Black-Balled said:
if your buddy doesn't know that you are playing the guy or hasn't told you its ok to play the guy on his tip then it is not ok. That would basically be like you stealing money from your buddy.
Are Air Barrels ever justified?
- Thread starter corvette1340
- Start date
if your buddy doesn't know that you are playing the guy or hasn't told you its ok to play the guy on his tip then it is not ok. That would basically be like you stealing money from your buddy.
corvette1340 said:
But you are assuming the debt???
Black-Balled said:
Only OK if you actually intend to pay your friend if you lose. Also, if you win and he pays you ... this does not help your friend in any way. This is why I said it was OK if your buddy is backing you since he would make money off this set as well. If you intended on giving your winnings to your buddy and calling it even, the stiffer essentially lost two sets for the price of one.
corvette1340 said:
Sometimes, they are not just OK but are expected. Often, they shouldn't be called air barrels but rather investments. Years ago, while I was managing a room, there was a little semi-con man/gambler that came into the room about 3 times a week. Every time that he could scrape up 50.00 or so. On Fri. or Sat. he would have 100 to 150.00. I always carried a large amount of money and, as any full fledged, ate up gambler, he would make any game he could trying to get into my pocket. We always played one-hole with me getting 9 to 7 and the break. With this game I was absolutely robbing him. I was winning between 200 and 300.00 a week and this went on for over 2 years. I always knew that the last game was going to be an air barrel but so what. I knew that I had emptied him out and this kept him coming back. If I had threw a fit over the first air barrel it would have cost me thousands in the long run.
Dick
Yes...You ahve met me beforecrawfish said:
Black-Balled said:
I don't think it's air in that case. Air is when you can't pay the guy if you lose. By canceling his debt, you are paying him, and thus it's not an air barrel.
Now, if it's not your debt to cancel, i.e. your buddy won't honor your word and still wants money from the guy because you weren't authorized to let him off the hook, then it becomes a very hairy situation. But that's a separate matter. If you cancel out the guy's debt, that should be considered as good as paying him, and thus not an air barrel.
-Andrew
In my humblest of opinions, I think the act is reprehensible, and it is dishonest. Plain and simple. There may be those who will lecture you on that being the way of the pool world, and will even have a story or three, but it amounts to hustling, stealing, lying, being deceptive etc.corvette1340 said:
I will never do it. Kudos to me!
And if some of you are going to reply about looking for an edge, save it. Lying and cheating are lying and cheating, that's that.
inside_english said:
Hey Inside,
Come to think of it.... I don't have any milk. But now that you mention it, I'm curiously thirsty for some.
Dave
corvette1340 said:
If one does not belong to the subculture of degenerate gamblers it will be difficult for one to understand and accept the UNWRITTEN code of conduct among the gamblers.
similar to air barrel there is a another thing ' you can`t quit winner'.Aren`t you playing to win and take somebody`s money?
In some areas of the code of conduct I find similarities between the the criminals and the gamblers.
I am not a gambler and I do not follow the logic in the unwritten code of conduct of those subcultures.
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Dick has it right
Dick has it right. Are air barrels justified? No of course not, never. Is it a hell of a lot smarter to accept a comparatively small air barrel from someone you have just took off for good money and know you are likely to be able to do the same again? Absolutely! Blowing off that final air barrel and "forgetting" about it the next time you meet can often keep the cash flowing over and over. Get uptight about the air barrel or bird dog for your money and you are often killing the goose that lays the golden eggs.
I too gambled with people that I knew were likely to fire an air barrel as the last bet. I not only accepted the air barrel with good grace I gave them a little walking stick so they could go build back up and come try me again. Sometimes you have to prime the pump. Smart gambling isn't always about what is "justified" or not.
Hu
Dick has it right. Are air barrels justified? No of course not, never. Is it a hell of a lot smarter to accept a comparatively small air barrel from someone you have just took off for good money and know you are likely to be able to do the same again? Absolutely! Blowing off that final air barrel and "forgetting" about it the next time you meet can often keep the cash flowing over and over. Get uptight about the air barrel or bird dog for your money and you are often killing the goose that lays the golden eggs.
I too gambled with people that I knew were likely to fire an air barrel as the last bet. I not only accepted the air barrel with good grace I gave them a little walking stick so they could go build back up and come try me again. Sometimes you have to prime the pump. Smart gambling isn't always about what is "justified" or not.
Hu
rhncue said:
ShootingArts said:
Hu:
How about if your opponent owes your brother $x, you play him for $x, lose and tell him he is off the hook to your brother?
Never say never!
which air barrel?
Which was an air barrel? His air barrel wasn't justified and yours wasn't an air barrel. I did much the same about thirty years ago. There was a guy locally famous for firing air barrels. He wanted to make the first bet pretty high because he was going to air barrel from the jump. He either grabbed a nice score or he was done.
I watched this for six months or so and then made my move. I knew the biggest biker in the bar wasn't real fond of the weasel so I asked the biker to play me for the size bet the weasel usually tried to make. Then the next time that the weasel wanted to play me for the small money he was willing to post, I suggested making the bet a hundred. There was a gleam of joy in his eyes when he accepted, as usual he didn't have half that in his pocket. I laid down and lost on purpose. Then when he came over to collect I told him to go collect from Murphy, he owed me that exact amount. The weasel knew he had been had!!
Not something I normally do but it still ranks as one of the funniest things I ever did around a pool table. "Murphy" was HUGE and the weasel knew Murphy didn't like him already.
Hu
Black-Balled said:Hu:
How about if your opponent owes your brother $x, you play him for $x, lose and tell him he is off the hook to your brother?
Never say never!
Which was an air barrel? His air barrel wasn't justified and yours wasn't an air barrel. I did much the same about thirty years ago. There was a guy locally famous for firing air barrels. He wanted to make the first bet pretty high because he was going to air barrel from the jump. He either grabbed a nice score or he was done.
I watched this for six months or so and then made my move. I knew the biggest biker in the bar wasn't real fond of the weasel so I asked the biker to play me for the size bet the weasel usually tried to make. Then the next time that the weasel wanted to play me for the small money he was willing to post, I suggested making the bet a hundred. There was a gleam of joy in his eyes when he accepted, as usual he didn't have half that in his pocket. I laid down and lost on purpose. Then when he came over to collect I told him to go collect from Murphy, he owed me that exact amount. The weasel knew he had been had!!
Not something I normally do but it still ranks as one of the funniest things I ever did around a pool table. "Murphy" was HUGE and the weasel knew Murphy didn't like him already.
Hu
I think air barrels are great and a necessary part of gambling, I only use them when i'm flat broke. God forbit you dont give yourself the best chance of winning. What the worst theat can happen someone gets pissed, I can handle pissed, the real trick to air-barreling is dont lose, no harm no foul.:smile:
Air BArrels
Hmmmm, had to think of this situation for a while. Might be a good exception, just to teach the guy a lesson. But, your buddy still does not get payed. There seems to be no good answer for an air barrel.Black-Balled said:
vagabond said:
Maybe this is another reason why poker is thriving and pool still remains in the dark ages with its' idiotic acceptance of ideas such as the air barrel and not quitting winner. I think at pool, as long as you set a time frame or X number of games, go ahead and quit. At a poker table, you cannot air barrel someone and you surely can quit winner. I have seen someone half joke saying they are 'All In' and the floor stating it is verbal and to push in their chips. Sticking with rules keeps the games in line. There are still plenty of suckers at the table and the action is good. And the suckers come back week after week. Guess they don't need an air barrel to feel comfortable.
Yes, you can milk a cow every day but only slaughter it once. That is a good rule to follow. But I don't care to milk a cow if he is going to shit on my head when I do it.