Snapshot9 said:
Wouldn't one Altoid put you over .004? Our legal limit here is .07. Get caught driving at .08 and it's DUI time.
Drug Testing?
- Thread starter CrownCityCorey
- Start date
Wouldn't one Altoid put you over .004? Our legal limit here is .07. Get caught driving at .08 and it's DUI time.
I think its ridiculous to force people to piss in a cup so they can freakin play pool. Most of the people who support this kind of crap aren't the ones who have to whip it out every time some administrative clown says so.
I've had to do it over 20 times for work and it gets old real f***ing quick. Sometimes you get to wait for 20-30 minutes and then have to try and not blow the cup out of your hand when they let you "donate" your sample (it says that on the paperwork). Thats big fun.
I've worked in chemistry labs for over ten years and have seen machines give bad results for a number of reasons. Its one thing when its a test of a product, its a whole different deal when someones' livelihood is on the line. May only happen 1 in a 1000+ but if its you, your screwed.
What's next, gps trackers to make sure the players aren't going to places the tour disapproves of? Private detectives spying on 'em? Bug their phones?
Christ, tell them slacks & collared shirts, don't act like an asshole, and let them play.
I've had to do it over 20 times for work and it gets old real f***ing quick. Sometimes you get to wait for 20-30 minutes and then have to try and not blow the cup out of your hand when they let you "donate" your sample (it says that on the paperwork). Thats big fun.
I've worked in chemistry labs for over ten years and have seen machines give bad results for a number of reasons. Its one thing when its a test of a product, its a whole different deal when someones' livelihood is on the line. May only happen 1 in a 1000+ but if its you, your screwed.
What's next, gps trackers to make sure the players aren't going to places the tour disapproves of? Private detectives spying on 'em? Bug their phones?
Christ, tell them slacks & collared shirts, don't act like an asshole, and let them play.
I hop they do.CrownCityCorey said:
I might be the only player left on tour.
some players excluded, you know who you are.
bud green said:
Prior to December 6,1986 I was under the influence of a lot of chemicals. Some of these chemicals were taken to enhance my playing ability. Shawn knows what he is talking about. Just because I quit, doesnt mean that the practice has died. Gambling was not so much about who played the best, it was about who could play the best the longest, and that meant endurance. It was more about chemical warfare than about good pool in many of the situations I witnessed and participated in. If I were to pee into a plastic cup in 1985 it would have melted.
Today I have no problem with urine testing. There is nothing in my urine and they can have as much of it as they want, I have nothing to hide. Bottle it and sell it for all I care. As far as getting the attitude that Bud has... any employer, tour director, agency, whoever has the right to provide and enforce a drug free environment. You don't have to be part of that environment if you don't want to. If a player would have a problem with providing a urine sample (if this rule is enforced) then that player will become a very unhappy railbird. End of story.
Drugs for gambling sessions is a whole different matter than for tourneys. In a staying awake contest, of course a guy on speed will have an advantage if the other player agrees to play all night. In a tourney, that guy will crash from fatigue or get too spacy to play his best game half the time.
What drug could players possibly use now that actually helps in a long tourney? People on hard stuff are real easy to spot when they start screwing up (the legend of Tony W., for instance). Does anyone think smoking weed is some big advantage for playing pool at this level? First people tell you it will make you stupid and now its an advantage in eight-ball, where you have to think about strategy, make a lot of decisions,etc...
Next time you have to take a leak, don't. Sit on a couch and wait for 30 minutes (my longest was 40 minutes- I told them they could have it in a cup or wring it out my pants) . Then go pee. Afterwards, have someone tell you its ok to wash your hands now. Nice boy, Roscoe. Thats a good dog. Ooops, I mean human.
Some might want to show the world they're sober, I'm getting tired of proving it time and time again.
I got hired for a project in Georgia for a company that makes Splenda (artificial sweetener). Passed a piss test. I volunteer for a 3 week project in Alabama where me and a coworker end up saving them $400K. In the middle of working 12-15 hour graveyard shifts filtering chemical solutions that contain DMF (its toxic), they send someone to tell me not only do they want me to take a second piss test in a month, they want a respiratory test. The best part: they knew there was no job left for me back in Georgia. That project is cancelled but they still want to **** with their employees. Drug free environmment? The only ones they offered permanent jobs in Alabama included me and a former truck driver who took speed all the time. You know what? He kicked ass at work and his partying never affected his work. Thats why we were the 2 out of 40 offered the jobs. I'll take an intelligent person who handles their partying over a low IQ sober person anyday.
My supervisor in Ga was a former addict. Like Blackjack, a nice intelligent guy who has been sober for a while. My boss was sober 17 years, worked hard, didn't miss work, churchgoer even. Johnson & Johnson made him take three piss tests in one month, saying his number just kept coming up for random tests. Believe me, he was getting a little tired of this crap too, and he minds it a lot less than me.
Actually, I've never failed a test (23 out of 23 negative. No fake pee.) so its not that I'm worried about getting busted for something. It just seriously gets old after awhile. Ever notice management is almost never subjected to this crap, definately not random testing?
Its a basic lack of respect for peoples privacy. They're pool players, not jet pilots strapped to 50 million dollar planes or school bus drivers.
What drug could players possibly use now that actually helps in a long tourney? People on hard stuff are real easy to spot when they start screwing up (the legend of Tony W., for instance). Does anyone think smoking weed is some big advantage for playing pool at this level? First people tell you it will make you stupid and now its an advantage in eight-ball, where you have to think about strategy, make a lot of decisions,etc...
Next time you have to take a leak, don't. Sit on a couch and wait for 30 minutes (my longest was 40 minutes- I told them they could have it in a cup or wring it out my pants) . Then go pee. Afterwards, have someone tell you its ok to wash your hands now. Nice boy, Roscoe. Thats a good dog. Ooops, I mean human.
Some might want to show the world they're sober, I'm getting tired of proving it time and time again.
I got hired for a project in Georgia for a company that makes Splenda (artificial sweetener). Passed a piss test. I volunteer for a 3 week project in Alabama where me and a coworker end up saving them $400K. In the middle of working 12-15 hour graveyard shifts filtering chemical solutions that contain DMF (its toxic), they send someone to tell me not only do they want me to take a second piss test in a month, they want a respiratory test. The best part: they knew there was no job left for me back in Georgia. That project is cancelled but they still want to **** with their employees. Drug free environmment? The only ones they offered permanent jobs in Alabama included me and a former truck driver who took speed all the time. You know what? He kicked ass at work and his partying never affected his work. Thats why we were the 2 out of 40 offered the jobs. I'll take an intelligent person who handles their partying over a low IQ sober person anyday.
My supervisor in Ga was a former addict. Like Blackjack, a nice intelligent guy who has been sober for a while. My boss was sober 17 years, worked hard, didn't miss work, churchgoer even. Johnson & Johnson made him take three piss tests in one month, saying his number just kept coming up for random tests. Believe me, he was getting a little tired of this crap too, and he minds it a lot less than me.
Actually, I've never failed a test (23 out of 23 negative. No fake pee.) so its not that I'm worried about getting busted for something. It just seriously gets old after awhile. Ever notice management is almost never subjected to this crap, definately not random testing?
Its a basic lack of respect for peoples privacy. They're pool players, not jet pilots strapped to 50 million dollar planes or school bus drivers.
Shawn Putnam said:
Interesting comment, Shawn.
As a pro, could you tell me if drugs, that actually enhance players' abilities, are used in pro tournaments? And what are those drugs and exactly how do they enhance play? I use an herb and alcohol occasionally but I'd hardly call them "enhancement" drugs, but for some I suppose they could be.
I ask because I can't think of a good drug for improved pool, but I'm certainly no expert on the subject and have little contact with pro players to know what they prefer. Someone mentioned beta blockers for their calming abilities, but there's tons of products that can promote similar results, so should testing be done on everything that helps calm nerves and increase concentration (cigs, alcohol, ginseng, ginkgo, calcium, L-theanine, ashwagandha, beta sitosterol, L-tyrosine, B complex, etc. etc.) or just on some substances?
Since you want to see this implemented, may I ask you where would you draw the line and which products should be tested for?
Thanks,
Jeff Livingston
Personally I think the number of people playing pro these days who actually take any kind of illicit substance is low...Only a little alcohol here and there. I think it would be just a waste of time and money for the sport
If someone was suspected of using drugs then perhaps on a 1 on 1 basis would be more effective....
________
If someone was suspected of using drugs then perhaps on a 1 on 1 basis would be more effective....
________
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Blackjack said:
I'd say that's the beginning of the story, not the end...
Blackjack, I asked Shawn P. a similar question: On which drugs and where do you draw the line for testing being OK? And why those drugs and not others?
Notice that employers are testing for illegal drugs, mostly. Why is that, when most legal drugs are more harmful than illegal drugs? If they test for just domr illegal drugs, then their intent isn't to improve workplace safety. So what is their intent? Or more to the point, what are the true consequences of testing, both good and bad? Who really wins and who really loses?
And the question I asked before that went unanswered: If there is currently no problem drug(s) being used, why start any new problems in the shakey pool world by introducing testing?
Jeff Livingston
vagabond said:
A whole new "World" structure would have to be organized. With Continental Federations/Confederations or Associations for anyone not wanting anything to do with the WCBS, WPA and the IOC.
showboat said:
Anyone weighing less than 220 lbs who drinks 2 beers within an hour would be legally intoxicated according to WADA Rules.
A 220 pounder who drinks 3 beers within an hour would have alcohol content of .05 which is in excess of the .04 that apparently will be or has been imposed by the WCBS.
I used this table to provide the above information:
http://www.ou.edu/oupd/bac.htm
If pool is ever going to be taken seriously as a sport, any drugs are simply unacceptable. And about having a few beers between matches...if you allow this, those 'few beers' will be more like ten for some players. It's a pro tournament with a big prize money, not a social event at Joe's tavern...you're not supposed to drink at all IMO.
Now the ORG that is paying for the tests has to validate med info? 2nd opinion you say, at your own cost? How much does this club cost?Jimmy M. said:
What do they ask...is the juice worth the squeeze?!
chefjeff said:
It should fall in line with IOC standards. This attitude of "why?" is what keeps us running in place. My attitude is "why not?" If there is no drug problem, why should it matter if they pee in a urinal or a cup? As I said before, I have nothing to hide, so testing doesn't bother me. I recognize it as a necessary evil, not a condemnation on my character or an aggressive cross examination of my current lifestyle. If we want the recognition we believe that we deserve, then we need to take measures to earn that respect. Ping Pong has met the IOC standards. What's wrong with pool? There are several groups in Asia and other parts of the world that are aggresively moving towards meeting or exceeding IOC standards. Look at this link, which gives a brief history of this battle:
http://www.ibsf.org/wcbs/index.php
Look around that site and tell me that nobody is trying.
IOC will need the cooperaton of al the disciplines in billiards (Carom/Pocket?Snooker). This one of the major reasons I am opposed to the attitude of the IPT. They seem unwilling to cooperate and that is detrimental to the direction the world bodies are trying to direct billiards. Drug testing is just part of this process, not all of it. Worrying about drug testing is premature, we need to focus on unifying snooker, carom and pocket billiards to form a world body. If we stick our noses up and say we don't care, then so much for earning respect from anyone.
Blackjack said:
Testing at the pro-level is a joke. Take a look at cycling/ soccer/ baseball/ football. It is too often either guilty until 'b' sample exonerates, or a get out of jail free card. There is too much uncertainty, red-tape, mixed interests and costs to make it effective. Maybe the dopers should be allowed to make their hearts explode or turn themselves into vegetables.
World Confederation of Billiards - Policies
Here is a link to the World Confederation of Billiards Anti Doping Rules (ADR)
http://www.billiard-wcbs.org/Doping.pdf
It is not an unreasonable policy at all, and the same standards are used in all sports, games, etc. Nobody is pointing fingers, it is just a necessary part of the procss. If you think its a joke, well I wont try to change your opinion. Im just presenting the facts that I have about the subject, don't shoot the messenger.
Here is a link to the World Confederation of Billiards Anti Doping Rules (ADR)
http://www.billiard-wcbs.org/Doping.pdf
It is not an unreasonable policy at all, and the same standards are used in all sports, games, etc. Nobody is pointing fingers, it is just a necessary part of the procss. If you think its a joke, well I wont try to change your opinion. Im just presenting the facts that I have about the subject, don't shoot the messenger.