Earl Strickland/John Schmidt altercation at BCA

After reading Jay's post I'm a little more optimistic for pool's future on TV here. Pool on TV is apparently huge in Asia, I think Europe needs to be the next place for it to take off. As much as I dislike Barry Hearn if he can make it work he will, but it's a tough sell. People I know in England watch snooker and marvel at the skill of the players, but the same people look at pool & think "What's the big deal? Pool is easy compared to snooker. I can go down the pub & win a few games." We all know there's a big difference between playing your mate for a pint & playing a pro for money but that's how it's viewed.

If that mindset can be changed, through well produced coverage with good commentary then it has a chance. It needs to be seen often enough for the viewers to get to know the players, not just once in a blue moon. Let the folks at home decide who their favourite players are & that too will create interest. And yes, matches that are 3 months old will interest no-one. It must be up to date.

The reason I say Europe needs to get it going is simply because if any show becomes a hit over there then the US networks will take notice. God knows the UK is to blame for most of the "reality" crap we're suffering now!

I think there is hope for the future, but it's not going to be a quick fix.
 
Fleece, I maybe misunderstood you. I thought you were one of those saying players should be more emotional for the benefit of the TV viewers. Are you only talking about live spectators? Because what happens with the live spectators isn't really what's being discussed. The people who are actually at the event tend to have a pretty good time no matter how anyone acts. There's something different about just being there.

I think we were talking about pool and TV. It isn't really proving something when you say people at live events cheer. I think the gist of what's being discussed are the pros and cons of acting 'robotic' vs being a 'character', and whether 'robotic' pool can still be enjoyable for the TV audience.

I know for a fact it can.

Watch an old video like the classic 150-and-out straight pool match between mike sigel vs zuglan. Mike did not have any emotional outbursts, nor did his opponent, and they didn't talk to each other except when shaking hands. The crowd was respectful and only clapped during breaks in the action (obviously they cheered at the end). As a player I'd certainly prefer that to the mosconi cup crowd.

The runout was a beautiful thing to see, whether on tv or not, and the beauty had nothing to do with the 'characters'... it was just perfect pool. I'd be equally pleased to watch Thorsten or Earl play perfect pool.
 
Spot on Jay!

Its good to hear from an American who has travelled abroad and has a balanced opinion on this topic!

As a PLAYER and life long Snooker and Pool fanatic I'm still convinced there is nothing stopping pool from making it on American TV if certain people stop making lame excuses and blaming everyone else for not cashing anymore! :rolleyes:

PS
Just arrived in Antuigue,Guatamala, a world heritage site, the most gorgeous town youve ever seen nestled between 3 volcanoes! WOuld u believe theres a pool comp Thursday night, its also ladies night!!! :D

Did bowling sell, Fishing etc change there sport?
 
TheOne said:
Spot on Jay!

Its good to hear from an American who has travelled abroad and has a balanced opinion on this topic!

As a PLAYER and life long Snooker and Pool fanatic I'm still convinced there is nothing stopping pool from making it on American TV if certain people stop making lame excuses and blaming everyone else for not cashing anymore! :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

And who are those certain people who are making lame excuses and blame everyone else for not cashing anymore? I am curious.

One thing for sure, Jay set the record straight for the uneducated opinions on the other side of the pond. To compare snooker to pool games like 9-ball, as far as getting popular on American TV, that is what I call lame.

You're going to wake up a sleeping giant if you keep taking pot shots at American players who have every right to compete in American events, but are discriminated against and then have to endure seeing foreign national amateur players competing in American events when their only qualifications for entry into those American events are the extremely obnoxious, but very revealing, large brown spots on their noses.

JAM
 
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JAM said:
And who are those certain people who are making lame excuses and blame everyone else for not cashing anymore? I am curious.

One thing for sure, Jay set the record straight for the uneducated opinions on the other side of the pond. To compare snooker to pool games like 9-ball, as far as getting popular on American TV, that is what I call lame.

You're going to wake up a sleeping giant if you keep taking pot shots at American players who have every right to compete in American events, but are discriminated against and then have to endure seeing foreign national amateur players competing in American events when their only qualifications for entry into those American events are the extremely obnoxious, but very revealing, large brown spots on their noses.

JAM
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Zzzzzzz,

When you´ve been to the "otherside of the pond" I might listen to your opinion! :rolleyes:
 
JAM, thanks for the bad rep, how sad lol

Fortunately I´ve lost count of the number of Americans who gave me positive rep (and in person) and distanced themselves from your jingoistic xenophobic remarks. ;)

It´s good to know most Americans certainly don´t share your views! So feel free to keep throwing your toys out the pram and blaming everyone else...

:rolleyes:
 
the truth! theycan't handle the TRUTH.........

jimmy-leggs said:
I watched a couple of johns matches,met him,and he is one classy guy.:)No comment on the other guy,as I get torn to pieces everytime for the truth.
Click to expand...

The truth is.... Earl sucks as a human being ! he is a hell of a Pool Player but sucks as a competitor and lacks class! ...and that my friend is the truth! :eek:
 
TheOne said:
JAM, thanks for the bad rep, how sad lol

Fortunately I´ve lost count of the number of Americans who gave me positive rep (and in person) and distanced themselves from your jingoistic xenophobic remarks. ;)

It´s good to know most Americans certainly don´t share your views! So feel free to keep throwing your toys out the pram and blaming everyone else...

:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

What's sad, Craig, is your continual needling on this thread. I can ignore it a few times, but when it is consistent, I will respond in kind.

It is good to know that most foreign nationals don't share your views, or your mannerisms either for that matter. In fact, they are professional players, serious competitors, if you will, and have integrity. They would NEVER make a comment like: making lame excuses and blame everyone else for not cashing anymore or some on this board want to turn pool into a WWF circus because they think the reason pool isn't popular in the US is because of the game.

Nobody wants to turn pool into a WWF circus, and if you think 9-ball isn't popular on American TV, I can assure you that snooker would be a bigger turnoff for American viewers. My interests are not in what is televised on your side of the pond or in Europe or in Asian-Pacific Islander countries. I desire to see American pool elevate to where it rightfully belongs.

You have twisted words to suit your own needs on this thread, even if it is at the expense of bashing a veteran American pro player who is far more qualified to compete in American tournaments than you ever will be. He's the same veteran American pro player who defeated Ralf Souquet and Mika Immonen in the same event last year, and that is only his recent tournament play. He was running out racks and following the American tournament trail before you were even born. Fortunately, his nose is not as brown as yours.

You have drawn the line in the sand with your cryptic statements in this thread, like you have done time and time again in previous threads.

Either accept the fact that our views are different or just put me on Ignore, Pal. I will NOT stand by and read the words spewed from your fingertips about a truly great American player, especially when that truly great American player is somebody that I happen to care about.

JAM
 
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Thoughts

Well, to me, quality is internal, and only reflected to the external. There are many talented external players, but that doesn't mean they are quality on the inside. Ralf is quality on the inside, and quality is never boring to me.

Becoming a seasoned player, remaining calm under the most extreme of situations, almost requires you to be emotionalless on the table, or at least to appear that way. Emotions equal weakness for a man in our society, and noone wants to give the nuts to their opponent. Sharking is when you evoke emotions out of your opponent to better your odds of beating him.

Personally, I like to know or understand what a player is thinking when he plays, one reason being, because if you know how a player thinks, you can defeat him, so it becomes kind of a preoccupation of mine.
 
Snapshot9 said:
Well, to me, quality is internal, and only reflected to the external. There are many talented external players, but that doesn't mean they are quality on the inside. Ralf is quality on the inside, and quality is never boring to me.

Becoming a seasoned player, remaining calm under the most extreme of situations, almost requires you to be emotionalless on the table, or at least to appear that way. Emotions equal weakness for a man in our society, and noone wants to give the nuts to their opponent. Sharking is when you evoke emotions out of your opponent to better your odds of beating him.

Personally, I like to know or understand what a player is thinking when he plays, one reason being, because if you know how a player thinks, you can defeat him, so it becomes kind of a preoccupation of mine.
Click to expand...

Eloquently put!...tap, tap, tap! This is very true, and pertains to the psychological side of playing pool. It isn't directed at Earl, Keith, or anyone in particular...but definitely applies to most of us out there playing. It's something I try to teach my students, but only they can master control of themselves.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
 
Well FWIW pool isnt on tv here in this part of Europe... I have saw 2 or 3 shows in the last few years... they did show a european tourney last year during the world cup..but I think that was b/c they knew NOBODY woud care , they were all watching Fussball.....

Snooker OTOH is always on...but I think that is more b/c Eurosport is an English company ( assuming)
 
I've spent a good bit of time in China and the pool coverage there is like watching The Masters here. I couldn't believe my eyes. There was a huge snooker event in January and as soon as I checked into my hotel room--- there it was. It was awesome because although I couldn't understand the commentary, I didn't need to understand it. I watched it for hours... whenever I could between meetings.

I would wake up at 3am because of jet-lag and guess what.... replays of the day's rounds playing off hours.

Eventually, I was bored with snooker so I forgot about it for a day or two. A few days later, I turned on the tube in my room and BAM.... they were in the second semi-final match. I'm telling you, this was DAYS later. They must have televised the entire tournament, live, from beginning to end.... with replays off hours. They don't do that for almost any sport here in the U.S. unless it's a golf major. The production I witnessed was TOP class.

Personally, I think all professional pool should move to asia. It'd be better for pool, better for production, and better for the fans. At least then the players would be viewed as sports heroes, which is what they deserve.

I've been going to the US Open for years, and I've never seen a crowd of reporters / news crews snapping shots as the last ball is made... fighting to interview the winner. It's a shame.
 
JAM said:
What's sad, Craig, is your continual needling on this thread. I can ignore it a few times, but when it is consistent, I will respond in kind.
Click to expand...

Actually, you had another cheap shot at Europeans in post #6 long before I posted a reply, then you added another racist comment:

"Watching a pool player go through the motions like a robot and then stand there like an emotionless Buckingham Guard throughout the duration of a match just isn't American pool, and that is the problem."

Just to be clear ;)

JAM said:
It is good to know that most foreign nationals don't share your views, or your mannerisms either for that matter. In fact, they are professional players, serious competitors, if you will, and have integrity. They would NEVER make a comment like: making lame excuses and blame everyone else for not cashing anymore or some on this board want to turn pool into a WWF circus because they think the reason pool isn't popular in the US is because of the game.

Nobody wants to turn pool into a WWF circus, and if you think 9-ball isn't popular on American TV, I can assure you that snooker would be a bigger turnoff for American viewers. My interests are not in what is televised on your side of the pond or in Europe or in Asian-Pacific Islander countries. I desire to see American pool elevate to where it rightfully belongs.
Click to expand...

This is were we differ, you think pool is perfect in the US and the players and the BCA has done everything possible to get it on TV. The reason it has failed is because of those nasty European and Filipino champions that keep winning all the time and taking home the cash! It's also of course the WPAs fault and not the BCA, down with the WPA blah! I say what a load of crap and I only mention Snooker and Pool in other areas of the world as an example of why I believe pool CAN work in the USA. I only reference snooker because a) it is slower than 9 ball b) it is a gentlemans game with no cue breaking or cheating in sight, and c) the rules are more complex d) it is massively popular on TV throughout many countries. This IMO rebuffs the "pool will never be a TV sport" argument.

JAM said:
You have twisted words to suit your own needs on this thread, even if it is at the expense of bashing a veteran American pro player who is far more qualified to compete in American tournaments than you ever will be. He's the same veteran American pro player who defeated Ralf Souquet and Mika Immonen in the same event last year, and that is only his recent tournament play. He was running out racks and following the American tournament trail before you were even born. Fortunately, his nose is not as brown as yours.

You have drawn the line in the sand with your cryptic statements in this thread, like you have done time and time again in previous threads.

Either accept the fact that our views are different or just put me on Ignore, Pal. I will NOT stand by and read the words spewed from your fingertips about a truly great American player, especially when that truly great American player is somebody that I happen to care about.

JAM
Click to expand...

I don't like your Xenophobic comments JAM, I make no apology for it. It reminds me of some of the comments I read about people in the UK and other countries not wanting other nationalities to work in their country. This IMO this is elitist as it comes. I consider myself very fortunate to be born in a relatively rich country, if I was born in Poland or Mexico I sure as hell would want to move to another country to better my life. If you ever get that passport and travel you will see poverty like you wouldnt believe, its these experiences that shape your views and opinions on life.

You want a closed American tour so American players (or possibly Kieth?) can earn a better living. I strongly disagree with this as I think the best way forward for pool is to take advantage of where it is popular (like Snooker realised and is marketing strongly in China and Asia) and build a world tour similar to the IPT. It seems you would rather have a smaller closed American tour than a more lucrative Pro Tour in Asia or Europe for example because of your own fear of Jonny Forigner! I am positive 99% of the pro players including the American players would disagree with you on this.

As far as brown nosing is concerned, I think pot,kettle,black spring to mind! Lets look at my record....

UPA
I blasted the UPA for not being transparent about their ranking system and limiting the BCA Open to 64 players yet still awarding ranking points. The UPA sent me an email and updated their website to include the ranking points system, sadly the BCA Open situation hasn't changed.

Euro Tour
I have lavished praise on the Euro Tour on this forum as they deserved it. However I have disagreed with some of their policies in the past and I shared my opinions constructively via email. In fact only last week the epbf sent an email out threatening to ban players if they played on other tours. I strongly disgreed with this and made my feelings pretty clear in an email to them, again without concern of what may have happened to my own playing chances!

IPT
Despite wanting to play on the IPT and consistently stated my opinion, both good and bad. I lavished praise for the many things they did well, I made suggestions on how they could improve, and I lambasted them for ripping off pool. I did this despite knowing this wouldn't help my chances of ever playing on the tour. The IPT took on many of my suggestions, call it coincidence if you wish.

Hmmm, for some reason I can't recall you saying a bad word about the IPT! Some may even have described your stance as the very definition of as you say "brown nosing", even when most of my fears where being realised and the tour was collapsing around you!

Finally I knew calling you out on an American forum wasn't going to popular (Surely this in itself would have been brown noising suicide! :p), but I just couldn't stand by and listen to your xenophobic remarks in thread after thread! I was pleasently suprised by the number of Americans that agreed with me and were also disgusted by your remarks.

PS
As far as Kieth is concerned, I have to concede he is indeed older than me :p I look forward to meeting him at the world straight pool championships next month.
 
TAP. TAP. TAP.
Thank you, One.

JAM, you really do keep derailing threads with the us(a)-vs-them garbage.

And what sucks is that you KNOW it upsets people, you know there are people from other countries on this forum...you know you offended about a dozen people in that other Strickland thread...yet you STILL force rah-rah USA into every thread you possibly can, even when it isn't relevant.
I call that trolling.

I don't care if you've been on here a million years and have a good reputation otherwise. Putting down other countries (directly or indirectly) sucks. You like to pretend like you're just patriotic, but your dislike for other countries and foreigners comes through loud and clear. For you to automatically group players by nationality is no better than automatically grouping them by color.

And no, nobody's 'misconstruing' your words. We aren't going out of our way to find threads you post in and bash you. Do you really think so many people all are out to get you personally? Grow up. We're just trying to read normal threads and find you keep polluting them with yay-yay-USA crap.

When a bunch of people are bothered by it, and your attitude seems to be "I don't care if I offend anyone, tough shit if they don't like my opinions", and you pound on the negative rep button like it's worth ten bucks a click... then maybe you should consider that you're being childish and need to take another look at how your words appear to the rest of the world.
 
CreeDo said:
TAP. TAP. TAP.
Thank you, One.

JAM, you really do keep derailing threads with the us(a)-vs-them garbage.

And what sucks is that you KNOW it upsets people, you know there are people from other countries on this forum...you know you offended about a dozen people in that other Strickland thread...yet you STILL force rah-rah USA into every thread you possibly can, even when it isn't relevant.
I call that trolling.

I don't care if you've been on here a million years and have a good reputation otherwise. Putting down other countries (directly or indirectly) sucks. You like to pretend like you're just patriotic, but your dislike for other countries and foreigners comes through loud and clear. For you to automatically group players by nationality is no better than automatically grouping them by color.

And no, nobody's 'misconstruing' your words. We aren't going out of our way to find threads you post in and bash you. Do you really think so many people all are out to get you personally? Grow up. We're just trying to read normal threads and find you keep polluting them with yay-yay-USA crap.

When a bunch of people are bothered by it, and your attitude seems to be "I don't care if I offend anyone, tough shit if they don't like my opinions", and you pound on the negative rep button like it's worth ten bucks a click... then maybe you should consider that you're being childish and need to take another look at how your words appear to the rest of the world.
Click to expand...

I'm wondering if a little bit of that anti-American sentiment is creeping out in your post Creedo. yay yay USA crap????

While JAM voices her opinions loud and clear they don't have to appease everyone.

Is she patriotic? I hope so. Most Americans are patriotic. We all have our own personal perspectives about different issues of our individual countries.

You might resent her unwillingness to compromise on some of her positions but most of them aren't out of line with mainstream conservative America.

Does "the one" know how to stick a needle in her to get a reaction at every turn? Yes, and he does it with surprising regularity but he gets the brunt of her responses.

And for the record, JAM pleased far more people than she offended when defending the great Earl Strickland. I think the discussions about Earl Strickland have inspired some additional threads which I will be sharing in the near future if anyone is interested but they won't be titled Earl Strickland. You and everyone else in the know will understand whats behind my posts.

I see no need for you to get in between "their discussions". They both do well enough without you fanning the flames.


JoeyA
 
TheOne said:
Actually, you had another cheap shot at Europeans in post #6 long before I posted a reply, then you added another racist comment:

"Watching a pool player go through the motions like a robot and then stand there like an emotionless Buckingham Guard throughout the duration of a match just isn't American pool, and that is the problem."

Just to be clear ;)



This is were we differ, you think pool is perfect in the US and the players and the BCA has done everything possible to get it on TV. The reason it has failed is because of those nasty European and Filipino champions that keep winning all the time and taking home the cash! It's also of course the WPAs fault and not the BCA, down with the WPA blah! I say what a load of crap and I only mention Snooker and Pool in other areas of the world as an example of why I believe pool CAN work in the USA. I only reference snooker because a) it is slower than 9 ball b) it is a gentlemans game with no cue breaking or cheating in sight, and c) the rules are more complex d) it is massively popular on TV throughout many countries. This IMO rebuffs the "pool will never be a TV sport" argument.



I don't like your Xenophobic comments JAM, I make no apology for it. It reminds me of some of the comments I read about people in the UK and other countries not wanting other nationalities to work in their country. This IMO this is elitist as it comes. I consider myself very fortunate to be born in a relatively rich country, if I was born in Poland or Mexico I sure as hell would want to move to another country to better my life. If you ever get that passport and travel you will see poverty like you wouldnt believe, its these experiences that shape your views and opinions on life.

You want a closed American tour so American players (or possibly Kieth?) can earn a better living. I strongly disagree with this as I think the best way forward for pool is to take advantage of where it is popular (like Snooker realised and is marketing strongly in China and Asia) and build a world tour similar to the IPT. It seems you would rather have a smaller closed American tour than a more lucrative Pro Tour in Asia or Europe for example because of your own fear of Jonny Forigner! I am positive 99% of the pro players including the American players would disagree with you on this.

As far as brown nosing is concerned, I think pot,kettle,black spring to mind! Lets look at my record....

UPA
I blasted the UPA for not being transparent about their ranking system and limiting the BCA Open to 64 players yet still awarding ranking points. The UPA sent me an email and updated their website to include the ranking points system, sadly the BCA Open situation hasn't changed.

Euro Tour
I have lavished praise on the Euro Tour on this forum as they deserved it. However I have disagreed with some of their policies in the past and I shared my opinions constructively via email. In fact only last week the epbf sent an email out threatening to ban players if they played on other tours. I strongly disgreed with this and made my feelings pretty clear in an email to them, again without concern of what may have happened to my own playing chances!

IPT
Despite wanting to play on the IPT and consistently stated my opinion, both good and bad. I lavished praise for the many things they did well, I made suggestions on how they could improve, and I lambasted them for ripping off pool. I did this despite knowing this wouldn't help my chances of ever playing on the tour. The IPT took on many of my suggestions, call it coincidence if you wish.

Hmmm, for some reason I can't recall you saying a bad word about the IPT! Some may even have described your stance as the very definition of as you say "brown nosing", even when most of my fears where being realised and the tour was collapsing around you!

Finally I knew calling you out on an American forum wasn't going to popular (Surely this in itself would have been brown noising suicide! :p), but I just couldn't stand by and listen to your xenophobic remarks in thread after thread! I was pleasently suprised by the number of Americans that agreed with me and were also disgusted by your remarks.

PS
As far as Kieth is concerned, I have to concede he is indeed older than me :p I look forward to meeting him at the world straight pool championships next month.
Click to expand...

Once again, you have twisted my remarks to suit your own need.

Your long dissertation is nothing more than mumbo jumbo, riddled with snide remarks in an effort to insert opinions in this thread that I have not made.

I cannot even put into print what I think about you and your attempt to change my words to cause friction.

JAM
 
JAM said:
Once again, you have twisted my remarks to suit your own need.

Your long dissertation is nothing more than mumbo jumbo, riddled with snide remarks in an effort to insert opinions in this thread that I have not made.

I cannot even put into print what I think about you and your attempt to change my words to cause friction.

JAM
Click to expand...

There's that reverse gear again! Sure I hacked into your account and wrote it all, me bad! :rolleyes:

Oh, and I hacked into everyone elses account who read your remarks the same way I did and made posts by them too. I even sent myself countless good rep and pms from their account agreeing with myself, geez
 
CreeDo said:
TAP. TAP. TAP.
Thank you, One.

JAM, you really do keep derailing threads with the us(a)-vs-them garbage.
Click to expand...
No. That is Craig a/k/a The One's twisting of my words which is inserting the us-versus-them garbage.

CreeDo said:
And what sucks is that you KNOW it upsets people, you know there are people from other countries on this forum...you know you offended about a dozen people in that other Strickland thread...yet you STILL force rah-rah USA into every thread you possibly can, even when it isn't relevant. I call that trolling.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's the ticket. I'm a troll. Nobody knows me. Nobody knows you either.

CreeDo said:
I don't care if you've been on here a million years and have a good reputation otherwise. Putting down other countries (directly or indirectly) sucks. You like to pretend like you're just patriotic, but your dislike for other countries and foreigners comes through loud and clear. For you to automatically group players by nationality is no better than automatically grouping them by color.
Click to expand...

This is the most offensive remark made to me yet. I do not have one prejudice bone in my body, and again, you are tag-teaming with The One, who has twisted my words, to flame. People who know me well would laugh at this statement, me being prejudice. If you only knew, but, oh, yeah, that's right. I'm a troll, and nobody knows my identity.

CreeDo said:
And no, nobody's 'misconstruing' your words. We aren't going out of our way to find threads you post in and bash you. Do you really think so many people all are out to get you personally? Grow up. We're just trying to read normal threads and find you keep polluting them with yay-yay-USA crap.
Click to expand...

I could say the same about your contributions to the forum. For the record, I'll post any damn where I please, and if you don't like it, then don't read it. Nobody is forcing you to read any of the words I have written, but when you do read them, just make sure you don't insert your thoughts as to what my opinions are because it is obvious you have trouble comprehending what I have previously posted.

CreeDo said:
When a bunch of people are bothered by it, and your attitude seems to be "I don't care if I offend anyone, tough shit if they don't like my opinions", and you pound on the negative rep button like it's worth ten bucks a click... then maybe you should consider that you're being childish and need to take another look at how your words appear to the rest of the world.
Click to expand...

I have given out two bad RED reps in recent times, you and Craig a/k/a The One, just because I got sick of ignoring your attempt to flame me on this thread.

By the way, I have given out less than five bad RED reps the whole time I have been a member on AzBilliards, and you have the privilege of being one of the five.

JAM
 
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