It's the pockets. Remove the wonder tits and then you can play pool on those things.
WPA Bans 245 Players
- Thread starter Bob Jewett
- Start date
Perhaps I'm in fantasyland with this post, but here goes. Some facts of pertinence are these:
1) At present, about 60% of the world's population is Asian.
2) Pool is growing much faster in Asia than it is anywhere else,
3) In 2024, Asian players have won the World 10-ball, the UK Open, and the Hanoi Open.
4) Using Fargo as the measure, more than half of the Top 50 players in the world are Asian
3) Asia continues to produce a quickly growing number of top professional players
Hence, I can't help but ask these two questions:
1) Isn't it possible that Asia will become the dominant source of revenue for event producers in pro pool more than anywhere else?
2) Isn't it possible that WPA and Matchroom understand this and that's why they are fighting tooth and nail over Asian pool?
The prevailing view I'm reading on the forum is that no truly elite tour featuring world class play can exist without the banned 245 players. I'd like to think this to be the case, but I'm not nearly as sure as others on AZB. The prevailing winds in the game, to me, at least make it possible that Asia will be the epicenter of pool at some point in the not-so-distant future and that WPA/ACBS can have their day with or without the 245 banned players,
I am glad that Matchroom is pursuing the Asian market so passionately and aggressively (this year adding the World 9-ball in Saudi Arabia and the Reyes Cup in the Philippines,) because I feel strongly that Matchroom's presence in Asia will help to grow our sport.
The governing bodies, event producers, and sponsors need to get on the same page if a damaging split in our sport is to be avoided. For now, the players are powerless and remain hostages to the in-fighting, and that doesn't suit either me or our sport.
1) At present, about 60% of the world's population is Asian.
2) Pool is growing much faster in Asia than it is anywhere else,
3) In 2024, Asian players have won the World 10-ball, the UK Open, and the Hanoi Open.
4) Using Fargo as the measure, more than half of the Top 50 players in the world are Asian
3) Asia continues to produce a quickly growing number of top professional players
Hence, I can't help but ask these two questions:
1) Isn't it possible that Asia will become the dominant source of revenue for event producers in pro pool more than anywhere else?
2) Isn't it possible that WPA and Matchroom understand this and that's why they are fighting tooth and nail over Asian pool?
The prevailing view I'm reading on the forum is that no truly elite tour featuring world class play can exist without the banned 245 players. I'd like to think this to be the case, but I'm not nearly as sure as others on AZB. The prevailing winds in the game, to me, at least make it possible that Asia will be the epicenter of pool at some point in the not-so-distant future and that WPA/ACBS can have their day with or without the 245 banned players,
I am glad that Matchroom is pursuing the Asian market so passionately and aggressively (this year adding the World 9-ball in Saudi Arabia and the Reyes Cup in the Philippines,) because I feel strongly that Matchroom's presence in Asia will help to grow our sport.
The governing bodies, event producers, and sponsors need to get on the same page if a damaging split in our sport is to be avoided. For now, the players are powerless and remain hostages to the in-fighting, and that doesn't suit either me or our sport.
WPA has made a bold move. They will either create a parallel universe of pool or crash and burn. I don't think many of the 245 will accept a six month minimum suspension and pay a five hundred dollar fine. That is nothing short of crawling back like little whipped pups, not many pool players' style.
Are there 245 more players as good or nearly as good players waiting to jump into the WPA? Maybe, I really don't know. I do know that all WPA wins will be tainted for quite awhile by their move. It will be like somebody beating a big name player then admitting they were getting the orange crush in a race to three.
The WPA has not only harmed the 245 they banned, they have harmed all of their players by not giving them a chance to compete with the elite and grow. Until something changes there will be top other players and top WPA players. I believe the open players will be more respected.
I have seen similar silliness played out in other sports. One year I had membership in seven stock car associations, half of which are hard to remember today. No choice to enter the pits at the various races but team owners that covered all of those memberships weren't happy campers!
Hu
sjm
yes and yes.
and the banned players will come and kiss ass to play at some point as they have no real alternatives to make money.
and asia has the potential for huge viewing audiences, where the western world has too many other better sports to spend money watching.
yes and yes.
and the banned players will come and kiss ass to play at some point as they have no real alternatives to make money.
and asia has the potential for huge viewing audiences, where the western world has too many other better sports to spend money watching.
Enough examples out there where the presence of a second organization led to a unification or merger that benefitted the sport. Two examples:
1. The ABA (American Basketball Association) had always hoped to merge with the NBA, and when that merger finally happened, it strengthened pro basketball.
2. The WHA (World Hockey Association) tried to compete with the NHL (National Hockey League) but was ultimately absorbed by the NHL, most notably bringing the Edmonton Oilers into the NHL. The Oilers would win five Stanley Cups in their first ten years in the league.
A pooling of interests between WPA and Matchroom would similarly serve pro pool's better interests.
You mean monopoly?
Great post Stu. I think you touched on some very good points and are right. I’m not sure if you touched on everything, but your line of thinking sure makes sense to me. Asia is strong, the numbers don’t lie. If I was in the pool biz, that would be my intended market.
Booked my room at Derby, see you there!
Best
Eric
Stu, I think we are saying basically the same thing. The WPA and matchroom are trying to split up a tiny pie. Comparatively few players and far fewer big weekends to hold events. There is no way for two organizations to get along for long unless they sit down and split dates and agree to not punish players for playing where is most practical. Hard to justify going to a $200,000 event on the other side of the world when you can play a $150,000 event in your back yard
Unlike some sports, pool has always had Dolly Parton purses, everything on top. Coming in tenth place at either event used as an example in the last paragraph will pay close to the same and may not meet expenses. I haven't looked at full purses of big events lately but I doubt they have changed much.
When the top 100 can make a solid living from pool alone maybe two organizations can be supported.
NASCAR started out as a monopoly and hasn't changed much. Even their second string events have multi-million dollar teams now. We could sponsor all of pool nicely for what one team spends. Fact of the matter is that every NASCAR team has more to offer than pool. Two groups clawing like two cats isn't going to add to pool's appeal.
Hu
yes any world type event must have a large purse and long payout to attract more than just the very top players from all over.
and the pool equipment companies need to pay more for their stars. and that will only come from them demanding more and when they deserve it.
and the pool equipment companies need to pay more for their stars. and that will only come from them demanding more and when they deserve it.
The LAST thing the game needs is for some jerkoff butthurt lawyers to toss the 'racist grenade'. I don't for one second believe that has anything to do here. The WPA looks at ALL of Asia as its Heyball fiefdom and ANY attempts to fk with it makes these asswipes nervous.
I think there is room for two organizations given the global market of pool unless one dramatically beefs up its schedule. Matchroom only puts on eight major events at the moment and is not involved in the women's game (or 8 and 10-ball).
It's a big world, too. There is a dearth of tournaments in South America, the Middle East and probably Asia, too.
I am skeptical pool-equipment companies can pay much more than they do. These are not especially big companies with huge sales.
Pool needs more ad revenue from broadcasts and subcriptions. It's not going to come from the U.S. It will have to be Asia, the Middle East, Europe ...
To get more advertisers, Pool needs more Matchroom-type of events. More fan involvement like in Hanoi, Mosconi and Reyes. And more personality among the players. People want to like or hate who is playing, which is why I love, love, love Jayson Shaw.
It's a big world, too. There is a dearth of tournaments in South America, the Middle East and probably Asia, too.
I am skeptical pool-equipment companies can pay much more than they do. These are not especially big companies with huge sales.
Pool needs more ad revenue from broadcasts and subcriptions. It's not going to come from the U.S. It will have to be Asia, the Middle East, Europe ...
To get more advertisers, Pool needs more Matchroom-type of events. More fan involvement like in Hanoi, Mosconi and Reyes. And more personality among the players. People want to like or hate who is playing, which is why I love, love, love Jayson Shaw.
I'm late to the party but see it's now official; Mr. Jorgan Sandman has put 245 players to sleep. 
With all of the in-fighting in our sport, is it any wonder ESPN runs so much cornhole, belt sander racing, rock skipping, frisbee golf, kick ball, axe throwingand & on & on...But so very little pool,,,
Shameful, greedy behavior on full display.
With all of the in-fighting in our sport, is it any wonder ESPN runs so much cornhole, belt sander racing, rock skipping, frisbee golf, kick ball, axe throwingand & on & on...But so very little pool,,,
Shameful, greedy behavior on full display.
Belt sander racing sounds interesting...and fun!I'm late to the party but see it's now official; Mr. Jorgan Sandman has put 245 players to sleep.
With all of the in-fighting in our sport, is it any wonder ESPN runs so much cornhole, belt sander racing, rock skipping, frisbee golf, kick ball, axe throwingand & on & on...But so very little pool,,,
Shameful, greedy behavior on full display.
If you understand history, you can see the future.
This is exactly the same thing that happened in darts. Now BDO is dead and PDC is going strong with Matchroom.
If WPA still exists in 10 years, they're governing the world championships for amateur players and the pros play the MR events where the money is.
I do remember watching the matches from a crappy stream done by one guy. Sometimes with his cell phone, 'cos there was no functional internet available. Don't remember his name, but I'm grateful for his hard work to get at least some coverage.
This is exactly the same thing that happened in darts. Now BDO is dead and PDC is going strong with Matchroom.
If WPA still exists in 10 years, they're governing the world championships for amateur players and the pros play the MR events where the money is.
I don't remember any Matchroom coverage from the 9B world champs few years back when WPA had sold the tournament to Qatar.
I do remember watching the matches from a crappy stream done by one guy. Sometimes with his cell phone, 'cos there was no functional internet available. Don't remember his name, but I'm grateful for his hard work to get at least some coverage.
This brings up something I have been pondering but I don’t have any perfect solution to offer. ABA vs NBA and WHA vs NHL didn’t involve the international governing bodies of the respective sports. Somehow different professional leagues in different countries managed along with international, Olympic, and amater competitions. I don’t think the international governing body tried to get money from a Red Wings v Canadiens game or Lakers v Celtics. Other governing bodies of certain sports make their money from a championship they sponsor. I am no apologist for the NCAA but somehow they manage to get all their money from the men’s basketball championship and still give a trophy for DIII women’s lacrosse. USGA and R&A have one main Open a year and promulgate rules while having numerous smaller championships for women, seniors, ams, juniors. They don’t run the pro tours throughout the world.
Why isn’t the WPA similar? Trying to be the international governing body and control the pro tours seems to be an impossible task and is now hurting everyone. Put on a big world championship that is truly open and international. Make as much as you can and pay big prizes and leave the pros alone the other 355 days a year. Then worry about junior pool in Poland or Thailand. I know they might rather try to survive on sanctioning fees, but why would a pro tour or tournament send them money? The current model makes no sense to me.
What are the banned saying?
Fuck the WPA
roger that. just speaking in terms of the professional(non heyball) side the wpa has proved over-n-over that they really serve no purpose. if they disappeared tomorrow no one would notice or care.
if you remember earl jumping on the table celebrating or roberto gomez losing to daryl peach in manila, that was an old MR world championship