How many of you think someone in the final 4 of the US Open would dump?

[Donny Lutz]

Enough money?

There's not enough money bet on pool to make someone even think about dumping. Top Players can win $25,000 for FIRST plus all the extra you can make indirectly which would be a lot over the course of the next few years.

You don't think that millionaires and billionaires gamble? Well, they do, and they make unbelievable bets. I'm basing this on many years of observation, and long discussions with an old friend who was in the gambling business for forty years.

What if a Romney (he clearly bets) came up to a finalist and whispered, "I've got half a million bet on you to lose. If you lose, it's half yours..."?

 

[alstl]

First off, Congrats to SVB!



You're the OP, it's your "thoughts"...why would you start a poll like this?



I would like to think that this is how these 4 individuals would feel making it this far. However, whenever money is involved stranger things can happen right? Does everyone have a price?...is $40K enough to buy out any one of these 4 champions?

Out of these 4, Dennis is the only one that hasn't won the Open. I think he wants this title bad, and it showed by him making it to the finals.

Efren is the oldest, time is not on his side. I don't think he would dump, since he would be ecstatic to win the Open at his age.

It's obvious SVB didn't dump since he won.

So does that leave the question that Alex dumped? As a fierce as a competitor as he is, I DON'T THINK SO!!

This poll is a joke!

The question isn't about those particular players. The question is would an unnamed pool player in the final stages of a major tournament dump.

I have seen savers take place between some of the big names in pool in the final stages of tournaments. Once a guy has done a saver the possibility exists he would also dump if the Calcutta or a side bet would profit him.

There was a major tournament years ago which Vegas gave odds on and there are a lot of people who believe the players dumped, and they were some of the top players in the game at the time. There have been threads on this forum detailing the whole situation.

There is no doubt in my mind there are some players in the game who would dump if the money was right.

 

[spktur]

An old gambler buddy of mine told me once 'the ones you have to watch are the ones who are always worried someone is gonna cheat them'. They think that way because they act that way.

 

[Hungarian]

Honestly, this thread is not really necessary. It's subjective and only creates a cloud over pool. But whatever gets you off man..

Cheers

 

[dorabelle]

You don't think that millionaires and billionaires gamble? Well, they do, and they make unbelievable bets. I'm basing this on many years of observation, and long discussions with an old friend who was in the gambling business for forty years.

What if a Romney (he clearly bets) came up to a finalist and whispered, "I've got half a million bet on you to lose. If you lose, it's half yours..."?

Yeah but............ 100k vs 1/4 chance to win 25k? Cmon man, some of these people struggle to feed themselves but its the prestigious us open. They need this title! They are upstanding and prideful.

 

[Hungarian]

Why does it got to be Romney man? Plus, your "Indecent Proposal" scenerio, is not realistic.

http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/6e85114ceb/another-indecent-proposal

You don't think that millionaires and billionaires gamble? Well, they do, and they make unbelievable bets. I'm basing this on many years of observation, and long discussions with an old friend who was in the gambling business for forty years.

What if a Romney (he clearly bets) came up to a finalist and whispered, "I've got half a million bet on you to lose. If you lose, it's half yours..."?

 

[Hungarian]

No Dora, $250k vs 1st or 2nd place.. And for the record, I can promise I would take the $250k and not look back. I'd make it look way better than the 1988 (or what ever year it was) Challenge of Champions. I'd just have to play normally. It would be my Pool and Billiard Legacy.

But it would never happen. It makes about as much sense as this thread.

Yeah but............ 100k vs 1/4 chance to win 25k? Cmon man, some of these people struggle to feed themselves but its the prestigious us open. They need this title! They are upstanding and prideful.

 

[SUPERSTAR]

There's not enough money bet on pool to make someone even think about dumping. Top Players can win $25,000 for FIRST plus all the extra you can make indirectly which would be a lot over the course of the next few years.

How quickly people forget Buddy Hall and Mike LeBron in the Challenge of Champions.
$50k winner takes all didn't stop anyone from dumping their brains out, now did it.

If there was a naive "book" at the U.S. Open taking bets on matches and changing the line every time each line filled up with bets, i can totally see a "saver" being made, and then the players figuring out how to snap off the book by having friends pumping it up with bets. There are plenty of people who have watched this scenario unfold at different tournaments

That's not to say that this happens all the time, cause it doesn't.
But if the conditions are right, there are plenty of professional pool players whose integrity would go right out the window at the prospect of maximizing their guaranteed profits...

 

[Woof Biscuit]

This. It always amuses me when the "smart" guys start crying dump. It has happened and will probably happen in the future but in majors it is extremely rare IMO. Only way I could see it in the final four of a major is if there was an enormous amount bet on the side and that doesnt happen often if ever.

I think a lot of the "smart" guys underestimate how big of an influence ego plays when it comes to the elite players.

This was my thought almost verbatim when I read the OP.

 

[CreeDo]

First off, Congrats to SVB!
You're the OP, it's your "thoughts"...why would you start a poll like this?
[...]This poll is a joke!

Dude. You're misreading my post, or not reading anything except the title.

A few people in the ustream chat cry "omg he's dumping!" every time someone misses a ball. That's their idea. Not mine. I strongly disagree... that's why I wrote:

"My opinion is that these conspiracy theorists just want to sound like they're experts who are In The Know about the secret underworld of pool. "

In other words, people who cry 'dump' are full of it and just want to sound smart.

Does that make it clearer? I don't think anyone is dumping. I'm posting to see if most of the people on this site actually believe that dumping crap.

 

[CreeDo]

The controversy about Mike Lebron is the reason I chose "I doubt it" rather than "I'm positive they don't dump". Even guys like Jay Helfert seem to think there was shady business happening there.

But basically, since 1988, vegas won't handicap pool anymore... so I don't think there's been any incentive for players to dump. Maybe there's a mysterious millionaire club placing 100k bets on pool, but I'm not buying that one anytime soon.

As to those who are saying stuff like "omg this poll is stupid, you should never post it, etc"... give me a break people. There's no need to tiptoe around controversial pool topics. What's your concern, that I will tarnish pool's fantastic clean reputation? That all those top pros who read AZB every day will get offended?

 

[Vyc]

Dude. You're misreading my post, or not reading anything except the title.

A few people in the ustream chat cry "omg he's dumping!" every time someone misses a ball. That's their idea. Not mine. I strongly disagree... that's why I wrote:

"My opinion is that these conspiracy theorists just want to sound like they're experts who are In The Know about the secret underworld of pool. "

In other words, people who cry 'dump' are full of it and just want to sound smart.

Does that make it clearer? I don't think anyone is dumping. I'm posting to see if most of the people on this site actually believe that dumping crap.

Ok. Yes this makes it very clear where you're coming from. You should have stated as such in your first post.

The question isn't about those particular players. The question is would an unnamed pool player in the final stages of a major tournament dump.

I have seen savers take place between some of the big names in pool in the final stages of tournaments. Once a guy has done a saver the possibility exists he would also dump if the Calcutta or a side bet would profit him.

There was a major tournament years ago which Vegas gave odds on and there are a lot of people who believe the players dumped, and they were some of the top players in the game at the time. There have been threads on this forum detailing the whole situation.

There is no doubt in my mind there are some players in the game who would dump if the money was right].

Yep, I've seen it happen.

 

[TATE]

What if a Romney (he clearly bets) came up to a finalist and whispered, "I've got half a million bet on you to lose. If you lose, it's half yours..."?

The player wouldn't take it since Romney would change his mind on a moments notice and Obama is well known for welching on anything over $250,000.

 

[TATE]

The controversy about Mike Lebron is the reason I chose "I doubt it" rather than "I'm positive they don't dump". Even guys like Jay Helfert seem to think there was shady business happening there.

But basically, since 1988, vegas won't handicap pool anymore... so I don't think there's been any incentive for players to dump. Maybe there's a mysterious millionaire club placing 100k bets on pool, but I'm not buying that one anytime soon.

As to those who are saying stuff like "omg this poll is stupid, you should never post it, etc"... give me a break people. There's no need to tiptoe around controversial pool topics. What's your concern, that I will tarnish pool's fantastic clean reputation? That all those top pros who read AZB every day will get offended?

As long as there is a distinction between chopping and dumping, then I would say "very unlikely".

Chopping I would say "always highly possible" - between friends especially. As far as chopping, that's a gray area for me. Pool players have to survive, but it removes incentive, pressure, etc. I don't like it.

FWIW I don't think Shane would chop - that's my impression of him. He is too driven to win. He seems to perform his best when there is a lot of money at stake

 

[DrGonzo]

Either way, the way Shane played, he wasn't going to get beat.

 

[Fatboy]

Not calling anyone out... nor trying to point fingers at any specific pool player. I'm just curious to see how pool fans on AZB think.

Seems like every time a player misses a ball, someone will cry "DUMP" or "looks like some business going on here" etc.

So how many of you honestly believe top-leve pro pool players are willing to throw matches in a major like the US Open?

====

My opinion is that these conspiracy theorists just want to sound like they're experts who are In The Know about the secret underworld of pool.

Either that, or they don't get the difficulty of some shots and don't understand why a "gimmie" is actually missable. A certain ball might be easy to roll in with no english but it's a different story blasting at warp speed with heavy sidespin. Or a combo might be easy but not if you're trying to actually hit it towards the fat or thin side of the pocket so you can control the first ball.

In fact, the old accustats magazines show that typical pros miss about 5 balls for every 100 pocketed.

They dont dump, Savers is another story(lots of those). I will go on record and say 100% for sure SVB didnt do a saver this year, he came to win.

 

[Fatboy]

The controversy about Mike Lebron is the reason I chose "I doubt it" rather than "I'm positive they don't dump". Even guys like Jay Helfert seem to think there was shady business happening there.

But basically, since 1988, vegas won't handicap pool anymore... so I don't think there's been any incentive for players to dump. Maybe there's a mysterious millionaire club placing 100k bets on pool, but I'm not buying that one anytime soon.

As to those who are saying stuff like "omg this poll is stupid, you should never post it, etc"... give me a break people. There's no need to tiptoe around controversial pool topics. What's your concern, that I will tarnish pool's fantastic clean reputation? That all those top pros who read AZB every day will get offended?

thats well documented, i believe what Jay says about that. And it was long ago, Mike was smart IMO. F*ck the casino's-it was on them IMO

 

[JCIN]

thats well documented, i believe what Jay says about that. And it was long ago, Mike was smart IMO. F*ck the casino's-it was on them IMO

Actually he didnt fvck the casino he and all involved fvcked pool.

Well.

 

[Donny Lutz]

Romney bets

Why does it got to be Romney man? Plus, your "Indecent Proposal" scenerio, is not realistic.

http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/6e85114ceb/another-indecent-proposal

I used Romney as an example (I supposed I could have made a list), because he actually proposed a $10,000 bet on live television.

Unrealistic scenario? I've personally seen a $20,000 bet on a match being played for $5,000, and the friend I mentioned saw a $200,000 side bet on a tourney pool match. I doubt those were the only two large side bets in pool history.

 

[Scott Lee]

Can't vote, since you did not include an option of: It depends on who the players are...which is the reality...some would, some wouldn't.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com

Not calling anyone out... nor trying to point fingers at any specific pool player. I'm just curious to see how pool fans on AZB think.

Seems like every time a player misses a ball, someone will cry "DUMP" or "looks like some business going on here" etc.

So how many of you honestly believe top-leve pro pool players are willing to throw matches in a major like the US Open?

====

My opinion is that these conspiracy theorists just want to sound like they're experts who are In The Know about the secret underworld of pool.

Either that, or they don't get the difficulty of some shots and don't understand why a "gimmie" is actually missable. A certain ball might be easy to roll in with no english but it's a different story blasting at warp speed with heavy sidespin. Or a combo might be easy but not if you're trying to actually hit it towards the fat or thin side of the pocket so you can control the first ball.

In fact, the old accustats magazines show that typical pros miss about 5 balls for every 100 pocketed.