Babe Cranfield

[Wedge]

I didn't want to high jack another thread so I started a new one. An old poster for straight pool is for sale on another thread and the discussion turned to Babe on that thread. Larry Moy, who is an AZ member, as well as the co author of the "Straight Pool Bible" posted some info about Babe...his good friend. Worth a read...anyone else have any info on Babe? Below is the link:

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=282194

Wedge

 

[duckie]

I'm a big fan of his. It is too bad that not more players are aware of him, his skills and his books. His life time accomplishments are pretty impressive.

The reason I am a big fan is not only do to his accomplishments but his Arrow concept for practicing/training shots.

Before I got the Straight Pool Bible, I came up with the drawing in my avatar based on the idea of the spot on the table for the base of the CB at the OB, sometimes referred as ghost ball. I was greatly surprised when I got the book and there was the Arrow. For some reason, I had stumbled upon a concept of one of the greats. This was one of the moments that was a sign post to me that I was on the right path.

His arrow training aid is the best out there yet so few are aware of it or are even willing to give it a try. The drawing in my avatar is just a really a extension of his arrow concept.

His Straight Pool Bible is part of my must have books on pool. Simple read, covers all aspects of not only straight pool but pool in general.

The section on devolving touch is a very good read.

Thanks for posting this.

 

[Slh]

I know he had a run of 600 ( or 700?) balls in pratice. Unfortunately even if he had huge talent he couldn't perform as well ( or near the level) during official matches.

 

[Wedge]

Hmmm

I know he had a run of 600 ( or 700?) balls in pratice. Unfortunately even if he had huge talent he couldn't perform as well ( or near the level) during official matches.

He was the World Straight Pool Champion in 1964...if I recall beating Luther Lassiter and won numerous amateur, junior, national and professional titles. He was also inducted into the BCA Hall of Fame in 1997. I would say his talent transferred to official matched pretty well!

Wedge

 

[poolhallringer]

Very superstitious...

I first met Babe back in the late 60's at a World 14.1 tourney in NY. The most memorable thing for me was his intensity on the table and his deliberate act of always placing the chalk cube directly over the table diamonds before he would shoot his next shot. What a straight pool champion he was.:grin-square:

 

[sfleinen]

I know he had a run of 600 ( or 700?) balls in pratice. Unfortunately even if he had huge talent he couldn't perform as well ( or near the level) during official matches.

He was the World Straight Pool Champion in 1964...if I recall beating Luther Lassiter and won numerous amateur, junior, national and professional titles. He was also inducted into the BCA Hall of Fame in 1997. I would say his talent transferred to official matched pretty well!

Wedge

Slh:

Wedge is correct; Babe's knowledge and skill transferred well to competition. I think it's Mike Eufemia you must be thinking of; who had an unofficial (and unverified) practice run of 625 balls, and could shoot your socks off in "funsy" matches, but who performed spectacularly badly in tournaments.

-Sean

 

[Slh]

Slh:

Wedge is correct; Babe's knowledge and skill transferred well to competition. I think it's Mike Eufemia you must be thinking of; who had an unofficial (and unverified) practice run of 625 balls, and could shoot your socks off in "funsy" matches, but who performed spectacularly badly in tournaments.

-Sean

Yes, my bad.... I mistook him for Mike Eufemia...

 

[pt109]

The 'Babe' was an amazing man.
He, like Irving Crane, worked all his life and still became a world champion.

My favorite stat....he ran 420 in an exhibition....on a 5x10.

I know someone who saw part of his 768 run on a 9 ft.....
...but no one witnessed it all...however, people that know Arthur Cranfield
say if he said he did it, he did it.

 

[sjm]

I know he had a run of 600 ( or 700?) balls in pratice. Unfortunately even if he had huge talent he couldn't perform as well ( or near the level) during official matches.

Yes, Babe had two practice runs of over 700, the better of which was 768.

He is one of the Rochester, NY, superstars, but, due to his lack of credentials in competition, he cannot logically be considered as comparable to his contemporary and fellow Rochester native Irving Crane. And, of course, Cranfield and Crane were among the early influences on Rochester's own Mike Sigel.

 

[cardiac kid]

Yes, Babe had two practice runs of over 700, the better of which was 768.

He is one of the Rochester, NY, superstars, but, due to his lack of credentials in competition, he cannot logically be considered as comparable to his contemporary and fellow Rochester native Irving Crane. And, of course, Cranfield and Crane were among the early influences on Rochester's own Mike Sigel.

Stu,

For the life of me, I can not remember "Babe" ever playing here in Rochester. Always drove to Syracuse to watch him practice at Holiday Bowl on Erie Blvd East. My late friend Pat Howey was one of the few people "Babe" would practice with. One of the reasons Pat was credited by many as playing the best patterns in straight pool. Then again, as I've been reminded by many, my memory may be fooling me. There are a couple of AZ'ers from Syracuse who may jump in on this question. One thing for sure, Arthur "Babe" Cranfield was a World Champion.

Lyn

 

[sjm]

Stu,

For the life of me, I can not remember "Babe" ever playing here in Rochester. Always drove to Syracuse to watch him practice at Holiday Bowl on Erie Blvd East. My late friend Pat Howey was one of the few people "Babe" would practice with. One of the reasons Pat was credited by many as playing the best patterns in straight pool. Then again, as I've been reminded by many, my memory may be fooling me. There are a couple of AZ'ers from Syracuse who may jump in on this question. One thing for sure, Arthur "Babe" Cranfield was a World Champion.

Lyn

Yeah, I know he was born in Syracuse, but back in the day, Babe was part of that upstate NY crowd that even included Buffalo's Dan DiLiberto. If those guys all came to him, it speaks volumes about how highly regarded he was.

You know, Lyn, NYC guys like myself don't know Syracuse from Rochester from Buffalo. Despite being a resident of the NYC metropolitan area since 1958, I've actually only been to your part of the state twice. My lack of knowledge when it comes to the geography of my own state amazes me to this day.

Hope you're well, my friend.

PS Best patterns is always in the eye of the beholder. Mosconi once told me he liked Jim Rempe's patterns best. Grady Matthews once suggested that John Ervolino played the patterns as well as anyone he ever saw. I'm sure those who say Babe played the best patterns have a strong case. What I do remember, however, is that my good friend Irving Crane had limitless respect for Babe.

 

[ghostball]

He was the World Straight Pool Champion in 1964...if I recall beating Luther Lassiter and won numerous amateur, junior, national and professional titles. He was also inducted into the BCA Hall of Fame in 1997. I would say his talent transferred to official matched pretty well!

Wedge

Babe Cranfield beat Lassiter in a challenge match 1000 pts.
Babe won the right to this challenge because he finished 2nd in World Tournament that is how he became the World Champion.
Ray Martin

 

[cardiac kid]

Yeah, I know he was born in Syracuse, but back in the day, Babe was part of that upstate NY crowd that even included Buffalo's Dan DiLiberto. If those guys all came to him, it speaks volumes about how highly regarded he was.

You know, Lyn, NYC guys like myself don't know Syracuse from Rochester from Buffalo. Despite being a resident of the NYC metropolitan area since 1958, I've actually only been to your part of the state twice. My lack of knowledge when it comes to the geography of my own state amazes me to this day.

Hope you're well, my friend.

PS Best patterns is always in the eye of the beholder. Mosconi once told me he liked Jim Rempe's patterns best. Grady Matthews once suggested that John Ervolino played the patterns as well as anyone he ever saw. I'm sure those who saw Babe played the best patterns who have a strong case. What I do remember, however, is that my good friend Irving Crane had limitless respect for Babe.

Stu,

It's the strangest thing. Where ever I go and people hear I'm from New York, I always get the "hey, do you know so and so from the Bronx?". Having lived in Rochester most of my life, we call it Upstate. Most of my friends from NYC tell me Upstate starts once they cross the Tappan Zee! We're "two peoples separated by a common State" !

Near the end of his life, Pat, myself and a few others tried to get Irv to meet Babe for lunch. Damn if we could get that to happen. May have been a lot of respect but certainly no love.

Lyn

 

[WildWing]

Babe Cranfield lived and played in Syracuse, not Rochester. I got to know him quite well and practiced with him in 1977 and 1978 during graduate school at Syracuse. Larry Moy's book, along with some great conversation and urging from Larry prompted me to recall memories of Babe, his habits, cues, etc, and send them to Pool & Billiards magazine, which appeared in the November 2005 edition. This link should take you there if interested. Mine is the second letter on Babe that covers pages 10 and 11.

http://www.poolmag.com/store/index.cfm/fuseaction/feature.display/feature_id/248/index.cfm

 

[Wedge]

Thanks Ray Martin

Babe Cranfield beat Lassiter in a challenge match 1000 pts.
Babe won the right to this challenge because he finished 2nd in World Tournament that is how he became the World Champion.
Ray Martin

Nice to see a 3 Time World Straight Pool Champion posting on AZ.

Thanks Ray

 

[G&M]

Thank you, Frank, for starting this thread.

What a thrill that Mr. Ray Martin posts on this forum. I got to sit with Mr. Martin at the BCA Hall of Fame award ceremony in 1997, the year Babe was inducted. Ray was kind enough to sign my copy of The 99 Critical Shots in Pool!

Regarding Babe and Irving Crane's relationship, Hoot Albaugh, who has posted on this thread already, has a story about when he had dinner with both Babe and Mr. Crane, which would shed light on this topic. Babe told me that part of the reason he was able to progress to the pro level was because of all the fine players in Central NY coming up at the same time, naming Irving Crane and Joe Canton as among those players. Babe said that they all pushed and challenged each other, and all got better as a result. (Hey Stu -- Next time I see you at Amsterdam Billiards, will bring a map to prove that Syracuse and Rochester are in the center of the state and not at the North Pole!!!)

It is not a secret that Irving Crane, despite being a multi-time World Champion and despite all the recognition he received, was underrated. Babe gave Mr. Crane tremendous credit, but recognized that Irving had the Champion's attitude that he should win every match -- they all had that to some extent -- which contributed better to mutual respect than close personal friendship.

Thank you to all of the friends (and the World Champion and Hall-of-Famer!) who have contributed to this thread. Babe would be pleased that people remember him and are interested in his career.

Larry

 

[StraightPoolIU]

These are some of my favorite threads on AZ. Good stuff. Thanks guys.

 

[RedEyeJedi]

...he ran 420 in an exhibition....on a 5x10.

420. :grin-square:

 

[WildWing]

Thank you, Frank, for starting this thread.

What a thrill that Mr. Ray Martin posts on this forum. I got to sit with Mr. Martin at the BCA Hall of Fame award ceremony in 1997, the year Babe was inducted. Ray was kind enough to sign my copy of The 99 Critical Shots in Pool!

Regarding Babe and Irving Crane's relationship, Hoot Albaugh, who has posted on this thread already, has a story about when he had dinner with both Babe and Mr. Crane, which would shed light on this topic. Babe told me that part of the reason he was able to progress to the pro level was because of all the fine players in Central NY coming up at the same time, naming Irving Crane and Joe Canton as among those players. Babe said that they all pushed and challenged each other, and all got better as a result. (Hey Stu -- Next time I see you at Amsterdam Billiards, will bring a map to prove that Syracuse and Rochester are in the center of the state and not at the North Pole!!!)

It is not a secret that Irving Crane, despite being a multi-time World Champion and despite all the recognition he received, was underrated. Babe gave Mr. Crane tremendous credit, but recognized that Irving had the Champion's attitude that he should win every match -- they all had that to some extent -- which contributed better to mutual respect than close personal friendship.

Thank you to all of the friends (and the World Champion and Hall-of-Famer!) who have contributed to this thread. Babe would be pleased that people remember him and are interested in his career.

Larry

The dinner with Babe Canfield and Irving Crane took place in 1982 at Harrah's in Atantic City. This was the first of three tournaments where legends such as Cranfield and Crane were invited. Babe asked me to join him in the hotel cafeteria for dinner. He saw Crane in line and asked him to join us, which he did. Crane was quite agitated over the format of the tournament, which were all short games, 7, 8, and 9 ball. He stated emphatically that the short games were not how his reputation was made, and would rather have played straight pool. Cranfield agreed with the sentiment, but recognized that straight pool would not suit some of the competitors, such as Fats. Both Crane and Cranfield were very cordial to one another, and it was obvious they had a mutual respect. It likely was not a close friendship, for reasons Larry has noted. But there was respect, and at that time, they had somewhat of a mutual opponent - Mosconi, who won that tournament. Both Crane and Cranfield were somewhat irked about all the attention on Mosconi, much of which was attributable to the televised matches with Fats that had aired recently. But they both acknowledged that Mosconi was playing well. Hope that at least brings back memories for some who knew these past champions.

 

[sjm]

... they had somewhat of a mutual opponent - Mosconi, who won that tournament. Both Crane and Cranfield were somewhat irked about all the attention on Mosconi, much of which was attributable to the televised matches with Fats that had aired recently. But they both acknowledged that Mosconi was playing well. Hope that at least brings back memories for some who knew these past champions.

When considering Crane's feelings on Mosconi, don't forget that Mosconi found humor in Irving's conservative play and was not shy in saying so. In Crane's obituary in the NY Times, one such instance was recounted as follows:

''Crane wouldn't take a shot unless his grandmother could make it,'' Mosconi wrote in his autobiography, ''Willie's Game.''

Actually, Irving told me he believed himself to have been Willie's equal on a 5 x 10 but that on a 4 1/2 x 9, Willie was the clear favorite.