Hardships of Professional Pool as a Career
- Thread starter JAM
- Start date
Clear evidence that, at the very least, Mr. Crane understood reality. When they were much younger, the "competitors" of today got too many gold stars and smiley faces. Plus, living the life of the Noble Vagabond Warrior is a powerful aphrodisiac. Everybody wants to be a Rock Star. Holy shith.
Maybe pool needs to come up with a legal betting structure like this which I took from a World trapshooting event. There can be categories like age-brackets, ratings, open betting etc. where individuals bet on themselves to win a category outside of the guaranteed prize monies/trophies. Maybe even a Lewis system can be created for pool with some thoughts.
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Talking about the idea that you can make a living in the sport, not the players. My point was, maybe pool as it exists isn't broke.
Although looking back at my post, I can see where you took it that way.
Maybe someday folks will realize sports are supported by spectators. We are stuck in a paradigm.
I see the disparaging comments too but I think for the most part, legitimate pro players are treated with respect and given a long leash WHEN seen in person. I know I respect their talent and all the work they've put in. Even great regional players are given a certain amount of prestige when hanging out with us bangers.
I think we go off track a bit when we talk about how well the game can be played at mid-life and beyond. Just because Ronnie O'Sullivan and Efren (to name just a couple) have played very well for such a long time, this doesn't mean that staying on top into one's 40s and beyond is to be expected. I think this will become more and more rare as both the travel and practice schedules become more and more demanding.
In my view, in the past 20 or 30 years, there hasn't been a time as good as now for a young player to make a run at professional pool. The reality is though, that like every other sport -- once you hit around 30 you need to ask yourself some tough questions. Life can get in the way of ANY pursuit. It's no different with pool.
As far as ratings go -- Fargo Rate is here to stay and you can't effectively argue against the data. There are pros with thousands of racks in the system. The numbers are what they are at this point. Some of these pros have low 700 ratings. I've even seen some "pros" in the 690s. The data doesn't lie. Sadly, with rare exceptions these types are dead money and everyone knows it, except for maybe them.
Pool is a ready and willing marketplace. Selling into a vibrant market can be very profitable. If I was young, I'd load my trunk with pool paraphernalia, set up a 1200 mile route and call on my customers every two weeks. I'd make a killing, and even get to play with good players to boot.
Sadly, the road to hell is paved with unrealistic pool players. Like Trevino used to say, "Pros that have to putt for pars are like dogs chasing cars...they don't get very far."
Turning Stone is a players' event with streaming, not a spectator event. Last September it cost me about $1500 to watch in person and that was with free admission. I think the audience was nearly all players and relatives with a few locals and fewer still who travelled more than two hours.
The Mosconi Cup packed 2300 seats.
I remember thinking the exact same thing when we used to go to the U.S. Open 9-Ball Championship in Virginia. The audience consisted of players, players' friends, and a few locals, but it did fill out on the weekends. The weekdays, it was not as crowded.
Filling in those seats at the Mosconi Cup is sure nice to see. It's every pool player's dream, I think, to shoot in that event.
To add, not all lower 700s are created equal. The ones I find puzzling are the ones who are solely or mostly players. I don't understand how they eat. The others are part-timers with other gigs, house pros, or instructors. They may cash here and there but they know they can't make a living just playing. Their model needs to be looked at more closely by the frustrated pros at the higher end.
That reminds me of the old saw about the Salesman at the New Car Dealership. The true measure of a car salesman's skills is how many cars he sells after he has sold one to his Mom and Dad, and all of his wealthy cousins.
To add to my add-on,
For almost all serious amateur players, or even hobbyists, which is sadly what I'm closest to -- when we complain about the state of professional pool -- it's actually little more than virtue signaling. The truth is, most of us care more about our lawns than we do the state of professional pool, and we love the game! That's sort of the problem as one of the greatest parts of this game, is its best players are completely approachable. We can even EASILY sign up to play them. They are not superstars and you can call me selfish but -- I love that. Almost all amateurs love this more than they care about the growth of professional pool if they're honest. Who knows where the game is headed, but wherever we end up I sure hope we don't lose that.
For the meantime, I think the objective should be to create support systems to fund a players travel and expenses to international events. At this time, pool is something that only some people can make a good living from. It’s also not the only sport in that position as many top curlers have second careers.
On the one hand I like the idea of investing more into junior programs, but then I also feel a bit uneasy encouraging kids to fully dedicate themselves towards a career where only a small group can make a decent living.
My opinion is, the ideal model is for an aspiring player to pursue a second career to support themselves, while the national bodies allocate funds to promoting the sport and sponsoring players to international competition. I’ve felt for a while that our expectation that pros should be able to sustain themselves from competition alone has largely held the game back since too much money is going to prize funds and top finishers and not enough is being held for administrative fees that are used for sponsorship and promotion.
Admittedly I don’t know the entire break down of the expenses, but I’ve just found it interesting that something like Curling can have way more resources while having fewer players overall while pro players make roughly the same as pool players.
On the one hand I like the idea of investing more into junior programs, but then I also feel a bit uneasy encouraging kids to fully dedicate themselves towards a career where only a small group can make a decent living.
My opinion is, the ideal model is for an aspiring player to pursue a second career to support themselves, while the national bodies allocate funds to promoting the sport and sponsoring players to international competition. I’ve felt for a while that our expectation that pros should be able to sustain themselves from competition alone has largely held the game back since too much money is going to prize funds and top finishers and not enough is being held for administrative fees that are used for sponsorship and promotion.
Admittedly I don’t know the entire break down of the expenses, but I’ve just found it interesting that something like Curling can have way more resources while having fewer players overall while pro players make roughly the same as pool players.
Until men's pool in the US figures out a way to make pool worth something to marketers it will always be a two-bit fringe activity. Pool is going to have to quit asking "what is in it for me?" and start asking "what is in it for major corporate sponsors?"
Pool doesn't offer value for outlay. Picture yourself walking into the marketing office of a major corporation. Some are spending hundreds of millions on marketing but lets say that they only have ten million or even one million. Why should they invest it in pool? Until pool can produce real numbers to answer that question we are whistling in the wind.
Hu
Pool doesn't offer value for outlay. Picture yourself walking into the marketing office of a major corporation. Some are spending hundreds of millions on marketing but lets say that they only have ten million or even one million. Why should they invest it in pool? Until pool can produce real numbers to answer that question we are whistling in the wind.
Hu
I see the disparaging comments too but I think for the most part, legitimate pro players are treated with respect and given a long leash WHEN seen in person. I know I respect their talent and all the work they've put in. Even great regional players are given a certain amount of prestige when hanging out with us bangers.
I think we go off track a bit when we talk about how well the game can be played at mid-life and beyond. Just because Ronnie O'Sullivan and Efren (to name just a couple) have played very well for such a long time, this doesn't mean that staying on top into one's 40s and beyond is to be expected. I think this will become more and more rare as both the travel and practice schedules become more and more demanding.
In my view, in the past 20 or 30 years, there hasn't been a time as good as now for a young player to make a run at professional pool. The reality is though, that like every other sport -- once you hit around 30 you need to ask yourself some tough questions. Life can get in the way of ANY pursuit. It's no different with pool.
As far as ratings go -- Fargo Rate is here to stay and you can't effectively argue against the data. There are pros with thousands of racks in the system. The numbers are what they are at this point. Some of these pros have low 700 ratings. I've even seen some "pros" in the 690s. The data doesn't lie. Sadly, with rare exceptions these types are dead money and everyone knows it, except for maybe them.
and if we're honest, that the 200'd best player doesn't make much money is true of almost every individual sport. fargorate and now the prize money rankings are only positive imo
Pool for main stream TV should be pitched to sponsors whose products the viewers buy like Depends,Denture products,pain meds,walkers, canes,reading glasses,laxatives,etc.
While I’ve never been a professional player. I did depend on pool as my primary income for a couple years twice in my life. I’ve also had front row seats to pro pool as I’m very close with a couple pro’s.
In summary:
It’s a hard way to make an easy living.
Not for the faint of heart or those seeking security
Fatnoy
In summary:
It’s a hard way to make an easy living.
Not for the faint of heart or those seeking security
Fatnoy
I've heard that the PBTA/RJR (Camel Tour) "relationship" has been used in business schools as an example of how not to do sponsorship.
I think it's more accurate to say that nearly all of them had full-time work back then.
Mizerak was a teacher in Perth Amboy, NJ. Tom Jennings was a math professor in Middlesex, New Jersey, Pete Margo ran a pool room in Staten Island, NY. Jack Colavita was a craftsman in New Jersey, Joe Balsis spent twenty years in the meat business before returning to pro pool and remained in the business after his return, etc., etc.
That said, there were far fewer events back then and quite a few of them were two-day events over the weekend, so it was a little easier to hold down a full-time job while competing.