Mike Sigel shares "the Key" he learned from Irving Crane in Dallas Texas

wow this "I got the ultimate secret/aiming/whatever" threads get boring.

even on youtube youll find very good info about how do approach a shot. hours and hours of lessons given my great snooker players and coaches.

a "typical" poolstance (not square) has a lot to do with your body. ralph eckert once had a video on this on youtube.

and then, even after watching thousands of hours of videos, wasting 10000 of dollars on dvds.... you still have to deliver the stroke properly. i dont know how often i see players crying that they dont aim good.... and when they shoot their shoulder, wrist and head is moving like a dog tail.

My advice for 100% improvement: Go to the table, and shoot every day 50 straight in table length stopshots.

My opinions, i cant wait for the next pool secret.
 
if it feels right it's probably wrong - this rule of thumb is usually right

I'm glad you deciphered my description. I really don't want this one getting out, it's one of my "hidden gems".... I almost put in a parable format. ;)

The fact of the matter is the human body is not designed to play pool - there must be a system learned to put all the necessary parts in place and be able to see the shot squarely, without altering your head position coming down......this is much easier said than done......as a matter of fact this is the "magic bullet" when done correctly.

Naturally players want to bend down towards the cue ball, but that's not the best way.....again, if it feels right it's probably wrong. This rule of thumb will get you over a lot of "barriers to entry" when it comes to playing the game at the highest levels.

Check out the best in the (Pro Pool) business and you'll see what I mean.

Aloha, and Play Well....

'The Game is the Teacher'




Mikjary said:
It took a little while to translate your analogy, but it's simple once you get it. In fact, something's gotta be wrong because it feels too comfortable. :grin-square:

I was looking for a way to consistently control the position of my head as I moved down into the shot. I tried to do it with different head and shoulder alignments, but they were tough to ingrain with different shots. Leaning over the table, jacking up, shooting off of the rail, all change your upper body positions and make it hard to keep the head over the shot in the correct alignment.

I don't know why I didn't think of using the lower torso/hips to pull the upper body down into position. They are more stable and less prone to last second changes as you move into the shot line.

I need to go back to the video now, and study some top players to see this movement that was right in front of my eyes all this time. I just didn't realeyes it! Thanks for the great tip! Shaved months off of the learning curve for me.

BTW...a pro friend of mine read your post about the 31* body positioning/stance reference and called me. We want the full report asap! :cool: :smile:

Best,
Mike
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DTL said:
......with a TOI, right?

Anyway, seeing and falling down on the shot correctly is not the hard part.......the hard part is delivering a straight stroke every time.
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YAY! *almost ready to hug you DTL* :p
 
Mike could run 300 balls any day he put his mind to it.....and he can.

DTL said:
So you just learned about this amazing new "key" (31 degree rule) from Mike Sigel and the first time you hit the table you played so much better?.........running 82 balls without warming up? His one sentence increased your awareness two to three levels? Man, I've got to know about this! ;)

As good as you played before knowing this info you should now be able to go out and win one of those World 9 Ball or US Open tournaments with ease.......or maybe the All Around Title at the upcoming DCC?

Mike can still run 300 balls anytime he wants?...........he's got 20 attempts on 4.75" pockets or less, 9ft table for 3K.
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No, the 31 Degrees thing was not what helped me, that was a joke. He did help with something though and I won a tournament last night at Rustys in Ft. Worth without missing any balls or making any position errors.

I said Mike could run 300 balls any day he put his mind to it.....and he can.

My level of play is comparable to anyone, however, there's many players that eat, drink and live pool right now......I give lessons and train other players, it's difficult to imagine having enough time to win a major tournament....although it's certainly possible if I make it a priority in life, and put business opportunities on the shelf in exchange.



'The Game is the Teacher'
 
Maybe Just a Few

CJ Wiley said:
I have a feeling if I explained what Mike told me the entire thread would be moved to another section. If you have any specific questions, or areas of curiosity I will be happy to answer and share what Mike and I talked about anytime.
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CJ..

Could you just list a few of the techniques. "He shared some techniques that I looked forward to trying out on the table, and today I did".

Don
 
CJ Wiley said:
That's great advice for snooker, but for pocket billiards it's 31 degrees. ;) There's a technique that Mike shared to create the perfect angle.... it's not taught by any "teacher' .......yet........TOI-31 will be coming soon to a theater near you. :groucho:

'The Game is the Teacher'

great-1.jpg
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Is 31 degrees the angle between Mike's arm and cue???
 
so agree CJ with you since i changed my stance from mark wilson it feels so wrong but thats how i know its correct when it feels wrong lol
 
Mike and I neither one like the super fast conditions that are being used these days

Poolshootindon said:
CJ..

Could you just list a few of the techniques. "He shared some techniques that I looked forward to trying out on the table, and today I did".

Don
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One of the techniques is going an extra rail for position.

I learned how important this was back in my teenage years and would practice ALWAYS going to an extra rail for position. This will improve your stoking power and also give a better idea of how the zones work. You want to always be going towards the correct angle on the next shot if possible.

Mike and I neither one like the super fast conditions that are being used at tournaments these days...it takes away the need to have a powerful stoke, and turns the game into a "bunting match".....which is boring to watch, and participate in.
 
CJ Wiley said:
One of the techniques is going an extra rail for position.

I learned how important this was back in my teenage years and would practice ALWAYS going to an extra rail for position. This will improve your stoking power and also give a better idea of how the zones work. You want to always be going towards the correct angle on the next shot if possible.

Mike and I neither one like the super fast conditions that are being used at tournaments these days...it takes away the need to have a powerful stoke, and turns the game into a "bunting match".....which is boring to watch, and participate in.
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Agree about the "going an extra rail" for shape.

On the second part, well all I can say, is great players adapt to new conditions. Johnny and Earl had no problems winning when the fast cloth came around, or when the game changed to one foul.

The same people that get on certified instructors about not being great players, are the same people that eat up everything you sell. When in reality, most of the techniques/tricks you're selling aren't things you used in your prime.

Please don't think I'm being harsh just to be mean. I (and I'm sure others) would love to see you play more, and play well. Whether it's tournaments or action matches, it doesn't really matter to me.

When you say things like, the cloth is too fast, or one foul rules suck. They just come across as excuses that maybe you're ego can't handle the fact that you aren't the player you used to be.
 
We ALL played Two Shot in our primes, Johnny, Earl, Sigel, Hopkins, Mizerak, BuddyEtc

I have never said one foul rules "suck".....what I do say is 'Two Shot Shoot Out' is far superior, as much as 10-100 times better to showcase skills. Far more strategy is required in TWO SHOT and it brings out many more interesting/entertaining situations because the players are setting up the shots when they "roll out".

We ALL played Two Shot in our primes, Johnny, Earl, Sigel, Hopkins, Mizerak, Buddy Hall, Etc.

They will ALL agree with me on the speed of the cloth too, proof of that was with the IPT that used the rubber back cloth at the request of Mike Sigel, and many other champion players.

'The Game is the Teacher'

PS: I won all my Pro Tournaments and was Player of the Year playing One Foul on fast Simonis cloth so I can play on it....it's just not ideal to bring out the best of the game...... I'm just an employee - The Game is my Employer :D



BeiberLvr said:
Agree about the "going an extra rail" for shape.

On the second part, well all I can say, is great players adapt to new conditions. Johnny and Earl had no problems winning when the fast cloth came around, or when the game changed to one foul.

The same people that get on certified instructors about not being great players, are the same people that eat up everything you sell. When in reality, most of the techniques/tricks you're selling aren't things you used in your prime.

Please don't think I'm being harsh just to be mean. I (and I'm sure others) would love to see you play more, and play well. Whether it's tournaments or action matches, it doesn't really matter to me.

When you say things like, the cloth is too fast, or one foul rules suck. They just come across as excuses that maybe you're ego can't handle the fact that you aren't the player you used to be.
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"in pocket billiards, if it feels right, it's probably wrong".

oscar said:
thanks for the info CJ you have helped my game a ton and also mark wilson book also
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You're welcome, glad to help.

Yes, that's the rule of thumb - "in pocket billiards, if it feels right, it's probably wrong".
 
"getting down as if you've already made each shot".

Pete said:
Is 31 degrees the angle between Mike's arm and cue???
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You are on the right track - notice where the V of his left hand is aligned to his shoulder. The "31 Degrees" is more of an idea of how exact your alignment must feel - after all the game is mainly about touch and feel. I use four different checkpoints to calibrate these components consistently.

I've never heard a champion player credit his eyesight to winning a tournament. The challenge is coordinating the body to the cue, and ultimately to the tip (that you actually use to play the game directly). This must be done very systematically to achieve the feeling of "getting down as if you've already made each shot". 'The Game is the Teacher'
 
Which is it?

CJ Wiley said:
You are on the right track - notice where the V of his left hand is aligned to his shoulder. The "31 Degrees" is more of an idea of how exact your alignment must feel - after all the game is mainly about touch and feel. I use four different checkpoints to calibrate these components consistently.

I've never heard a champion player credit his eyesight to winning a tournament. The challenge is coordinating the body to the cue, and ultimately to the tip (that you actually use to play the game directly). This must be done very systematically to achieve the feeling of "getting down as if you've already made each shot". 'The Game is the Teacher'
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Below you said it was a joke...which is it?

No, the 31 Degrees thing was not what helped me, that was a joke. He did help with something though and I won a tournament last night at Rustys in Ft. Worth without missing any balls or making any position errors.

Wedge
 
31 Degrees. 2007 Movie.

A transporter is hired and given one hour to deliver an item that he has to keep at 31 degrees or lower or he will lose his job.

Transporters are the Teacher.
 
he couldn't be that precise......or could he?

Wedge said:
Below you said it was a joke...which is it?

No, the 31 Degrees thing was not what helped me, that was a joke. He did help with something though and I won a tournament last night at Rustys in Ft. Worth without missing any balls or making any position errors.

Wedge
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What helped me immediately was fine tuning my right hand/shoulder alignment....Sigel joked it was 31 Degrees, but he couldn't be that precise......or could he? ;)

mikemeg2.jpg
 
I remember when pro players used to call Sigel, Mr N for knowledge. It was a jibe at Sigel's wrongheaded ideas; such as balls can't be thrown with English.
 
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