Gold Crown & The Diamond Professional

here is my 2 cents

You said something that I will comment on.

Agreed they NEW GC are stupid expensive and if I was going to spend that I would buy a new DIAMOND.

BUT, as you said the old GC have been around for decades and there are some great deals on USED GC. I think $1000 should be a target price on USED GC.

RealCobra is a table mechanic and was on cautioning folks on issues with used GC. I think he was right on many points and I think anyone considering buying a used GC should review his concerns.

Ken
 
I love me some Gold Crowns, but don't get me wrong, I certainly don't think that they are the 'best' table ever built. And I certainly don't have any outstanding loyalty to Brunswick considering what they've become.
(sorry Austin, nothing personal)

......

1. I don't miss getting rubber on the shaft of my cue. Yeah, they might have fixed it in the latest model, but that was only in response to Diamond's improvements. WTF? How do you lead the home/commercial market for like 150 years and let a newcomer wipe you off the map overnight with simple improvements?

I totally agree, which is part of my many beefs with Brunswick.
But - with all due respect, as Chopdoc pointed out, we're talking about something that transcends the name or the brand or even the company itself...

For example...If I were to hold up a red sign that was shaped like an octagon - you'd immediately think of a stop sign.

If I said: "think of a soup can", chances are it would be a Campbell's can, even if you hate soup.

For lots of people around the world, if you say the words "pool table", the image of a Gold Crown (or a gold-crown-like-table) will pop into their head.
Its not a big deal, it just is what it is.


2. Every Gold Crown table I've ever played on plays differently. Either they are buckets, or they have been "tightened up" by a table mechanic who has different thoughts on how to make a Gold Crown play "right". This is not a problem with Diamonds. If it is Pro Cut, it plays right straight from the factory.

Again, I agree with most of what you are saying.
However, I hope you understand that anyone attempting to build a better XXXXX, will first take a good hard look at what has already been done, what works, and what does not. In fact, that is one of Diamond's strengths thus far.

But my point is this, Diamond is not inventing the wheel.
As far as American pool tables are concerned, Michael Phelan, Hugh Collender, and all the men that Brunswick bought their patents from invented the wheel.

Diamond is picking up where Brunswick left off by simply making it a better stronger wheel. And big props to them for doing so, but even they should be thanking Brunswick for giving us the goods for so long, practically all of us grew up on them.

I betcha the owners of the Diamond company grew up playing on Brunswicks :)

....

I just have no love for Brunswick any more. Once you've had filet mignon, it's not like a tough piece of gristle is gonna cut it. I will play on them if I have to, but I feel my practice time is ALWAYS better spent on Diamonds.

Russ

cheers
 
I love me some Gold Crowns, but don't get me wrong, I certainly don't think that they are the 'best' table ever built. And I certainly don't have any outstanding loyalty to Brunswick considering what they've become.
(sorry Austin, nothing personal)



cheers

Hmmmm....coke or pepsi....coke or pepsi...hmmm, ah, boubon and coke..no...rum and pepsi.....ah, F-it, get down the tequila!!!
 
get a steel-frame Gabriel's. looks like a gc, built like tank.

Except its full of metric bolts, lots and lots of MDF...and paint that chips off the rail blinds and leg pedestals if you're not real careful, unless the paint has already developed the orange peel look to it when looking at it from an angle, not even in the same league as a Diamond or Gold Crown:rolleyes:
 
Table

Glen is spot on regarding the paint and legs ...i just went and looked at one listed for 4k at a local pool hall last weekend.

Compared to diamond build quality it has none...
 
I recently was fortunate to find a used Diamond Professional in great condition for a nice price. I managed to get what many recommended as the local top table mechanic to move and install it for me (along with new Simonis 860). I was asking him about GC versus Diamond. He said the old GC I and II's are great tables and if you can find one in decent condition, they can be restored to become a great table. He also said the newer Brunswick being built out of country are basically over priced junk.

He didn't have a horse in the race as he is not affiliated with either and has a ton of experience working with both. I am old enough to remember playing the old GC's in bowling alleys and other spots, great tables. I will also say however, that I've never played anything I like better than a Diamond.
 
When I first got the Diamond catalog in the early 90's,and from seeing them at different pro tournaments (which was their sole purpose at that point) that they looked a LOT like an all-wood Gold Crown to me.

I talked to a mechanic at a tournament in Caruthersville,Mo one time that told me that he had heard from some Brunswick R+D guy that the IV was going to be just like that,all wood corners,but with the lower profile pocket liners like the IV actually did. Obviously,that didn't pan out LOL.

I kinda wish it had though. It's just me,but hearing the sound it makes when you hit a ball with pace and a pure stroke and the ball slaps that plastic just seems natural :cool:.

For even greater effect,add the ashtray corner pocket castings. One of the most MOVING shots I've ever seen in terms of leaving those that saw it breathless was done on one at High Pockets down in Memphis.

The player at the table is hooked by close to a full ball,as I saw the shot from behind the player,and slightly elevated but maybe 40 feet away. The 8 is just behind and slightly left of the spot.

He goes down and looks at the angle on the 7 (just off end rail maybe 1/4 off) going down the rail to his right,then walks back around and looks at just banking the 7 straight back,then looks at the cut again,then back to the bank.

I tell my best friend Larry that if he makes this bank it's a hell of a shot,but still has to get back up for the 8.

He cuts this 7 ball in so pure that the owner of the poolroom said from his view,which was just above table level and in line with the end rail that he said it never even moved offline. The cue ball acted like it had low left on it from the angle it came uptable,and went 3 rails around the 8 and left him a stop shot to get on the 9.

EVERYONE that wasn't in the bathroom knew it,like a pistol shot went off.

The whole room was just electric after that. Larry said "well I guess he can just do that..." :grin:.

From there,he finishes a race to 9 in 3 innings.

I have absolutely no problem with Diamonds at all though. Very well made,and pure function.

If I could buy a Diamond tomorrow,I wouldn't want it crazy tight like some people. The standard Pro Cut is fine by me,since I have maybe 60 total lifetime hours playing on a Diamond of any size.

The 7' Smart tables I've played on the most were softer pocket-wise than the normal Valley,but have played on some that I'd have to put some decent quality and quantity of time before I'd feel competitive.

I felt like I was inferior at times in about 2 hours on what I call the Pickle table at JOB's,which is a black oak 7' Pro with almost uncomfortably tough pockets for me,an unfortunate side effect of living the armpit of America for a hardcore player.

I've also played on some tough GC's too,but they aren't an uncomfortable as a Diamond with roughly the same size pockets for whatever reason,LOL. Tommy D.
 
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Agree

It's only interesting because the Diamond tables DO NOT have any likeness to a Gold Crown.

Freddie <~~~ other than the fact that it's a pool table

My feelings also.If anything it seems in the last 5 yrs. or so Brunswick has been trying to Diamonize their tables.
 
Gold Crowns and Diamonds (Pro/ProAm) are the two best tables out there. They are both tanks and play well. There are some differences to their playing character but I really feel it is a matter of personal preference/opinion rather than fact as far as which is better. I prefer the way a well set up GC plays, but that's just my taste, and ymmv. Fair enough. I've nothing bad to say about Diamonds. It's a fine piece of equipment.

It seems to me it is a little unfair the way GC's are compared to Diamonds sometimes though. And that is because often times the comparison is made between a relatively new Diamond and a GC in the local pool hall that is decades old and has been beat up and hacked on by who knows what kind of "craftsmen" over the years. And there are tons of those hacked over GC's in room across the country. But either a well set-up GC or a Diamond are both superb tables and one's preference for the playability is probably more personal than anything.

I've seen discussions on here where some mechanics will give reasons why Diamonds are better from their perspective. But I can't get into any of that because I don't work on pool tables, I just play on them.

Price-wise I'm not convinced the difference between the two new is that much, though I don't know that for sure. But a comparison of the MSRPs means nothing. The MSRP of a Diamond IS the price because you are buying it directly from the factory. But Gold Crowns are sold through dealers and I've seen very little information on here concerning what they actually cost. But dealers typically deal.

As for nostalgia, I'm too old, lol! Yesteryear for me were Anniversaries and Centennials. If I walk into Hard Times or House of Billiards tomorrow I will see a room full of GC's so it's a little difficult for me to consider them just as the table of the good old days.
 
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The only place where the gold crown has the diamond beat is the satisfying "slap" of the ball when it hits the back of the pocket. Other than that, the diamond is a far better made table, and the leather covered pockets flush with the rails is something that should embarrass the people that designed gold crowns.
 
The only place where the gold crown has the diamond beat is the satisfying "slap" of the ball when it hits the back of the pocket. Other than that, the diamond is a far better made table, and the leather covered pockets flush with the rails is something that should embarrass the people that designed gold crowns.

Agreed, Joe!

Russ
 
d lest ye think I am just dramatizing, I am getting back to Seattle tomorrow from a work trip, and will be travelling up to Golden Fleece, the all-Diamond pool hall north of me, on a daily basis in preparation for DCC.

I would wait until Sunday, The Fleece temporarily moved to a location in Lake City and won't reopen until tomorrow.

They'll have four 9 footers and 8 seven-footers, new address is 13741 Lake City Way NE
Seattle, WA
 
The only place where the gold crown has the diamond beat is the satisfying "slap" of the ball when it hits the back of the pocket. Other than that, the diamond is a far better made table, and the leather covered pockets flush with the rails is something that should embarrass the people that designed gold crowns.

That's exactly what I think. The ball "rings the bell" when it hits the pocket right on a Gold Crown. IMO, it's the only alluring feature on a GC.

Freddie <~~~ that table rings a bell
 
I would wait until Sunday, The Fleece temporarily moved to a location in Lake City and won't reopen until tomorrow.

They'll have four 9 footers and 8 seven-footers, new address is 13741 Lake City Way NE
Seattle, WA

Thank you so much for this.. Sunday was in fact when I was going to start..

Russ
 
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