Valley tables are not 40x80. Unless that is they have changed something in the past few months.
A question from Greg Sullivan
- Thread starter jay helfert
- Start date
Valley tables are not 40x80. Unless that is they have changed something in the past few months.
LOL, right. Not here in Oregon. Pool rooms here are cheap! So cheap not one room has purchased any new tables in over 5 - 10 years.
Craig
Jay, that was one of the factors that made the tournaments at the Chattanooga Billiard Club a success. The shortstops have a better shot on the 7 and 8 foot tables and they know it and will participate in these tournaments when they wouldn't take on the champions on a 9 footer.
If you want to know who plays the best in the world hold it on 5x10's with 4 inch pockets but don't expect too many players.
If you want to know who plays the best in the world hold it on 5x10's with 4 inch pockets but don't expect too many players.
Jay,
Tough call here. Usually when I think of the phrase "best of both worlds", it usually means that you don't get the full value of either world.
My home table in my pool league is an 8' Valley in pretty good condition. I've played on this table for 10 years plus, and am quite familiar with it. Overall, I like it a lot. Over the last 10 years, however, I have played the vast majority of my pool on 9 footers. On an 8' for 9 ball, however, I think it is kinda the worst of both worlds. This is because the pockets are large and easy, which means ball pocketing is easy (like on a 7'), however there is more room to play looser position, which means your speed and shape doesn't need to be as good (which normally can offset the easy pocketing on 7 footers, especially in 8 ball where there is so much congestion).
In a way, I feel that the 8' table takes pool as far away as possible from the demands of a pro caliber skill set. I feel that I have the greatest chance of being beat by a lesser player on the 8 footer. However, I will say that the break on an 8 foot table is closer to the "real" thing---on a bar box anyone can learn to break VERY well. On the 8' you have to break a little better than on the 7' to get good results.
Now, when we throw into the mix that it will be Diamond tables, this changes things slightly. Especially if you wanna go with the pro cut pockets. Now I think the ball pocketing edge is reduced considerably compared to a 7', and the quality of play goes way up. This might be great.
I am still wondering, however, what is the main motivation for this idea? Is it simply to promote the 8' table size? Is it an issue of space? Are there a lot of unsold Diamond 8' tables sitting in a warehouse that need moving? Or is it just a simple attempt at doing something different. Whatever the reason doesn't really impact the merit of the idea, though I can't say I'm not still curious.
KMRUNOUT
Tough call here. Usually when I think of the phrase "best of both worlds", it usually means that you don't get the full value of either world.
My home table in my pool league is an 8' Valley in pretty good condition. I've played on this table for 10 years plus, and am quite familiar with it. Overall, I like it a lot. Over the last 10 years, however, I have played the vast majority of my pool on 9 footers. On an 8' for 9 ball, however, I think it is kinda the worst of both worlds. This is because the pockets are large and easy, which means ball pocketing is easy (like on a 7'), however there is more room to play looser position, which means your speed and shape doesn't need to be as good (which normally can offset the easy pocketing on 7 footers, especially in 8 ball where there is so much congestion).
In a way, I feel that the 8' table takes pool as far away as possible from the demands of a pro caliber skill set. I feel that I have the greatest chance of being beat by a lesser player on the 8 footer. However, I will say that the break on an 8 foot table is closer to the "real" thing---on a bar box anyone can learn to break VERY well. On the 8' you have to break a little better than on the 7' to get good results.
Now, when we throw into the mix that it will be Diamond tables, this changes things slightly. Especially if you wanna go with the pro cut pockets. Now I think the ball pocketing edge is reduced considerably compared to a 7', and the quality of play goes way up. This might be great.
I am still wondering, however, what is the main motivation for this idea? Is it simply to promote the 8' table size? Is it an issue of space? Are there a lot of unsold Diamond 8' tables sitting in a warehouse that need moving? Or is it just a simple attempt at doing something different. Whatever the reason doesn't really impact the merit of the idea, though I can't say I'm not still curious.
KMRUNOUT
Majority of the tables around in the seattle area seem to be 8 footers
I agree, its nice to think the equipment matters, but at the end of the day its all about added $$$$-thats the real answere.
Agree with Iba and Fatboy
Thanks for all the input so far. Greg will get a chance to read all this soon. Diamond does make virtually the same table in an 8' model (45" x 90"), with the pro cut pockets. Like the other Diamond tables, it is great to play on. He was just curious to see how players would respond to an event that used these tables, as opposed to larger or smaller ones. Like so many others, I think it is more a factor of added money and tourney format that will bring the players in.
Here is a site that has dimensions. Seem to remember somebody from Oregon saying they measured theirs and it was .
http://www.dazadi.com/Game-Rooms/Bi...k-Cat-7-Foot-Pool-Table-with-Ball-Return.html
8 fts
I have been talking to 2 different people who wanted to do a tournament with a Casino adding money. They were inquiring about using Diamond tables. One was considering 9 fts. the other 7 fts. After listening to what they had planned and knowing what the Casinos were looking for, which is numbers of players. I thought that 8ft. tables might turn out to be a good middle ground and worth a try. The pocket size would be the same. A player that prefers a 9ft. would possibly prefer an 8 ft. over a 7ft. and a player who likes the 7fts. may not be as intimidated on an 8ft. as they would on a 9ft. The end result possibly could be more players attending. This would definitely entice the Casino to make the event grow with more money added in the future. Anyway something to think about. I had Jay post this because I've been traveling and I'm not on here enough to answer questions in a timely manner.
Thanks, Jay!
I have been talking to 2 different people who wanted to do a tournament with a Casino adding money. They were inquiring about using Diamond tables. One was considering 9 fts. the other 7 fts. After listening to what they had planned and knowing what the Casinos were looking for, which is numbers of players. I thought that 8ft. tables might turn out to be a good middle ground and worth a try. The pocket size would be the same. A player that prefers a 9ft. would possibly prefer an 8 ft. over a 7ft. and a player who likes the 7fts. may not be as intimidated on an 8ft. as they would on a 9ft. The end result possibly could be more players attending. This would definitely entice the Casino to make the event grow with more money added in the future. Anyway something to think about. I had Jay post this because I've been traveling and I'm not on here enough to answer questions in a timely manner.
Thanks, Jay!
Greg, IMO the market is fractured enough.
Going to 8' you're not going to make either the 7' or the 9' crowd happy.
Just my 2 cents.
Lou Figueroa
I agree with Greg
I agree with Greg 100%. There are a good deal of players, especially in the southeast that grew up on 8 footers. It's a good compromise; the pros retain a little of their advantage and the BB players dont have that dramatic adjustment. I feel like I can compete with the pros much better on the 8 footers as opposed to the 9 footers. You may not be able to draw many average players; but I think most of the amateur advanced crowd will participate. Overall, I think it's a great idea, Greg. I look forward to participating if I can. randy v. tn:thumbup:
I agree with Greg 100%. There are a good deal of players, especially in the southeast that grew up on 8 footers. It's a good compromise; the pros retain a little of their advantage and the BB players dont have that dramatic adjustment. I feel like I can compete with the pros much better on the 8 footers as opposed to the 9 footers. You may not be able to draw many average players; but I think most of the amateur advanced crowd will participate. Overall, I think it's a great idea, Greg. I look forward to participating if I can. randy v. tn:thumbup:
I like eight footers.
mr8ball
Active member
I think location is everything. I have seen the DCC do nothing but go down hill ever since they done away with the bar tables. I know that Greg has done the best he can with the DCC but from what I have heard for the past 2 years is that the location is just terrible. I think the Pros would rather play on 9's and bar box players would rather stay on them. I really miss the bar box players at the DCC. I dont think most bar box players would like playing with the Pros. JMO Again, Location is everything. Look at the Expo. This past year was the best ever so I was told. Best of luck Greg
I prefer the nine footers, but I like the 8 foot tables as I believe they are actually easier to run out on than a 7 or a 9. The shots are not as long a 9 and the balls are not as congested on a 7. As already mentioned it still comes down to the cash being offered. In a tournament format I think 8's would be right up my alley, but not for the pro's.
I must take exception to this post. The only advantage the Executive Inn had over the current location was proximity to the airport and Greg offers a shuttle anyway. The Horseshoe is a nicer hotel with better rooms and more food options by far. The fields remain big and the prize money good. Last year attendance was down 10-15% but I attribute that more to the faltering economy than anything else. I fully expect to see bigger fields come next year. Maybe Greg will even find a way to get more Smart Tables in there as well, to please the bar table players.
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Greg,
IMHO, the idea has merit on paper. But I think the reality of things wouldn't be as rose tinted as this. As plenty have stated on here before, it's all about format and added money. Once those are in place, then looking at which equipment to play on to maximize participation is the way to go. Basically, I think by looking at equipment first vice format and money, you're putting the cart in front of the horse.
As far as the idea itself, using 8' tables as a comprimise between 9'rs and 7'rs...I think if there were a standardized pocket size, (say 4 1/4" corners at the tips and 4 1/2" sides at the tips), it could help standardize the game for tournament play. Of course, it would take years to do this...it wouldn't be an overnight thing. And, of course, you would have your 9' and 7' purists who wouldn't be caught dead playing on any other equipment other than their prefered choice. But I firmly believe that if you set the format and monnies up, 95% or more of the players would show, regardless of what equipment is being used.
Again, just my $.02...
Josh
I had a short discussion with Greg last year about this very subject. Throughout Central Massachusetts, most bars that I've played at have 8' bar tables. In Western Mass, it's mostly 7' bar tables. I guess it's the jukebox/pinball machine company that makes the decision.
Fred