I Think You Do Have to play better players

Johnnyt

Johnnyt

Burn all jump cues
Silver Member
A lot of good players on AZ that have been around for awhile have often said that you will never get to a top level in pool without playing the top pros. I have disagreed with that for a long time, but after doing some thinking, I believe there right on the money.

Most of the top pros that I knew before they got to the top always were playing better players than themselves. They would match up with the best in the rooms and generally took the worst of it. Also they hung around with the top players and road players as much as possible, learning the ropes from the best.

I never could bring myself to give my money away on a pool table. I probably was short sighted back then, not thinking that it was an investment to get better. I won’t lie. I loved pool, but played only for the money. I couldn’t play a game of pool without money on it. Although I loved pool, I also loved other things like women, boat racing, motorcycles, partying, and money. Johnnyt
 
Johnnyt said:
A lot of good players on AZ that have been around for awhile have often said that you will never get to a top level in pool without playing the top pros. I have disagreed with that for a long time, but after doing some thinking, I believe there right on the money.

Most of the top pros that I knew before they got to the top always were playing better players than themselves. They would match up with the best in the rooms and generally took the worst of it. Also they hung around with the top players and road players as much as possible, learning the ropes from the best.

I never could bring myself to give my money away on a pool table. I probably was short sighted back then, not thinking that it was an investment to get better. I won’t lie. I loved pool, but played only for the money. I couldn’t play a game of pool without money on it. Although I loved pool, I also loved other things like women, boat racing, motorcycles, partying, and money. Johnnyt
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You don't have to actually play the better players or gamble with them for the benefits. You just need to be in the environment of the better players. You will get better almost by osmoses. You pick up their play without even knowing it. Good players breed more good players. Their demeanor, the ease with which they play and make it look easy as well as what they do, you learn. You can not help but learn. Who hasn't after watching a tournament or some top players match not gone to a table and played better. The problem is, it wares off. If you are always around it, it becomes part of your game and you find yourself jumping up in speeds permanently not just a one night high.
 
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I have definitely learned a whole lot more from playing champions than by folks of my caliber. No question about it. Shots, moves, strategies, and tecniques.
 
Jonny, this forum iz turning into UR personal daily diary :eek::mad::sorry:

Brian
 
Playing better players can help your game when you're on the learning curve or it could just dis-hearten you. It depends how you take losing. Once someone is a good player it doesn't help so much with skills as it does maintaining a competitive edge (the killer instinct).I personally don't think money has to enter in to it but it always seems to somehow.
 
Thats too bad, everyone enjoys your stories Johnny.
Recent trip to Vegas, I matched up with some great players after hours. No money, just for fun. It brought my game up a notch and I brought that back home with me. Up to that point, it seemed I hit a plateau and couldn't get beyond it. No big pool epiphany or anything like that but it did get me out of the rut.
 
macguy said:
You don't have to actually play the better players or gamble with them for the benefits. You just need to be in the environment of the better players. You will get better almost by osmoses. You pick up their play without even knowing it. Good players breed more good players. Their demeanor, the ease with which they play and make it look easy as well as what they do, you learn. You can not help but learn. Who hasn't after watching a tournament or some top players match not gone to a table and played better. The problem is, it wares off. If you are always around it, it becomes part of your game and you find yourself jumping up in speeds permanently not just a one night high.
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+1:thumbup:.

You definitely can get inspired simply by watching world class players.

One night at the recent 10Ball event in Vegas, after having been to every session, I went into the TarBar after the last match was over and shot some pool with a buddy. I played some of the best pool I'd played in a long time. Making everything and pin-pointing position. I actually impressed myself :grin-square:.

And you are right; it wore off. :mad:
 
No question about it ... I definitely play much better Pool when I compete against higher caliber players, especially in Open Tournaments.
 
DogsPlayingPool said:
+1:thumbup:.

You definitely can get inspired simply by watching world class players.

One night at the recent 10Ball event in Vegas, after having been to every session, I went into the TarBar after the last match was over and shot some pool with a buddy. I played some of the best pool I'd played in a long time. Making everything and pin-pointing position. I actually impressed myself :grin-square:.

And you are right; it wore off. :mad:
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I think this has a lot to do with subconciously emulating their pace around the table, cue ball speed and stroke timing.

Certainly playing better players brings your game up. A lot of it is mental I think. Playing run out players essentially gets you focused on getting out at every opportunity, as a mistake could cost the game. If you are used to playing weaker players you tend to take your opportunities for granted, which perhaps leads to less effort being put into any given shot.

A capable player who never plays strong competition may crumble under the pressure of making the most of every chance.
 
I'm not sure I actually changed my pace or stroke or anything like that. I do think it was mental though. It was as though watching these guys all day, making shots from everywhere and whatnot, I actually absorbed a sort of confidence, like "Hey, this isn't that difficult." LOL. In a way I transferred what I had been watching all day to my own self so by the time I got to the pool table it was as if somehow in a way it had been me playing that great pool I'd been watching for the last 12 hours.

And I think a big part of it was something I notice all the top level players have and that's focus. I was definitely more focused that night because of it.
 
When I use to watch great players and saw them do something it might be good to copy I'd watch several more play before I changed. If most of them did the same thing I figured it would be right for me. After all not everybody should copy McCready's stroke. Johnnyt
 
There's people like you who like to brag about taking off the local hack, then there's other people that put it on the line and challenge themselves and take on other good players. I admire and respect the latter.

Doug
 
I dunno, I was able to improve without playing better players for many years, I went from getting a rare runout to occasional 3-packs. I don't seek out players who aren't as good, there just aren't a lot of opponents to choose from... the local pool hall has no action and is pretty small. I did it by reading books, this forum, and a little practice. Mostly by just trying my hardest to play 'by the book', even during casual matches.

I've also remember hearing how Landon Shuffett does a ton of solo practice and seems to have gone up a speed or two despite no competition. He does long races with the ghost and straight pool.

However, you did say "top level", not just "get better". So you might be right. Once you learn all the book stuff, there is only steadiness and discipline, and you might need the right people to bring those things out in you.
 
CreeDo said:
I dunno, I was able to improve without playing better players for many years, I went from getting a rare runout to occasional 3-packs. I don't seek out players who aren't as good, there just aren't a lot of opponents to choose from... the local pool hall has no action and is pretty small. I did it by reading books, this forum, and a little practice. Mostly by just trying my hardest to play 'by the book', even during casual matches.

I've also remember hearing how Landon Shuffett does a ton of solo practice and seems to have gone up a speed or two despite no competition. He does long races with the ghost and straight pool.

However, you did say "top level", not just "get better". So you might be right. Once you learn all the book stuff, there is only steadiness and discipline, and you might need the right people to bring those things out in you.
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FWIW, Landon REGULARLY has matches with better players than himself and has for some time now.
JoeyA
 
DogsPlayingPool said:
+1:thumbup:.

You definitely can get inspired simply by watching world class players.

One night at the recent 10Ball event in Vegas, after having been to every session, I went into the TarBar after the last match was over and shot some pool with a buddy. I played some of the best pool I'd played in a long time. Making everything and pin-pointing position. I actually impressed myself :grin-square:.

And you are right; it wore off. :mad:
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It always does!! :D
 
DogsPlayingPool said:
I'm not sure I actually changed my pace or stroke or anything like that. I do think it was mental though. It was as though watching these guys all day, making shots from everywhere and whatnot, I actually absorbed a sort of confidence, like "Hey, this isn't that difficult." LOL. In a way I transferred what I had been watching all day to my own self so by the time I got to the pool table it was as if somehow in a way it had been me playing that great pool I'd been watching for the last 12 hours.

And I think a big part of it was something I notice all the top level players have and that's focus. I was definitely more focused that night because of it.
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Its called "INSPIRATION" !!!!!!
 
I witnessed an absolute robbing the other night... Player A beat PLayer B out of 200+ dollars at 5-bucks a rack.... I think playing better players and getting hamered like this would hurt your game rather than help it....
There should be some kind of spot to where u should never get outside of a 10 game difference....Then once you start winning adjust accordingly....But of course most people aren't trying to get better they are just trying to make some money...nothing wrong with that...=)
 
Creedo and Joey, you're correct!

Landon's main competition at home is 14.1 and the ghost.

In actual competition, of which there is very little in our area, I try and match Landon up as regularly as possible with players that are as strong and stronger than he is.

If there are A players and above in a 150 mile radius of central Kentucky that would like to trade out on some 8-10 hour practice sessions just get in touch for more details. Serious inquires only.

The only way to contact Landon or me is through our only website: www.justcueit.com.

Stan Shuffett
 
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