Changing my ways... Mike Surber's death has got me thinking... PLEASE READ!!!

ugotactionTX

ugotactionTX

I'm in dead rack!
Silver Member
The murder of Mike Surber among other reasons has really got me thinking. I believe that most of us are a bit cavalier in telling others (basically strangers) about the cues, cases and other valuables that we own. Many of us list the cues (expensive or not) we own or play with as part of our profiles or in our sig lines for posts. Not like we're bragging, just telling folks what we have and use. I'm thinking maybe that ain't too smart...

In this day and age it's pretty simple to find out real names, addresses, phone numbers among other personal information. With a little more digging someone could easily find out when were home, at work, playing pool, whatever. It would be VERY easy to find out these things and exploit them.

I guess I'm just a little freaked out by Mike Surber's death even though I never met the man. I don't know if he was targeted because of a steer or was just unlucky, picked after a little social engineering. Not too different than the way we used to "hack" computers and networks back in day (way back) find out a little information, ask a few telling questions and then before you know it, you had pretty much everything you needed.

Even though my valuables are pretty safe, I think I'm going to be A LOT more protective of my information, my schedules, my hang out's, pretty much all of it. There's enough bad stuff happening to people without broadcasting to the entire freaking globe what we own, where we go, what we do and with whom.

thoughts? am I over reacting?
 
don't make it easy for the bad guys

I think that Mike's death is a wake up call to a lot of us. I can't help wondering if the police are dragging their feet a little because they don't really place much priority on the case. From my own close relationship with various law enforcement agencies years ago I know that they aren't vastly concerned when one lowlife takes another lowlife off of the board. Mike was far from being a lowlife but I can't help wondering if any pool player is a lowlife in the eyes of the LEO's involved and his death not important in their world?

Concerning the rest of your post which doesn't pertain to Mike, I have warned many people about posting pictures of valuable collections on other forums and I think that too much information on any public site is a bad thing. As a general rule I try to keep my private information private. That doesn't mean that someone can't seek it out but if a predator comes looking for me I can figure that they put some effort into finding me and can respond appropriately.

We can all be more cautious. The vast majority of people around the pool world are good folks. Unfortunately the pool halls also attract those looking for easy or fast money. Strangers should be kept at a little distance until we know them better and a few of the people we see all the time should be kept at a little distance too. Many people at my local pool hall are welcome in my home without a second thought. There are a couple I wouldn't invite . . .

Hu
 
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I don't think you are overreacting at all. I totally agree with you as a matter of fact. I have heard and seen incidences where certain people are targeted because of being known for carrying lots of money,cues,or whatever else may be of value. The pool room unfortunately can be a treacherous place if you are not careful what you show or what you say to others.Watch your butt,because not many others will..
 
ugotactionTX said:
I guess I'm just a little freaked
thoughts? am I over reacting?
Click to expand...

Yes and no. It's not fruitful to live life scared because there are too many things and people to be scared of. Life is meant to be lived and that means taking reasonable risks. I know people who live horrible lives because they are afraid of everything.

Remember that most strangers can be trusted. Just watch out for friends and relatives. :wink: People's true character does show through pretty fast.

On the other hand, I have always been extra cautious about my home and who I socialize with. If I invite someone over, I have to know them very well and trust them. Even a gardener or pool man or salesman - I check them out . I don't want to worry around my most prized possessions - my family.

Always try to be aware of who you are dealing with and what you are exposing yourself to.

Chris
 
ugotactionTX said:
The murder of Mike Surber among other reasons has really got me thinking. I believe that most of us are a bit cavalier in telling others (basically strangers) about the cues, cases and other valuables that we own. Many of us list the cues (expensive or not) we own or play with as part of our profiles or in our sig lines for posts. Not like we're bragging, just telling folks what we have and use. I'm thinking maybe that ain't too smart...

In this day and age it's pretty simple to find out real names, addresses, phone numbers among other personal information. With a little more digging someone could easily find out when were home, at work, playing pool, whatever. It would be VERY easy to find out these things and exploit them.

I guess I'm just a little freaked out by Mike Surber's death even though I never met the man. I don't know if he was targeted because of a steer or was just unlucky, picked after a little social engineering. Not too different than the way we used to "hack" computers and networks back in day (way back) find out a little information, ask a few telling questions and then before you know it, you had pretty much everything you needed.

Even though my valuables are pretty safe, I think I'm going to be A LOT more protective of my information, my schedules, my hang out's, pretty much all of it. There's enough bad stuff happening to people without broadcasting to the entire freaking globe what we own, where we go, what we do and with whom.

thoughts? am I over reacting?
Click to expand...

Personally, i don't think so.
If you know anything about me, you know that i am anonymous, and fiercely guard my identity.

Why you ask?

Because i've already had to deal with people showing up looking for me. Stalkers for lack of a better word, who legitimately wanted to hurt me because they didn't like some things i had to say.

The sad thing is, that people think it's some big joke. Like, what's the big deal with letting us know who you are.
To the point of people constantly harping on it to the point that it just getting old.
I mean, i can understand if they want to put a face to the name, but if you can't respect someone's motives for being private, why in the hell would i tell you anyway?

Mine is an extreme example, obviously, but then again, who really knows who the heck is doing research on you and why.

I know that the people who actually know me, for the most part, knew me before this internet thing.
As for new people, sure i can meet them in real life, but you really have to stand out or come highly recommended for me to trust you enough to out myself online. To me that's just asking for trouble. Like, BIG TIME.

To be honest, i think people are a little naive in thinking that this whole internet process is safe, simply because it takes place in the comfort of ones home, or work, or the coffee shop, or wherever.
When in reality, you are exposing yourself to people where you have no idea of their backgrounds or who they are, but instead, you see who they represent themselves as.

But that's just my take on it.
 
ugotactionTX said:
The murder of Mike Surber among other reasons has really got me thinking. I believe that most of us are a bit cavalier in telling others (basically strangers) about the cues, cases and other valuables that we own. Many of us list the cues (expensive or not) we own or play with as part of our profiles or in our sig lines for posts. Not like we're bragging, just telling folks what we have and use. I'm thinking maybe that ain't too smart...

In this day and age it's pretty simple to find out real names, addresses, phone numbers among other personal information. With a little more digging someone could easily find out when were home, at work, playing pool, whatever. It would be VERY easy to find out these things and exploit them.

I guess I'm just a little freaked out by Mike Surber's death even though I never met the man. I don't know if he was targeted because of a steer or was just unlucky, picked after a little social engineering. Not too different than the way we used to "hack" computers and networks back in day (way back) find out a little information, ask a few telling questions and then before you know it, you had pretty much everything you needed.

Even though my valuables are pretty safe, I think I'm going to be A LOT more protective of my information, my schedules, my hang out's, pretty much all of it. There's enough bad stuff happening to people without broadcasting to the entire freaking globe what we own, where we go, what we do and with whom.

thoughts? am I over reacting?
Click to expand...

I think it is a good time to discuss such matters in light of the terrible tragedy of Mike. I have often thought very much of the same things. Being in this business we sometimes use material things as a sign of prestige. We have no problems boasting about our cue collections, cases, bankrolls, and other personal objects of value. Hell, a lot of us gamble quite a bit and have no problem discussing dollar amounts, or even flashing a bankroll from time to time as a symbol of prosperous times in our gambling exhibitions. Such pecuniary things can catch the eye of a myriad of thugs and thieves in such an unstable time. I often have to remind myself that some of the things we do as pool players are taken for granted, and there are people struggling to put food on the table every single day, much less have the luxury of betting a few hundred on the next TAR match or buying the newest OB shaft.

I think we should begin to operate with a bit more caution. I thought of this same thing tonight while driving home, and decided I'm going to operate a lot differently and not disclose things to people I do not know, no matter how nice or trustworthy they may seem.

People have killed over the most minimal of things, and $1,000 dollar cues and bankrolls would be a score that would change the lives of some of these creeps (at least in their eyes for a short period of time) and be easy pickings in many a rooms across the country.
 
ugotactionTX said:
The murder of Mike Surber among other reasons has really got me thinking. I believe that most of us are a bit cavalier in telling others (basically strangers) about the cues, cases and other valuables that we own. Many of us list the cues (expensive or not) we own or play with as part of our profiles or in our sig lines for posts. Not like we're bragging, just telling folks what we have and use. I'm thinking maybe that ain't too smart...

In this day and age it's pretty simple to find out real names, addresses, phone numbers among other personal information. With a little more digging someone could easily find out when were home, at work, playing pool, whatever. It would be VERY easy to find out these things and exploit them.

I guess I'm just a little freaked out by Mike Surber's death even though I never met the man. I don't know if he was targeted because of a steer or was just unlucky, picked after a little social engineering. Not too different than the way we used to "hack" computers and networks back in day (way back) find out a little information, ask a few telling questions and then before you know it, you had pretty much everything you needed.

Even though my valuables are pretty safe, I think I'm going to be A LOT more protective of my information, my schedules, my hang out's, pretty much all of it. There's enough bad stuff happening to people without broadcasting to the entire freaking globe what we own, where we go, what we do and with whom.

thoughts? am I over reacting?
Click to expand...

Mike never did any of the above, he never posted his
cues in his avatar, never pasted them in his signature line,
he never told strangers about them and he never never
ever boasted to anyone what he had.

He never carried a huge bankroll these days, nor did he ever
get in anyone's face to gamble. Mike never ever bragged about
anything and he had lots to brag about, but he was a quiet guy.


thanks
barb
 
While I think not possibly showing off your cues you are still going to use your main shooter even if its a Prewitt or Bushka, etc. You'd have to shoot with a SP and not hardly carry any money to NOT be targeted these days. We all know thats almost impossible sadly. We might never know why Mike was targeted. He could have accidently flashed a roll or the guys knew about him in advance. It could have been online or by him just being at the pool hall. He could have cased the place for months and knew through the people there that Mike was the main stick there and would play for money. There is a ton of possibilities out there.

With the economy the way it is, we are more than likely targets if we are in a known place and gamble. It will only get worse.
 
ugotactionTX said:
The murder of Mike Surber among other reasons has really got me thinking. I believe that most of us are a bit cavalier in telling others (basically strangers) about the cues, cases and other valuables that we own. Many of us list the cues (expensive or not) we own or play with as part of our profiles or in our sig lines for posts. Not like we're bragging, just telling folks what we have and use. I'm thinking maybe that ain't too smart...

In this day and age it's pretty simple to find out real names, addresses, phone numbers among other personal information. With a little more digging someone could easily find out when were home, at work, playing pool, whatever. It would be VERY easy to find out these things and exploit them.

I guess I'm just a little freaked out by Mike Surber's death even though I never met the man. I don't know if he was targeted because of a steer or was just unlucky, picked after a little social engineering. Not too different than the way we used to "hack" computers and networks back in day (way back) find out a little information, ask a few telling questions and then before you know it, you had pretty much everything you needed.

Even though my valuables are pretty safe, I think I'm going to be A LOT more protective of my information, my schedules, my hang out's, pretty much all of it. There's enough bad stuff happening to people without broadcasting to the entire freaking globe what we own, where we go, what we do and with whom.

thoughts? am I over reacting?
Click to expand...

I don't think that you are overreacting. Although I don't think Mike's death had anything to do with the internet it's clear that the more public a person is with their life the more of a target they are for the type of people who look for easy targets.

I have often thought about the people who list their collections, where they live, how much they bet etc.... and how it seems to me that if I were a lurker who also happened to be a criminal mastermind I could pretty much pick my targets at will from among this and many such message boards.

On cues one of the things that probably keeps most safe is that the cues bragged about here would be hard to move in the pool world. Most of them at least. But still that wouldn't necessarily stop someone from rolling one of us if they didn't know any better.

With Edwin's murder I have thought a lot about how many crazy people there are out there and the fact that no one really knows who is on the other side of the keyboard. Or who is reading and plotting. For that reason I don't let people on this board know where I will be unless it's a very public venue. People who need to know where I am beyond that are on a need-to-know basis.

I think it's time we all took a step back and realized that we can still have community without broadcasting to the world everything about our lives and making it easy for criminals and crazies to target us.
 
SUPERSTAR said:
Personally, i don't think so.
If you know anything about me, you know that i am anonymous, and fiercely guard my identity.

Why you ask?

Because i've already had to deal with people showing up looking for me. Stalkers for lack of a better word, who legitimately wanted to hurt me because they didn't like some things i had to say.

The sad thing is, that people think it's some big joke. Like, what's the big deal with letting us know who you are.
To the point of people constantly harping on it to the point that it just getting old.
I mean, i can understand if they want to put a face to the name, but if you can't respect someone's motives for being private, why in the hell would i tell you anyway?

Mine is an extreme example, obviously, but then again, who really knows who the heck is doing research on you and why.

I know that the people who actually know me, for the most part, knew me before this internet thing.
As for new people, sure i can meet them in real life, but you really have to stand out or come highly recommended for me to trust you enough to out myself online. To me that's just asking for trouble. Like, BIG TIME.

To be honest, i think people are a little naive in thinking that this whole internet process is safe, simply because it takes place in the comfort of ones home, or work, or the coffee shop, or wherever.
When in reality, you are exposing yourself to people where you have no idea of their backgrounds or who they are, but instead, you see who they represent themselves as.

But that's just my take on it.
Click to expand...

I am in 100% agreement here.

I am a case in point where people have stalked and attacked me personally just because they don't agree with some of what I say. I have had people spread lies about me, my relationships, my business, etc.... all because they KNOW WHO I AM.

When you are anonymous these trolls fall away because they have nothing to hold onto. The same thing applies to any criminally minded people reading this - they can't touch you because they don't know who you are.

People ARE incredibly naive about "the Internet".

Pick any member here and spend a few minutes going through their posts and you can often pick up enough information on them to run some sort of scam or robbery if you are so inclined.

Then lets talk about the fact that Google and others are collection EVERY WORD that is written here and putting it in their databases.

Don't think for a second that someone somewhere can't build a very good profile of who you are and what you are into by tracking your internet activity. Google goes through the front door and catalogs everything that is published on the net that they can. Other entities have the keys to the architecture of the net and can track activity in many other ways.

The FBI has their Carnivore program which is essentially Google for the government - a program that not only monitors all the public activity but also pretty much at the flip of a switch can monitor your chats and emails and ANYTHING YOU SEND OVER THE INTERNET.

So, it's definitely wise to keep as much private as you can lest it come back to haunt you in some way.
 
ugotactionTX said:
The murder of Mike Surber among other reasons has really got me thinking. I believe that most of us are a bit cavalier in telling others (basically strangers) about the cues, cases and other valuables that we own. Many of us list the cues (expensive or not) we own or play with as part of our profiles or in our sig lines for posts. Not like we're bragging, just telling folks what we have and use. I'm thinking maybe that ain't too smart...

In this day and age it's pretty simple to find out real names, addresses, phone numbers among other personal information. With a little more digging someone could easily find out when were home, at work, playing pool, whatever. It would be VERY easy to find out these things and exploit them.

I guess I'm just a little freaked out by Mike Surber's death even though I never met the man. I don't know if he was targeted because of a steer or was just unlucky, picked after a little social engineering. Not too different than the way we used to "hack" computers and networks back in day (way back) find out a little information, ask a few telling questions and then before you know it, you had pretty much everything you needed.

Even though my valuables are pretty safe, I think I'm going to be A LOT more protective of my information, my schedules, my hang out's, pretty much all of it. There's enough bad stuff happening to people without broadcasting to the entire freaking globe what we own, where we go, what we do and with whom.

thoughts? am I over reacting?
Click to expand...

This is a good post!! I'm surprised it's never come around before!!

I spent many years on the road and years ago used to flash the fancy cues, the big bankrolls and so forth. Once you get robbed and look down the barrel of a 357, your attitude can change quickly! Times are far crazier now than they were back then!!

I have a rule now or a couple of them! Never tell anyone,,,,ANYONE where you are staying. Lie to them! Never pull our your entire bankroll! Never leave the building alone. Wait until a group or several are leaving! If you catch those twitchy guys watching your every move, go the othe pay phone and call the police and tell them some blonde is being raped in a blue Mercedes. When you see the lights of the cop cars, hit the road!!
 
PLEASE know that I am in no way downplaying the sadness or the wrongness of Mikes murder. What I am about to say has nothing to do with Mike, it has to do with the topic at hand.
Bad things happen to good people. Its a sad fact of life, that you can worry about, you can stress about it, and you can try to prepare for. But if something is going to happen like a robbery or a mugging etc...... there is not a lot you can do about it, especially if you are hit from behind. You can get guns and train for years, but if you are jumped/shot before you know the situation is bad.... see where Im going with this?
The best rule of thumb is to treat people well, and dont put yourself in situations where the odds of something bad happening are increased. And by Mikes example.... sometimes that is not even enough. :(
Chuck
 
I had been out of the pool scene for many years until turn of the century. [just wanted to use that term, "turn of the century."]

At this time, we were at a pool tournament, and my boyfriend came in second place, pocketing a few dimes. After the tournament, he gambled and won a bigger chunk of cheese than the tournament payout monies in front of a full house of onlookers. At the end of the night -- or early morning, I should say, we were holding about 15 dimes, I think. :)

I was a little green with the pool scene but not green enough to sense that we should be going back home, getting out of town quickly, holding this kind of money. :cool:

Outside of the pool room, it was a blizzard, snowing really hard. We got in the car and one of the "regulars" inside came running out, stating we should not leave, and that if we leave, my partner would have a bad name of "quitting winner." In other words, he wanted us to stay in town. :rolleyes:

A conversation ensued with my boyfriend and this "friend" of his, with the friend stating we should not leave town. The more the "friend" said not to leave town, the more I wanted to get the hell out of there fast. :mad:

At one point, I told my boyfriend that if he wanted to stay, fine, but I'm going home. It was Sunday night, and it was going to be a long drive back to D.C. in the snow, normally an 8-hour trek in good weather. :eek:

Soon I felt it was time to stop jiving and start driving. My boyfriend reluctantly decided to come along for the ride. We made it back home. Shortly thereafter, there was a robbery involving some of the same people that were inside that pool room that evening. :sorry:

Sometimes a woman's intuition is right on the money [pun intended]. :wink:
 
CocoboloCowboy said:
In WW-II a moto for keeping information out of the ememey use was "Looses Lips Sink Ships"
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That's a great expression, one worth remembering for sure in the pool room.:)

On the other hand, I have come to understand this quote more and more in recent years:

Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.
 
That's why I shoot with a Vigus. Not only do other players pitty you but homeless people will give you money.

Seriously, It's good to be weary, but don't let it change you. After my dad was shot and killed by a friend of his over very little, I became very carfull about who I trusted. The truth is people die over the stuipidest stuff. It's better to live your life, than be afraid of losing it.

Larry
 
hey larry... I knew you were on here but wasn't sure what name you were using. when I saw that you played with a "Vigus" I figured it out pretty quickly... :D
 
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