Jenn Barretta Pro player... REALLY?
- Thread starter Jesters
- Start date
definitely not!
You know you've won when they can't argue their point, and throw in a wife comment.
Another banger with an opinion.
I think watching professional pool is like watching professional golf. Even the worst hackers find a way to pick apart a game they see on TV.
If you had ever played a female pool player that made it to that level then you'd know that even when they aren't in stroke there is a substantial difference between their game and even the AA players from your local pool hall. They aren't making extreme cut and bank shots to delight the crowd. They pick the "right" patterns, stick to high probability shots and play devastating safes.
It may look like they aren't much better than a local banger but I promise you that they are. For example, they don't target vague general areas on the table for position on the next shot. They pick exact spots on the table they expect the cue ball to end up at and get pretty close to that exact spot more often than not. They don't think "I'll come off the end rail and..." they think "I'll hit that exact spot on the cushion at this exact speed and...".
And some players here might be able to take a game or two off them but in a decent length race, when it matters, I believe most of the females we refer to as pro players would wipe the table with most players.
Then again, I'm still a beginner so everyone beats me. :wink:
If you had ever played a female pool player that made it to that level then you'd know that even when they aren't in stroke there is a substantial difference between their game and even the AA players from your local pool hall. They aren't making extreme cut and bank shots to delight the crowd. They pick the "right" patterns, stick to high probability shots and play devastating safes.
It may look like they aren't much better than a local banger but I promise you that they are. For example, they don't target vague general areas on the table for position on the next shot. They pick exact spots on the table they expect the cue ball to end up at and get pretty close to that exact spot more often than not. They don't think "I'll come off the end rail and..." they think "I'll hit that exact spot on the cushion at this exact speed and...".
And some players here might be able to take a game or two off them but in a decent length race, when it matters, I believe most of the females we refer to as pro players would wipe the table with most players.
Then again, I'm still a beginner so everyone beats me. :wink:
That's pretty friggin good, against 97% male competition, and she must have finished higher than a few male pro's, and probably higher than any woman pro. Heck, who here would NOT love to finish 20th in a tourney like that? But, that is where I expect the pro's to finish... in the money
Are you saying just because someone can't play with the top 5 people in the world they are not allowed to comment on anyone else? If your ordered a burger and it sucked you are not allowed to say it sucked unless you are head chef in a 5 star restaurant?
I did not even read the earlier posts but this is just silly. I can't play with the top 1,000 in the world but I can tell when someone can't play good or good enough to play with a certain group of people and I'm sure most others can also.
As they say "don't bring a knife to a gun fight", it fits C and B players trying to win against Pro level players and anyone can see when people are outmatched. We don't need to be able to beat those same people to see it.
We all know there are only a few women that can play with even A players never mind Open and Pro level players, while it's not sweet and nice to say that, that's how it is. Most women "Pros" are that due to the fact that they play in turnaments a lot and play good in their niche, not that they play at a "Pro level". To be a woman Pro you can be about a B+ and finish in the middle or even cash at a WPBA event.
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You're wrong about your assessment. Legit shortstops would be favorites against all but maybe a handful of female players.
It's best not to compare the women to the men anyway. It's really not fair to the women. If they want to step up and compete with the men -- that's great and all but that shouldn't mean they need to measure up to the men when measuring their individual greatness. I would rather just celebrate the accomplishments of players like Allison Fisher, Karen Corr, Kelly Fisher, Jeanette Lee, Ga-Young Kim, and a few others, without the need to consider how they would fair against their male counterparts.
Agreed.
How it was explained to me was women because of less strength and power in their break, they pocket less balls on the break.
So one might say, so what?
Well, if they don't pocket a ball, they immediately turn the table over. Secondly, if they only pocket one ball on average, and a male player pockets 1.2 on average, that is significant spot.
That was my argument that women would be able to or should be able to compete with men on equal basis in One Pocket, where the break is more finesse than power.
JMO,
Ken
Allison Fisher described the difference as a "mentality". She said that men are naturally more aggressive, and they take shots she would never consider taking, or going for the 4 way position shot that could sell out the game.
Though, the top men make many of those aggressive shots, she would play a safety. Something about the "killer" instinct when you compare the two sexes.
Kinda like the baseball player with a $100M contract, but still runs full speed into the outfield wall, and gets injured. Just to hard to turn on and off that "aggression" even when you already have the cash
Personally, I enjoy watching woman pro's play. Playing a little slower, I get a chance to try and figure out the next shot and see if I'm "right". And watching Allison shoot, she is smooth as silk.
Allison Fisher described the difference as a "mentality". She said that men are naturally more aggressive, and they take shots she would never consider taking, or going for the 4 way position shot that could sell out the game.
Though, the top men make many of those aggressive shots, she would play a safety. Something about the "killer" instinct when you compare the two sexes.
Kinda like the baseball player with a $100M contract, but still runs full speed into the outfield wall, and gets injured. Just to hard to turn on and off that "aggression" even when you already have the cash
Personally, I enjoy watching woman pro's play. Playing a little slower, I get a chance to try and figure out the next shot and see if I'm "right". And watching Allison shoot, she is smooth as silk.
I have never seen Jean Bulukas play. But have read and hear she beat "plenty" of top men players.
I have to smile as she was described as "Playing just like a man". So maybe that is what Allison is eluding to.
10-15 years ago, I would have really like to have seen Jean and Allison mix it up.
Maybe we are just spoiled by seeing Efren and SVB playing.
Ken
The power thing isn't worth mentioning. Women snooker players, like in one pocket have an even playing field in theory because power on the break for example doesn't come into it. There are power shots, but the tables are heated and play like ice rinks so really hammering a ball in is very very rarely needed. So, why aren't the women competing against the men in snooker? Because they don't stand a chance. A top amateur snooker player is tough competition for the best woman player in the world. And a top amateur snooker player against a top 16 player isn't even a competition, its a whitewash.
I put it down to the lack of money in women's billiards. They can't get by simply playing for a living so have to take up jobs on the side to support themselves and their family. This means less time playing, more time working. That is why women can't compete against actual professional men in billiard games. You can also add in the fact that pool halls aren't very appealing to women so you don't get the volume of women taking up the sport early enough like you do with men. Mass produced class, and for the time being women's pool isn't generating the mass.
Eh... people are all on the defensive here for poor Jen but I have not seen any indication that Jester might not go off on a match with her.
If people think he is all talk put out the 10k offer and lets see what happens. The last time it happend JB "did" put up the cash, Lou got paid, and we all got entertained. Lets see an AZB challenge match, or see a woofing AZB member fold to a big offer, but lets not just see baseless posts saying "oh i would offer more, but he will just say no!" Because you don't know that at all.
Also, if a guy starts a post like this and you ask him to put up cash against her to prove he is better that is fair. Coming on here and saying "yeah... yeah... well you wanna pkay Mika for $20,000 tough guy!!! New york has lots of good players!" is just dumb and off topic.
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It's comical. It's the Pool equivalent of "Oh yeah?! If you talk about my friends, you will have to fight me too!!". Fighting other people's battles is pretty ghey. The problem is, some ppl don't realize that forums aren't Facebook where you only get glowing, positive, and sometimes, pure smoke blown up your butt.
Another poster did bring up a good point. Jenn is the last of the old school WPBA pros (yes, she belongs). She came up thru the regional ranks. Back then, you had to win an open qualifier to play a WPBA event. Then, you had to finish in the top half of hte field, twice in a 12 month period, to earn your tour card. IMO, thats earning your place amongst the "pros". Jen earned it, and I have respect for her for doing that. FWIW, she does play well. Better than that one match, on the stream. While she may not beat the top male players, it takes a good player to beat her.
Eric
Been several offers to play. Asked where he is located. Asked how much he would play her for. All met with a deafening silence.
how much would the match have to be to make it worth your while to go and play her???
just askin....
Jesters, I would still like an answer to the question that I asked above.
Certainly all of us can have an opinion and have a right to say what they like. However, I find it curious as to why that would cause you to decide to launch a mean spirited, public attack against someone who, to my knowledge, has done no harm to you other than not play to the standards that you, as a fan (if you truly are a fan) wanted to see.
I watched a later match between Eric Horleifson and Mike Dechaine. On paper, Mike should have breezed past Eric. Mike has been shooting lights out pool for a while now. Mike did not appear to have his best game (although what he had would beat most on any given day); that’s pool though and added to the suspense.
As for the idea that Jester should play Jennifer a money match, I don’t think this is the answer. The issue is not whether Jester is a better player than Jennifer or vice versa. Either way that the match ended it would not vindicate Jester for the mean spirited venom he decided to spew for no apparent reason and it would lessen Jennifer to be put in a position where she felt that she had something to prove to someone like that. (I agree that some of us might just enjoy seeing a little payback but we can live without it.)
And as for an answer to my question, I have taken the liberty to suggest a few appropriate responses if you need help in formulating an answer, please feel free to choose from them if you cannot come up with anything better.
1-Jesus, get off my back Whiffer, I should have went for a beer when I felt the match was taking too long but I didn’t. I’m sorry Jennifer, please forgive me.
2-I’m sorry Jennifer, it’s not you, it’s me. I live a vicarious life by watching the Pro tournaments while dreaming that I could compete with the best of them. When I see someone that does not match up to the level of competition that I like to dream that I could beat I take it personally and lash out.
3-All of the above or, if you prefer, Cleary provides a further choice in post #50.
I'm not offering 10k to an anonymous troll that could easily turn into a bait and switch deal. I think it's ridiculous that people feel it's necessary to create threads bashing people who are playing bad. And maybe this guy is better.. that's cool. She played bad... she's played bad before, she'll play bad again. She's played good... She got 3rd in the women's event, how terrible can she be? I'm sure Mr. Jester would have won the whole thing...
So Jester can say she sucks but I can't say Jester sucks... sounds legit. He's entitled to his opinion and I'm entitled to say his opinion sucks. And before you respond... I know I'm fat.
Cleary your talking to a brick wall with most on here. It sucks to fade when people degrade your friends when they really have no clue. When JHall got picked for the Mosconi cup I had to read all the remarks about how he can't play 9 ball, he isn't in the European's league, blah blah. After the cup it's all Jhall played the best he deserves to be on next year team. They were talking before they even had a clue how he played.
I've seen Jen play for years, she is a solid player, and what's funny is they think Rob Hart is an average league player. They don't know that he competes in all the big events and plays all games pretty good. It's hard to come in the main forum sometimes and listen to some of this crap.