue ball's unusual "stunning" reaction off the rail.

It was the Dipsy-Do shot. :D

You can read about it here in this InsidePOOl article ---> HERE

It goes like this: This shot was in my bag of tricks. I practiced it consistently back home. It was my dipsy-do, also known as the inside kill shot. You must aim downward on the cue ball with follow-through and slide the cue ball over to the back rail with inside english, just shaving the object ball ever so crisply, so the cue ball will deaden off that back rail.

Learn the “feels” for this shot. If you hit the ball too full, it might be because your hand is too tight on the back end of the stick. Stroke downward using less pressure, with a longer stroke. If you over-cut it, it is because your grip is too loose on the butt end of the cue. You need to over-compensate for hitting the ball too full or over-cutting it. Try to lengthen your hand on the cue stick, making sure you don't pull or jerk it too much. I like to twirl my fingers around the butt to get a better “feel” for that longer stroke. This is an advanced shot, and most pros have difficulty in executing this shot. Practice with shorter distances, and make adjustments until you have mastered the “feels.”

I like this shot and you're right, most pros have difficulty with executing it or may not even see it as an option.....this is a powerful tool in a players repertoire if they're looking to raise their offensive potential a few notches and willing to develop this stroke.

The inside kill shots are ones that video can't seem to do justice (because it doesn't look as hard as it actually is), but when you see (and hear) it live it will make a lasting impression because of the cue ball's extreme "stunning" reaction off the rail.
 

HawaiianEye

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
How prevalent was doping in those days? Did virtually every money player do it?


When I worked in a pool hall back in the late 60s up until 1973, most all the supposed "players" used some sort of "chemical". I don't know if it was just their lifestyle or if they used it as some sort of "enhancer" that would improve their pool game.

Most of the people doing this were the up and coming and younger players of the time. One must remember that those players were living in an era when hippies were common and the drug culture was evolving, along with the ending of the Vietnam war when societies rules were changing. Louie Roberts was a prime example of a player from this era. When I first met Louie, he had just gotten out of the Air Force and he was at the beginning stage of his professional pool career.

Him, along with numerous other players, used "substances" that would keep them alert and awake for days and then other "substances" that would allow them to sleep. Anyone remember Elvis Presley? That is what happened to him...he was burning the candle from both ends.

After meeting Louie the first time and continually hearing stories about him from friends in St. Louis (I lived about 200 miles south), the most common theme I heard (other than how well he played) was how "high" he always was. Louie like to "fly" and bet it up. He didn't really care about money. He liked it and enjoyed what it could buy, but it never gave him the thrill of "flying" and beating somebody in a pool game. Louie was convinced, until the day he died, that nobody could beat him when he was "flying".
 
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