Everyone has been paid at the US OPEN

[Eric.]

You have good points, but I don't believe anyone can run a 256 player 9-ball tournament that lasts 7 day in this economy and with prices now a days for travel, hotel, food, entry, and the little things that come up. Johnnyt

Having a 7 day tourney vs a 4 day tourney should not be that much more money. If anything, it affects the players more than the promoter. If the idea is "how to make costs more manageable for Barry", I'm not so sure if this will make that much of a difference. I highly doubt this will cut his expenses down by a third.


Eric

 

[Johnnyt]

Passive aggressive post.

I don't think he owes us anything because some message board poster made up a rumor.

Why would that have an affect on his pool business. Are you not going to trust his tables? lol

Well if it's a rumor time will tell. As far as me being aggressive, I don't have to hang on anyone's nuts or worry about who I don't agree with will black ball my biz. I just don't like to see anyone taking advantage of anyone. I really don't give two $hits for me. As Fatboy says..."I got mine" sadly not as much as him. Johnnyt

 

[watchez]

Okay. With that out of the way, Barry Behrman owns the rights to the U.S. Open 9-Ball Championship. Nobody else can run one with that name because, somehow or another, he actually does, indeed, own this event called "U.S. Open 9-Ball Championship." As such, after 38 years of running the U.S. Open 9-Ball Championship, owning the rights, Barry Behrman is entitled to run it any way he sees fit, whether you, me, the players, the spectators, AzBilliard forum members like the way he runs it or not. It is his show.

In conclusion, it is a shame that in recent times, this event is plagued with problems, logistical and financial difficulties. I believe some of these problems can be remedied, but it's not my call. It's not my business how Barry run's his business. If the players and spectators don't like the way Barry runs his business, then they can elect to not support it.

Me personally, I realize and appreciate Mark Griffin's multi-event happeings, but they're out West. I'm on the East Coast. I don't want to lose this pool event on the East Coast, just in case I can get time off work to attend, but that's me being selfish with my own likes and dislikes, I guess.

Barry wants to make it a race to 3 - so be it.

Barry wants to use the magic rack - so be it.

Barry wants everyone to hold hands and sing Kum Ba Yah (sp?) - so be it.

Barry wants to hold the tournament in an arena, a hotel ballroom or a trailer park - so be it.

Barry wants to not pay the players IN FULL at the end of the event - DEAD WRONG. Obviously he can do this and has. And this has hurt him enough that it is costing him attendance, support and audience at the event. THis is simply terrible business sense. He was smart enough to create the US Open. He was smart enough to build a large pool room. Why does he fail at this? I can't believe in 38 years of running the event along with the rest of his time on planet Earth that he hasn't garnered relationships to bail him out when he comes up short. Yes - always pays the players eventually so why not borrow the money from a friend to save face. I certainly would. Instead, he comes out looking like a fool. His 'press releases' make him look worse.

Since you brought up your tournament history -- I ran an event, with my name on it, that someone else was suppose to add $10,000. The person no showed. It was my fault in putting trust in this person and at the time I had no reason not to. But when he failed to show, I pulled the $10,000 out of my own pocket and made the money right for the players. If I didn't have it, I would have borrowed it. And I didn't discuss it with any of the players as I didn't want it to be the focus of the weekend.

Beyond that, Barry is leading by example and it is a poor example for others to follow. Galveston, the IPT, the guy in Arizona, Bonus Ball and I am sure there are countless others on a much smaller scale -- all think this is exceptable behavior due to Barry's lead. This brings down the pool world that you, I and other's love. So, respectfully JAM, to give Barry a blanket pass on how he operates because he has done it for 38 years is just adding to the mess.

Thankfully pool has Mark Griffin, Greg Sullivan, JCIN, the guy of the Turning Stone, Mike Janis (can't believe I just said that), Shannon Daulton, Evelyn Disart, whoever runs the large events in Louisiana, among others --- they pay out in full each time at the end of their events. Yes some of these may take a large cut for their work but they do the money right each time in paying out. That I can respect.

 

[sjm]

Giving Barry the benefit of the doubt, I'll assume that all these checks will clear.

At best, this the first non-screw-up in quite some time regarding payment. We can only hope it's the beginning of a trend in which Barry il act more responsibly, but we'd all be foolish to assume that getting it right once will be enough to bring back most of those whose bad experiences caused them to sit it out this year. Hopefully, though, it will bring back some of them.

Obviously, hoping for the best for Barry, the players and the fans.

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

Johnny T and jumpin joe y'all win the Oscar
For the most negative most pessimistic posters on AZbilliards
Your award is in the mail . And by the way
You won unanimously Congratulations . And
By the way if either of you can play pool nearly as
good as you can criticizes and be negative you
Should plan on playing the US Open next year.
Shane want have a chance

you apparently don't read here very often, do you?

"unanimously"?

best,
brian kc

 

[JAM]

Barry wants to make it a race to 3 - so be it.

Barry wants to use the magic rack - so be it.

Barry wants everyone to hold hands and sing Kum Ba Yah (sp?) - so be it.

Barry wants to hold the tournament in an arena, a hotel ballroom or a trailer park - so be it.

Barry wants to not pay the players IN FULL at the end of the event - DEAD WRONG. Obviously he can do this and has. And this has hurt him enough that it is costing him attendance, support and audience at the event. THis is simply terrible business sense. He was smart enough to create the US Open. He was smart enough to build a large pool room. Why does he fail at this? I can't believe in 38 years of running the event along with the rest of his time on planet Earth that he hasn't garnered relationships to bail him out when he comes up short. Yes - always pays the players eventually so why not borrow the money from a friend to save face. I certainly would. Instead, he comes out looking like a fool. His 'press releases' make him look worse.

Since you brought up your tournament history -- I ran an event, with my name on it, that someone else was suppose to add $10,000. The person no showed. It was my fault in putting trust in this person and at the time I had no reason not to. But when he failed to show, I pulled the $10,000 out of my own pocket and made the money right for the players. If I didn't have it, I would have borrowed it. And I didn't discuss it with any of the players as I didn't want it to be the focus of the weekend.

Beyond that, Barry is leading by example and it is a poor example for others to follow. Galveston, the IPT, the guy in Arizona, Bonus Ball and I am sure there are countless others on a much smaller scale -- all think this is exceptable behavior due to Barry's lead. This brings down the pool world that you, I and other's love. So, respectfully JAM, to give Barry a blanket pass on how he operates because he has done it for 38 years is just adding to the mess.

Thankfully pool has Mark Griffin, Greg Sullivan, JCIN, the guy of the Turning Stone, Mike Janis (can't believe I just said that), Shannon Daulton, Evelyn Disart, whoever runs the large events in Louisiana, among others --- they pay out in full each time at the end of their events. Yes some of these may take a large cut for their work but they do the money right each time in paying out. That I can respect.

Watchez, the U.S. Open 9-Ball Championship is not a publicly traded stock. Barry owes nobody anything, though I understand your concerns about how it affects the pool industry as a whole.

I am not giving anyone a blanket pass, FWIW; I am simply saying that it isn't anybody's business how Barry run's his business. That's all. It may outrage people and piss people off, but they have the right to not support Barry's enterprise.

I can't tell Mark Griffin, Greg Sullivan, Mike Zuglan, Mike Janis, Shannon Daulton, or Evelyn Disart how to run their pool enterprise, no more than I can tell Barry Behrman how to run his. In the end, it doesn't matter what we think as far as what the outcome or end result will be. I do have STRONG opinions about some of the pool entities you mentioned in your post, but I have made a conscientious effort to refrain from stating my opinions on this public forum in some cases for the betterment of pool as a whole.

It's kind of like we're all spinning our tires in the mud, handing out advice and opinions. :embarrassed2: I don't think it will change anything.

 

[dom_poppa]

Thankfully pool has Mark Griffin, Greg Sullivan, JCIN, the guy of the Turning Stone, Mike Janis (can't believe I just said that), Shannon Daulton, Evelyn Disart, whoever runs the large events in Louisiana, among others --- they pay out in full each time at the end of their events. Yes some of these may take a large cut for their work but they do the money right each time in paying out. That I can respect.

Yes, those guys pay out and that's how it should be....BUT....they don't hold a tournament that pays out as much as Barry's.

It's also the greed of the players to play in a tourney that offers that much money. They are essentially hoping that Barry will pay because it's a lot of money to pass up on.

Even if Barry paid the winners half, that is probably more than what the others are paying. It's a gamble they are willing to take.

"It's like playing in that 100k tournament for 1st place and only getting paid half. Well, 50k is a lot more than what others are offering."

 

[watchez]

I think owes is the wrong word. Like we both said - it is his business and he is free to run it as he likes. Just like most sports are not a publicly traded company but if you do the fans wrong, you will lose them. All of the sports have proven this at one time or another.

I can only assume that Barry does profit on this event and it is not a gift back to the pool community. That being said, he does owe respect to the players to pay them at the end of the event in full for the support they gave him. It goes hand in hand.

It is sad that at the end of the event we are talking about how the event was and has been run, who wasn't there and why, and what the future will be and not talking about SVB as a 3 time winner of one of the toughest tournaments on the planet.


Dom Pappa - I won't even reply to your post because your mentality is so skewed it can't be fixed.

 

[Ken_4fun]

Barry wants to make it a race to 3 - so be it.

Barry wants to use the magic rack - so be it.

Barry wants everyone to hold hands and sing Kum Ba Yah (sp?) - so be it.

Barry wants to hold the tournament in an arena, a hotel ballroom or a trailer park - so be it.

Barry wants to not pay the players IN FULL at the end of the event - DEAD WRONG. Obviously he can do this and has. And this has hurt him enough that it is costing him attendance, support and audience at the event. THis is simply terrible business sense. He was smart enough to create the US Open. He was smart enough to build a large pool room. Why does he fail at this? I can't believe in 38 years of running the event along with the rest of his time on planet Earth that he hasn't garnered relationships to bail him out when he comes up short. Yes - always pays the players eventually so why not borrow the money from a friend to save face. I certainly would. Instead, he comes out looking like a fool. His 'press releases' make him look worse.

Since you brought up your tournament history -- I ran an event, with my name on it, that someone else was suppose to add $10,000. The person no showed. It was my fault in putting trust in this person and at the time I had no reason not to. But when he failed to show, I pulled the $10,000 out of my own pocket and made the money right for the players. If I didn't have it, I would have borrowed it. And I didn't discuss it with any of the players as I didn't want it to be the focus of the weekend.

Beyond that, Barry is leading by example and it is a poor example for others to follow. Galveston, the IPT, the guy in Arizona, Bonus Ball and I am sure there are countless others on a much smaller scale -- all think this is exceptable behavior due to Barry's lead. This brings down the pool world that you, I and other's love. So, respectfully JAM, to give Barry a blanket pass on how he operates because he has done it for 38 years is just adding to the mess.

Thankfully pool has Mark Griffin, Greg Sullivan, JCIN, the guy of the Turning Stone, Mike Janis (can't believe I just said that), Shannon Daulton, Evelyn Disart, whoever runs the large events in Louisiana, among others --- they pay out in full each time at the end of their events. Yes some of these may take a large cut for their work but they do the money right each time in paying out. That I can respect.

Best post so far.

I agree 100%. I wish I could have said it as clear as you did.

Thank you.

Ken

 

[JAM]

Yes, those guys pay out and that's how it should be....BUT....they don't hold a tournament that pays out as much as Barry's.

It's also the greed of the players to play in a tourney that offers that much money. They are essentially hoping that Barry will pay because it's a lot of money to pass up on.

Even if Barry paid the winners half, that is probably more than what the others are paying. It's a gamble they are willing to take.

"It's like playing in that 100k tournament for 1st place and only getting paid half. Well, 50k is a lot more than what others are offering."

I don't know if I agree with those sentiments. :embarrassed2:

I actually believe that the majority of full-time pros who compete in the U.S. Open 9-Ball Championship, the most important thing is that title. The money is secondary.

To amateurs, aspiring pros, social shooters, and others who compete in the U.S. Open 9-Ball Championship, the reasons are multi-faceted. It's a high-profile event on the East Coast, so us easterners don't have to travel out West to Vegas to compete. For some, it's a chance to compete with the big guns, and that's thrillling. The more poeple you play better than you are, the better you will play -- or so the theory goes.

I don't think it's a good idea to compare Barry Behrman's tournament to others, I guess. Each one has its unique qualities and attractions.

 

[JAM]

I think owes is the wrong word. Like we both said - it is his business and he is free to run it as he likes. Just like most sports are not a publicly traded company but if you do the fans wrong, you will lose them. All of the sports have proven this at one time or another.

I can only assume that Barry does profit on this event and it is not a gift back to the pool community. That being said, he does owe respect to the players to pay them at the end of the event in full for the support they gave him. It goes hand in hand.

It is sad that at the end of the event we are talking about how the event was and has been run, who wasn't there and why, and what the future will be and not talking about SVB as a 3 time winner of one of the toughest tournaments on the planet.

I agree with your last paragraph (before you edited your post ) 100 percent.

 

[NYC cue dude]

Whoa nelly

I don't know why Johnny A. doesn't comeback on here and straighten out this new rumor or truth that has been brought up on here. It would be a shame to remember him for leading the pros into a failed Bonus Ball, the ABP. and now maybe more. It's his rep on the line, Barry has already ruined his. Johnny has been a champion for three decades. When he retires and has a clean name he will still command respect and monetary rewards for years after. If these blemishes stay on his record...well I just hope his poolroom is making big money. Johnnyt

Johnny Archer is responsible for getti g the players paid. Period. That he didn't reveal the events proceeding the payouts is an attempt to save Barry the humiliation he has once again earned. Johnny is the good guy here and the players all owe him a huge debt of gratitude. Why Johnny is protecting Barry is beyond me, but I think he should tell the whole story.

I sure hope I didn't lead anyone to believe that Johnny did something wrong. He unequivocally did not.

 

[dom_poppa]

Also, the biggest problem with this "U.S. Open" tournament, it is not a true U.S. Open and it should be just called the Chesapeake Open because it's always there. The economy in Chesapeake cannot support this tournament. Look at the crappy attendance.

This tournament or brand should be re-located every year in different venues like the Super Bowl. If I went to Chesapeake and Q-Masters one year, then I'm probably not going to go their again. Been there done that kind of attitude.

If this tourney was held in a different venue every year then it would entice more to attend because of location and also breathes in new life and brings in a new and fresh audience.

Let's say the next 5 years it was held in L.A., NYC, Vegas, Arizona and Florida...that would be a new city every year with new fans. Let's face it, Chesapeake can't support this tourney and 38 years at that.

Get local pool halls to sponsor the tournament in their home city.

 

[JAM]

Also, the biggest problem with this "U.S. Open" tournament, it is not a true U.S. Open and it should be just called the Chesapeake Open because it's always there. The economy in Chesapeake cannot support this tournament. Look at the crappy attendance.

This tournament or brand should be re-located every year in different venues like the Super Bowl. If I went to Chesapeake and Q-Masters one year, then I'm probably not going to go their again. Been there done that kind of attitude.

If this tourney was held in a different venue every year then it would entice more to attend because of location and also breathes in new life and brings in a new and fresh audience.

Let's say the next 5 years it was held in L.A., NYC, Vegas, Arizona and Florida...that would be a new city every year with new fans. Let's face it, Chesapeake can't support this tourney and 38 years at that.

Get local pool halls to sponsor the tournament in their home city.

I think you might think about quitting while you're ahead. Your posts are kind of revealing that you do not have a grasp on the situation at hand.

It is nice that you are concerned, though, and care enough to write about it, but your logic is really very flawed. :embarrassed2:

How many big pool events have you attended? Just curious. :smile:

 

[dom_poppa]

How many big pool events have you attended? Just curious. :smile:

None. There isn't any to be honest with you. I have attended a lot in California with professionals participating but I don't think they are big because they feel like any other weekly tourney. Been to one been to all. That's why it needs to be at bigger venues. You can't count on the pool community alone to support this sport.

You need to introduce it to new locales.

Something as prestigious like the US Open, or supposedly, it should be held at places like Madison Square Garden or The Theater at MSG.

Like I said, who wants to support a local tournament in Chesapeake. Only thing it's got going for it, is the "US OPEN" name/brand. Which doesn't mean jack anymore.

 

[Ken_4fun]

I think owes is the wrong word. Like we both said - it is his business and he is free to run it as he likes. Just like most sports are not a publicly traded company but if you do the fans wrong, you will lose them. All of the sports have proven this at one time or another.

Dom Pappa - I won't even reply to your post because your mentality is so skewed it can't be fixed.

Now I disagree....:angry:

He does owe. He has made a promise and then didnt fulfill his end.

That silly statement above about having a 100K tournament and only paying 50K is crazy...but apparently works for Barry.

He owes what was promised, period.

Think about me coming over to paint your house, you say you will pay me $200. I say okay and paint your house, and you pay me $100. You owe me $100....how you can say you dont owe me is beyond me.

Does he owe the industry no, but he made a promise and didnt pay.

Everyone should make nits like that post up.

Ken

 

[El-ahrairah]

I think everyone misses the point.

The sad point is that when you have to say;

We are actually going to pay like we promised as if wasnt a given, things are pretty freakin sad. :angry:

Ken

I can't think of any other tournament where I've ever seen this stated like he does. He even gets long winded at the bottom of the payout sheet, stating their goal to have more players and be able to pay the money etc. Total joke imo, horrible for the dying game of pool.
Obv, this is just my opinion.

 

[JAM]

None. There isn't any to be honest with you. I have attended a lot in California with professionals participating but I don't think they are big because they feel like any other weekly tourney. Been to one been to all. That's why it needs to be at bigger venues. You can't count on the pool community alone to support this sport.

You need to introduce it to new locales.

Something as prestigious like the US Open, or supposedly, it should be held at places like Madison Square Garden or The Theater at MSG.

Like I said, who wants to support a local tournament in Chesapeake. Only thing it's got going for it, is the "US OPEN" name/brand. Which doesn't mean jack anymore.

Well, I'll give you an example based on your theory. The now-defunct UPA hosted at tournament at Grand Central Station in New York City, thinking it would garner the attention of a huge viewing audience. They even got a beer sponsor. The tournament, if memory serves me right, was won by Santos, with Mike Davis coming in second place. Having it in this venue, it just didn't succeed the way they had hoped.

The Galveston event, which only occurred one year, held it at a high-class venue, with expensive rooms on site. Due to the inexperience of the promoting entity, it sadly did not succeed, either.

I don't think locale is as important as you do. Throwing big bucks at it ain't going to help, either. The IPT had their events at Orange County Conference Center in Orlando, a HUGE place, easy to get to. The stands were empty much of the time.

If anything, the experience of the IPT should be a lesson for future promoters to start out small, with a smaller payout purse. Do something that is affordable, do-able, and manage-able. If you reach too high, you will fall flat and not succeed.

Personally, I don't think pool in America is in a time right now to host big payout events in, say, the Lincoln Center, Madison Square Gardens, or Carnegie Hall. Rather, French Lick, Indiana, would be more suitable due to cost and locale, more centrally located, as an example.

 

[JD_Hogg]

from a fans perspective i think the US Opened delivered. Still the most exciting tourny out there. Woulda been nice to see a few more Filipino's in the mix but oh well, maybe next year.

 

[justadub]

Might just be me looking from the outside in but from what I've seen and heard of Mark, its more a question of acting right than staying on his good side....

^^^ this. +1