Have you ever seen Nick play banks? There are guys that Efren could give the last 4 playing 9-10 ball that he couldn't beat playing a long sesion of bank.... Efren isn't even on the radar of top bankers ever, Nick is.
Greatest of all time
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Have you ever seen Nick play banks? There are guys that Efren could give the last 4 playing 9-10 ball that he couldn't beat playing a long sesion of bank.... Efren isn't even on the radar of top bankers ever, Nick is.
You know about his skills at only one game because in pocket billiards it was the only game that mattered in the slighest in his era.
Seems pretty absurd to default him out if the running for best ever because in his era straight pool was the only game played.
That is a modern legend perpetrated by ignorance. The tables used in Mosconi's era to determine world chamionships were not easy at all especially in the 5/10 era, and used way slower cloth and less reactive balls. Ask John Schmidt and Sigel how easy straight pool was on slow cloth in their challenge match.
This thread highlights one of the great philosophical debates, one that has been raging for many years in these AZB parts. Is greatness measured by all-around skill across the disciplines or by excellence in the discipline having greatest importance during a player's playing career?
If it's the former, names like Efren Reyes, Nick Varner, Mike Sigel, Luther Lassiter, Harold Worst and Alfredo De'Oro are the names most worthy of mention.
If it's the latter, it probably comes down to Willie Mosconi and Ralph Greenleaf. If all cuesports are considered, Willie Hoppe, Raymond Ceulemans, Walter Lindrum, Steve Davis and Steve Hendry are all in the conversation.
Both beauty and greatness are in the eye of the beholder, and all those mentioned in this thread have, deservingly, caught the eye of cuesport enthusiasts for their excellence.
If it's the former, names like Efren Reyes, Nick Varner, Mike Sigel, Luther Lassiter, Harold Worst and Alfredo De'Oro are the names most worthy of mention.
If it's the latter, it probably comes down to Willie Mosconi and Ralph Greenleaf. If all cuesports are considered, Willie Hoppe, Raymond Ceulemans, Walter Lindrum, Steve Davis and Steve Hendry are all in the conversation.
Both beauty and greatness are in the eye of the beholder, and all those mentioned in this thread have, deservingly, caught the eye of cuesport enthusiasts for their excellence.
9b Earl,Efren,Busta
10b SVB,Yang and Orcullo, Busta
1p Efren,Frost Alex
14.1 John Schmidt,Mosconi
Banks Brumback,Daulton, Efren
8b Efren,Earl,SVB
This is my list. And MHO
10b SVB,Yang and Orcullo, Busta
1p Efren,Frost Alex
14.1 John Schmidt,Mosconi
Banks Brumback,Daulton, Efren
8b Efren,Earl,SVB
This is my list. And MHO
well I happen to agree with all most of you about who the greatest players are. One player that I love watching, has the best demeanor around a pool table is certainly pro, Adam Wheeler.
And saying his name is synonymous with 1pocket. He may not be the greatest by any means but he is always top 5 at the derby.
And saying his name is synonymous with 1pocket. He may not be the greatest by any means but he is always top 5 at the derby.
This is difficult, because you're going to get only personal opinions and people's favorites. With that being said, here's my list:
Straight - Mosconi, Greenleaf, and Sigel
9-Ball - Strickland (by a mile), Sigel, and Reyes
8-Ball - Reyes, Sigel, and Manalo
10-Ball - Orcollo, SVB, Appleton
Banks - Daulton, Reyes, Varner
1-Pocket - Reyes, Varner, Frost
Racker - ME
Straight - Mosconi, Greenleaf, and Sigel
9-Ball - Strickland (by a mile), Sigel, and Reyes
8-Ball - Reyes, Sigel, and Manalo
10-Ball - Orcollo, SVB, Appleton
Banks - Daulton, Reyes, Varner
1-Pocket - Reyes, Varner, Frost
Racker - ME
I agree completely
I believe that pool is played differently because of Efren Reyes. I saw an interview of him where he had this almost despondent look on his face as he was saying that he has to play the younger players who has been studying and using "his" shots. He was right. Someone once said something like, pride in pool is punished. In a way, therefore, aggressive and risky/low percentage shots are punished. There is sort of a contradiction there about Efren's play, his aggressive shots. It can be explained by his humility and creativity. He can take chances because he is humble if he misses. He is not taking that risky shot to beat you, he is taking it because the game wouldn't be as great if he didn't go for it. I have the feeling watching him that he is above winning and losing, and the creativity puts him there. Some of us are going to see this, and some of us are going to count up titles. So be it.
I believe that pool is played differently because of Efren Reyes. I saw an interview of him where he had this almost despondent look on his face as he was saying that he has to play the younger players who has been studying and using "his" shots. He was right. Someone once said something like, pride in pool is punished. In a way, therefore, aggressive and risky/low percentage shots are punished. There is sort of a contradiction there about Efren's play, his aggressive shots. It can be explained by his humility and creativity. He can take chances because he is humble if he misses. He is not taking that risky shot to beat you, he is taking it because the game wouldn't be as great if he didn't go for it. I have the feeling watching him that he is above winning and losing, and the creativity puts him there. Some of us are going to see this, and some of us are going to count up titles. So be it.
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I think Jason Miller from Ohio should be considered when mentioning the best bankers.
When he gets to feeling good, he looks pretty terrifying to anyone. He beat John Brumback in the finals of the DCC in 2004, and never broke a sweat.
John B. gets a nod also, of course.
When he gets to feeling good, he looks pretty terrifying to anyone. He beat John Brumback in the finals of the DCC in 2004, and never broke a sweat.
John B. gets a nod also, of course.