Is Scott Frost over-rated?

[mikeyfrost]

It's hard to be over rated when the only expectation for you is to win every event. He's one of the all time greats and he's still gonna win a whole lot more than he loses. Why can't people just say Joey and Efren played good sets to beat the man and give credit where it is due? You would rather destroy someone's game than to build up others...shows a lot.

 

[iusedtoberich]

Well, I think he is a great player, but that he is over rated, imo. He is an expert at one-pocket, but he does not have the same talent that the top rotation players do, at pocketing balls. That is why I bet against him almost every year at the big one pocket events.

 

[Fast Lenny]

It's hard to be over rated when the only expectation for you is to win every event. He's one of the all time greats and he's still gonna win a whole lot more than he loses. Why can't people just say Joey and Efren played good sets to beat the man and give credit where it is due? You would rather destroy someone's game than to build up others...shows a lot.

This is true, Joey played great and Scott even acknowledged this. Efren is amazing period and its still unbelievable he is capable of winning any tournament he enters. Lots of young guns playing some powerful one pocket, the game has changed for sure and its much more exciting too.

 

[Fast Lenny]

I have played Justin getting 18-4 many times and we are really close. I think he is ahead a couple games. I tried to play Scott that way and it was brutal. I rarely got past one ball. I have no desire to play him that way again. He beats you a different way every time.

I watched him play in the PB on Wednesday. He seems to try to hard to make great things happen on the table and it costs him sometimes. I find it hard to second guess him as I know he knows waaaayyyyy more than me and what his opponent would do if he played the shot I would have played.

Just my opinion but I don't think he needs those unbelievable shots to win. I think he could simplify his game and still beat his opponents. I think he takes to many risks to do something amazing. Fun to watch though!

The good old crowd pleaser freezer stuff, now that's entertainment. :smile:

 

[bmsclayton]

yes

This is true, Joey played great and Scott even acknowledged this. Efren is amazing period and its still unbelievable he is capable of winning any tournament he enters. Lots of young guns playing some powerful one pocket, the game has changed for sure and its much more exciting too.

Joey played really good. He missed several balls though and Scott did not capitalize. Scott also lost a game that he needed one and Joey needed 5-6 and they were all on Scotts side up table in the corner. That should never really happen. The table was rolling off and it frustrated Scott a lot. He was really mind f'd that whole match with the air circulation, the roll offs, the skids, lucky leaves, etc. After almost every shot he would stare his backer down or Greg Sullivan.

 

[Bill S]

Ok so power one pocket freezer plays a lot of one pocket and obviously up there as a top contender but it seems like to me he alwaya falls short of his own ambitions

US open on epocket he not faired well to my knowledge, Alex beat him for the big cash this event he is out convincingly

my point is efren busty svb, Appleton, orcullo, deuel play all games great frost only plays one hole and doesn't dominate that, shit Appleton only been playin American pool since 07 and becoming an elusive one P player

so is her over rate by other or his own omission?

Scott won the 2005 US Open One Pocket beating Gabe Owen in the final.

 

[peteypooldude]

I just recommend if you have your doubts just get up and play him some, he will play cheaply giving some weight. You really do not know how great many of these players are until you get in the box with them. It is very humbling when you think you can play a little bit. :embarrassed2:

That's what I was thinking :grin-square:

 

[Colonel]

It's hard to be over rated when the only expectation for you is to win every event. He's one of the all time greats and he's still gonna win a whole lot more than he loses. Why can't people just say Joey and Efren played good sets to beat the man and give credit where it is due? You would rather destroy someone's game than to build up others...shows a lot.

Great post

 

[real bartram]

Joey played really good. He missed several balls though and Scott did not capitalize. Scott also lost a game that he needed one and Joey needed 5-6 and they were all on Scotts side up table in the corner. That should never really happen. The table was rolling off and it frustrated Scott a lot. He was really mind f'd that whole match with the air circulation, the roll offs, the skids, lucky leaves, etc. After almost every shot he would stare his backer down or Greg Sullivan.

Scott is a great 1 pocket player
I bel there are 4 or 5 guys that play right with him.

 

[actionplayer]

Although I'm not convinced he is the best One Pocket player, he's right up there with the best. Just my humble opinion as always. :smile:

I agree if hes not the best he is right up there but I think there is more competition these days and he is not the undisputed one pocket champion that many consider him

 

[JumpinJoe]

He was one of the best, top 2 him and Efren a few years back, and he was there for at least a decade. . He has slipped in the past few years, perhaps due to his own lack of practice. So I would no longer consider him the best. Top 10 obviously yes, top 5 probably.

Just because someone like Shane won't play him, well would you? When you know one day the guy will give you the spot. When he played Alex, Scott was not playing any due to other circumstances, with that said I still don't think he would beat Alex today the way he's playing.

The newest up and coming one pocket champion and soon to be at the top of the list in perhaps 2 years is Josh Roberts, he's hungry to be the best, that's something I don't think Scott had anymore, as he was at the top for numerous years.

Scott is still one of the best to ever play the game, but it's very arguable if he's still the best

 

[jay helfert]

I have played Justin getting 18-4 many times and we are really close. I think he is ahead a couple games. I tried to play Scott that way and it was brutal. I rarely got past one ball. I have no desire to play him that way again. He beats you a different way every time.

I watched him play in the PB on Wednesday. He seems to try to hard to make great things happen on the table and it costs him sometimes. I find it hard to second guess him as I know he knows waaaayyyyy more than me and what his opponent would do if he played the shot I would have played.

Just my opinion but I don't think he needs those unbelievable shots to win. I think he could simplify his game and still beat his opponents. I think he takes to many risks to do something amazing. Fun to watch though!

I'd like someone, ANYONE, to give me 18-4......or 17-4.......or my last offer, 16-4. If there is someone who would like to give me that game, I WILL play! And they can pick the bet. I didn't stutter either. I just need one week to prepare.

 

[Pushout]

Jay, how do Ronnie and Scott compare in aggressiveness?

 

[jay helfert]

Jay, how do Ronnie and Scott compare in aggressiveness?

Ronnie always had a plan for his shots, and didn't take any wild chances. He knew exactly what he was trying to do, even when shooting three rail kicks. Ronnie's style looked super aggressive because he was shooting shots no one else would attempt. But if you watched him long enough, he was consistently executing those shots and moving multiple balls towards his hole. No one to this day could do that like Ronnie. Scott on the other hand, will sometimes go for a low percentage shot, where there is really no reward if he makes it. In One Pocket, we call this shooting at a white flag. Scott may be the most aggressive One Pocket player that I've ever seen, along with Tony Chohan, another great player. Six or seven years ago I would have rated Tony over Scott. JMHO as always.....

 

[Nostroke]

It's hard for me to get past just how awful he looks shooting the ball. The total lack of any kind of fluidity makes it real hard for me to say "he is the best". Kinda like Maynard G Crebs trying to say the word 'work' . I know he is up there though

 

[bmsclayton]

bad

I'd like someone, ANYONE, to give me 18-4......or 17-4.......or my last offer, 16-4. If there is someone who would like to give me that game, I WILL play! And they can pick the bet. I didn't stutter either. I just need one week to prepare.

You have to play a special kind of awful to get that spot. I don't think you will qualify sir!

 

[Pushout]

Ronnie always had a plan for his shots, and didn't take any wild chances. He knew exactly what he was trying to do, even when shooting three rail kicks. Ronnie's style looked super aggressive because he was shooting shots no one else would attempt. But if you watched him long enough, he was consistently executing those shots and moving multiple balls towards his hole. No one to this day could do that like Ronnie. Scott on the other hand, will sometimes go for a low percentage shot, where there is really no reward if he makes it. In One Pocket, we call this shooting at a white flag. Scott may be the most aggressive One Pocket player that I've ever seen, along with Tony Chohan, another great player. Six or seven years ago I would have rated Tony over Scott. JMHO as always.....

Thanks, Jay! I have the match between Ronnie and Danny D. but it's on vhs and I don't have my vcr hooked up at the moment. I need to get that done

 

[Baby Huey]

Scott is a friend of mine and he has tremendous talent. But like of a lot of our threads we think the best of all time are playing now. Not so fast. Ronnie was unbelievealbe in his prime and I'm not so sure Scott could stand his game and conversation over a long period of time. There are others who played great. I think Harold Worst, who in my opinion, is/was the best ball striker of all time would master one pocket like he did every pool and billiard game he played. In the 40's, 50's and early 60's Rags Fitpatrick might hot ever let you see a shot at your hole. I new pretty good players who played Ralph Greenleaf and he played them eight no count and Ralph consistently won. I would say Scott is a top ten all time talent and that's no negative on his game.

 

[tucson9ball]

He just beat Efren for the cash earlier tonight and actually has beat Efren the past 3 or 4 plays for the money. Alex beat him for the money and should have being comfortable and in dead punch after a great session with Shane and Frost had not really been playing so it was very lopsided. Scott had beat Alex before that for some decent coin a couple of times. He has challenged Shane to a big money set playing one pocket and Shane won't play without a ball.

It all says a good deal about where he stands in the one pocket world. His record at the DCC over the past 5-6 years is great, with 1st and 2nd place finishes and the rest I believe all top 8 against the best in the world at that discipline. I do think he takes it a little lightly at times and if he really decided to put in the hours practicing that his contemporaries did then his game could go up a ball or perhaps even two which is unreal to think about.

I do agree with you to a certain extent. I beleive Scott is more of a money player than a tournament player though. In money games he can lose a few games and still come back over the course of a day and beat his opponent. In tournaments if you give away a couple games, it usually is too much to overcome.

I usually try not to chime in on these posts "who is the best 1 pocket player" due to getting tongue lashings in the past. Even Scott himself has berated me in PM's on FB.
But, it's my opinion that Scott will go down as a great 1 pocket player but not the best of all time, unless he buckles down in tournament play. Nobody cares who gets 2nd or 3rd place. We only remember who wins.

Lenny, I know you are pretty tight with Scott and you've seen some amazing things first hand. I wish I had the knowledge you get on a daily basis. Lil jealous 2 hours south of ya :frown:

If we base the best on how they finished in tournies, we can't ignore 5 wins by Efren at the DCC. Scott is much younger and will no doubt win some more DCC events, but will he buckle down and win more than 5? I think he has the talent, but being tournament tough is another animal. His style reminds me of Keith McCready, get knocked out of the tournament and then challenge the winner to a 10k matchup. This is just my opinion so take it for what its worth.

Let the Scott lovers start bashing now, I'm a big boy so give it your best. LOL

 

[tucson9ball]

I'd like someone, ANYONE, to give me 18-4......or 17-4.......or my last offer, 16-4. If there is someone who would like to give me that game, I WILL play! And they can pick the bet. I didn't stutter either. I just need one week to prepare.

Just curious, why 1 week? Is that so you could go get all your money out of the bank and still have time to drive to any state? LOL ...I would think 4 days would be enough to drive,even to Portland Maine.....:wink: