Beginner Needs Advice Again

I tried again with the option for getting the CB to the center of the table to shoot the 7 in straight in the corner.

This series of shots is drawing the CB no rails to try to get straight on the 7.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0lrNzXohQM&feature=youtu.be

This series of shots is drawing the CB 1 rail off the long rail to try to get straight on the 7. At the end of the video I show the way I showed before, going across table to shoot the 7 in the side.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6Hr5_u2XNA&feature=youtu.be

You can see on both videos, trying to get to the center of the table and straight on the 7 is very speed sensitive. It also leaves a longer shot on the 7. And when you do get out of line, you are out of line from a long distance. Everything about these two routes to the center of the table is harder for me than the several routes available to get the CB where you can shoot the 7 in the side.
 
iusedtoberich said:
This series of shots is drawing the CB 1 rail off the long rail to try to get straight on the 7. At the end of the video I show the way I showed before, going across table to shoot the 7 in the side.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6Hr5_u2XNA&feature=youtu.be

You can see on both videos, trying to get to the center of the table and straight on the 7 is very speed sensitive. It also leaves a longer shot on the 7. And when you do get out of line, you are out of line from a long distance. Everything about these two routes to the center of the table is harder for me than the several routes available to get the CB where you can shoot the 7 in the side.
Click to expand...

iusedtoberich,
I tried a lot of the suggestions last night and I agree with your conclusion, your chosen way seems to be the easiest for me. I had a lot of trouble getting the CB out into the middle of the table as well. Of course my skills are not very good (I've been playing since April and have taken three lessons). But I could not both get the angle right and also control the speed at the same time. I could do one or the other.

This whole discussion is really giving me some ideas about how people control the cue ball however, so it's great.

Mike
 
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JC said:
The trouble with coming across to the opposite rail and shooting the 7 across to the other side is that the 2 ball is 3/4 of a diamond below the ideal shape for the 7 in the side. The photo makes it look straight across from the shape zone but it not in actuality. This means you have to draw the cue ball rather than stun it which is way less reliable and harder to execute and will result in right hand (counter clockwise) spin on the ball if you hit the other rail which is easy to spin yourself into trouble with just a slight speed error. IMO this is not the correct nor reliable shot, especially for a lower level player.

JC
Click to expand...

Here is another photo from a different angle....
 
iusedtoberich said:
I tried again with the option for getting the CB to the center of the table to shoot the 7 in straight in the corner.

This series of shots is drawing the CB no rails to try to get straight on the 7.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0lrNzXohQM&feature=youtu.be

This series of shots is drawing the CB 1 rail off the long rail to try to get straight on the 7. At the end of the video I show the way I showed before, going across table to shoot the 7 in the side.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6Hr5_u2XNA&feature=youtu.be

You can see on both videos, trying to get to the center of the table and straight on the 7 is very speed sensitive. It also leaves a longer shot on the 7. And when you do get out of line, you are out of line from a long distance. Everything about these two routes to the center of the table is harder for me than the several routes available to get the CB where you can shoot the 7 in the side.
Click to expand...

If you are going to shoot for the opposite side then you should just take a slight back angle and shoot it from the other side of the table instead of bouncing off the long rail by the 2 ball. Less complicated. You never got the shape you were trying for in that video, which was a nearly straight in shot on the 7 in the side I assume?

JC
 
Maaaan nobody's gonna put up a video trying this one?
Don't make me do it, I don't have the camera or table.
I think some of you will be surprised at how easy it is to fall nicely on the 7.

5pZCVnd.jpg
 
Takumike said:
After my first lesson with Jerry he had me playing EO a *lot*. His rules for me were that I took ball in hand after every miss and kept going to 15, to a maximum of 4 balls-in-hand, keeping score for ten tables. So a perfect score would be 150. Then when I got to the point that I was scoring 140 or more for 10 tables, four or five times, then I went down to 3 balls-in-hand per rack. And so on.

I still play it a lot and almost always run out the 15 with one or two misses. But most of those misses happen near the end of the rack, which is why he suggested I do this runout drill once a day.

Oh, and while playing EO, he suggested I stop and repeat a shot whenever I found one I didn't understand or needed to practice. So for instance if I try low left and it turns out not to be the thing to do, I have to replace the balls and try it again until I find the right shot to play.

I do a lot of other drills too, some of which I made up. (Although I'm sure nothing is new.) One is: throw all the balls on the table. Using any ball as a cue ball, pocket that ball off any object ball. The object ball has to come back out if it goes into a pocket. This really teaches you the tangent line. It also helps you to not scratch!

Mike the Beginner
Click to expand...

Interesting. That is a modified version of equal offense. Do you try to execute a 14.1 break shot and get to 20? That is a great way to learn patterns and precise cue ball control.

There is another version where you switch to rotation at any time and each ball counts for 2 points after that.

Is that a brand new diamond table?
 
alstl said:
Is that a brand new diamond table?
Click to expand...

Sort of. It came out of a chain of bars that went belly up but it's been totally refurbished by the factory. All the wood was stripped, restained, and refinished, new feet, new cushions, new pockets, new cloth, and they even put a blue badge on it because it's fully up to current spec (originally it had a red badge and the old "League" pockets, which I actually would have preferred). It's about ten years old though and there are a few gouges in the slate. All told I got about $3k off the price of a new one. I didn't actually buy it from Diamond but they gave me a warranty on it for the refurb work.

Mike
 
CreeDo said:
Maaaan nobody's gonna put up a video trying this one?
Don't make me do it, I don't have the camera or table.
I think some of you will be surprised at how easy it is to fall nicely on the 7.

5pZCVnd.jpg
Click to expand...

This is the first shot I thought about when looking at the layout, everything falls into place shooting the 2 this way. I think one of your problems may be that you are looking for too easy of a shot, sometimes you real need to make a shot that is not the easiest to get the runout. There is nothing hard about shooting the 2 as shown , its just not as easy as shooting it in the near corner.---Smitty
 
Harold Smith said:
This is the first shot I thought about when looking at the layout, everything falls into place shooting the 2 this way. I think one of your problems may be that you are looking for too easy of a shot, sometimes you real need to make a shot that is not the easiest to get the runout. There is nothing hard about shooting the 2 as shown , its just not as easy as shooting it in the near corner.---Smitty
Click to expand...


Well, first of all, CreeDo still totally rocks (he's the guy who taught me how to draw the ball, here on AZB--I still do that drill with the 9 ball at least once a week), but I'm not sure this is so obvious. I don't have any trouble hitting the 2 this way, but you need pretty good speed control and just the right angle and amount of follow to stop the ball for the 7.

I tried this about 30 times and sank the 2 about 26 times, landed with acceptable position 7 times and good position 3 times out of those 7. As I've been saying, I know my speed control needs a lot of work, so trying this 30 times is just the sort of reason that exercises like this are good for me.

Mike the Beginner
 
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Harold Smith said:
This is the first shot I thought about when looking at the layout, everything falls into place shooting the 2 this way. I think one of your problems may be that you are looking for too easy of a shot, sometimes you real need to make a shot that is not the easiest to get the runout. There is nothing hard about shooting the 2 as shown , its just not as easy as shooting it in the near corner.---Smitty
Click to expand...

:dance:


For real...the first time I saw it done this way--I thought of women's pool league.
For some reason they like to shoot the long shot and get position to shoot long shots.

I watch women all the time and instead of getting position to shoot a three foot shot, they seem to get position for a 6 foot shot.:wub:
 
poolguy4u said:
:dance:


For real...the first time I saw it done this way--I thought of women's pool league.
For some reason they like to shoot the long shot and get position to shoot long shots.

I watch women all the time and instead of getting position to shoot a three foot shot, they seem to get position for a 6 foot shot.:wub:
Click to expand...

is longer better.......:cool:
just askin.....:D
 
fwiw
i went to the table today to try the layout and the different position routes
in spite of my first default of playing shape to the center of the table
i found the across the tablle to play the 7 in the side theasieast and most repeatable option
the draw to the center was very much speed and quality of hit dependent
 
Takumike said:
Well, first of all, CreeDo still totally rocks (he's the guy who taught me how to draw the ball, here on AZB--I still do that drill with the 9 ball at least once a week), but I'm not sure this is so obvious. I don't have any trouble hitting the 2 this way, but you need pretty good speed control and just the right angle and amount of follow to stop the ball for the 7.

I tried this about 30 times and sank the 2 about 26 times, landed with acceptable position 7 times and good position 3 times out of those 7. As I've been saying, I know my speed control needs a lot of work, so trying this 30 times is just the sort of reason that exercises like this are good for me.

Mike the Beginner
Click to expand...

Thanks man ^^
Well, having not tried this exact shot myself it may be tougher than I thought.
I guess it relies on lots of experience to know the exact angle and speed. And for a million bucks
I wouldn't want to shoot a ball I could miss, not even 1 out of 30 tries.

I plan on trying this layout at the pool room sometime. It'd be good to know how to
"dogproof" this layout for the future because it will surely come up someday.
 
I am a beginner at pool and trying similar drills that the OP describes here. Before reading all the posts, I tried to figure out what I would do - and then read through and didn't see anyone having mentioned this pattern (I apologize if I missed it).

Perhaps you all could state the problems or difficulties involved with the pattern I came up with:

Start by a stop shot on the 9 in the side. Then the 12 in the corner with follow. If follow a little, would set up for 7 in side. If follow a bit more, would set up for 7 in corner (same side as 2 ball). Hit 7 with follow to get shape on 2. All *seem* like relatively easy shots...

Am I missing something?

Thanks!
 
odoner said:
Am I missing something?
Click to expand...

Yup, you are--the drill is I have to sink the balls in order. So in this case, 2 first, then 7, then 9, then 12.

The other rules are no tough shots and no hard cuts...meaning I have to get the CB into good position for each shot.

But hey, it's nice to see another beginner here. When did you start playing?

MtB
 
his is how you create "Zones" in position play

Mike the Beginner said:
Here is another photo from a different angle....
Click to expand...

The Diamonds on the table serve several purposes. You've probably heard of the various "Diamond Systems" and they are useful, but also complicated for a beginner.

Have you ever backed down a long, straight drive way? It's difficult to stay on the road if you are looking at the road - but if you pick a telephone pool, fence pole, mail box, or tree aligned to the end of the drive way and simply drive towards that point you will automatically stay on the road.

This is what the Diamonds on a pool table are used for.....to go towards, like in the analogy of backing down the drive way...the Diamonds are the "Tree, pole, etc.".

With this in mind try going towards the middle Diamond over by the 10 Ball, either one rail or two......don't think about the table, think about a straight path and make your cue ball get on that "track" or line so that you can shoot the 7 Ball in the side pocket.

This system comes up in so many different ways, shapes and forms on a pool table, I use it subconsciously on most ever shot.....and consciously on ones that I need to maximize my margin of error for positioning.

This is how you create "Zones" in position play - let me know if you have any questions on "Zoning".....it's essential for learning to get quickly to your next skill level. 'The Game is Our Teacher'
 
scratchs said:
I just wanted to say great job everybody..I've enjoyed reading this
thread.
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OP seconds that, for sure. It's decent and generous of you more skilled and more experienced players to take the time to share your knowledge and opinions with someone starting out. I always learn a lot.

Mike

P.S. I have tried just about every suggestion.
 
Ack, my bad. The order is rather important rule! Sorry for the mis-read.

As per your question, the end of January marks the completion of my first year of playing in a league. I've been trying to take things a lot more seriously is past year to get my stroke in order, etc. I've knocked balls around in the past, but never with any thought to "studying" the game. It's been a rollercoaster, that's for sure. Hard to find consistency, but I'm trying :-)

Thanks for the interesting post!
 
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