Jumping

Your the one here trying to get validation of your work. If anyone is making a big deal about it it is you.

Personally I am putting you on ignore, so I don't have to read any more of your crap. I only hope that everyone else follows suite. This way, the only person you end up talking to are the voices in your own head.


ThePoolkillers said:
OK I'll help you out. I am serious and I'm not any kind of troll or joker. I have my way of helping people just like every player. God stop making such a big deal out of it :rotflmao:
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My very first thought on this was,,,anyone who is jumping the ball by scooping it,,,on purpose,,,is not ready to learn how to jump the ball correctly.

I can't remember the last time I have seen someone do this,,other than on accident.

Take some time shooting pool in leagues or at the pool hall. Get out of the basement and learn how the game is played. And do not ever try to scoop/jump the cue ball ever again. It's silly!!!!

When your game gets to a higher level,,you won't need much help jumping. I have never seen a beginner player,,jumping balls. And hope I never do. They shouldn't even be trying,,,you can damage a table if you don't know what you are doing.
 
Wing said:
Advice, constructive criticism, etc. would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance!

-Wing
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Okay, here's MY advice. Invest no more than $75 and buy yourself a jump/break cue. It can be a used one or a new one (J&J, Action both make a decent j/b cue for right around $75 or less). Now, for a cheap investment you have a jump cue AND a decent break cue. You CAN get started jumping correctly with these cues because I know firsthand that you can (I have two Action j/b cues, one with the phenolic tip and one I have put a Samsara leather j/b tip onto). I have no problems whatsoever jumping with my inexpensive Action cues.

If you cannot master the jump shot, then you will not have "broke the bank" on your equipment.

I also found Robin Dodson's DVD to be very helpful.

http://www.ozonebilliards.com/rodomajushdv.html

http://www.ozonebilliards.com/accuzesnpeju.html

Good shooting, my friend!!!

Maniac
 
Wing,

Maniac offered good advice, and if I can add anything I would say, do not follow any advice from PoolKiller.


Maniac said:
Okay, here's MY advice. Invest no more than $75 and buy yourself a jump/break cue. It can be a used one or a new one (J&J, Action both make a decent j/b cue for right around $75 or less). Now, for a cheap investment you have a jump cue AND a decent break cue. You CAN get started jumping correctly with these cues because I know firsthand that you can (I have two Action j/b cues, one with the phenolic tip and one I have put a Samsara leather j/b tip onto). I have no problems whatsoever jumping with my inexpensive Action cues.

If you cannot master the jump shot, then you will not have "broke the bank" on your equipment.

I also found Robin Dodson's DVD to be very helpful.

http://www.ozonebilliards.com/rodomajushdv.html

http://www.ozonebilliards.com/accuzesnpeju.html

Good shooting, my friend!!!

Maniac
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dr_dave said:
Wing said:
So for the longest time ive scooped the cue ball over another ball and considered that a "jump shot". Obviously ive been doing it wrong. Here's my question. Every time i try to execute a correct jump shot, i always end up hitting the ball im trying to jump. I just cant get the cue ball to leave the table. I end up putting back spin on it at the very least. ...

Advice, constructive criticism, etc. would be greatly appreciated.
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FYI, lots of good technique advice, including video demonstrations and instructional articles, on this topic can be found here:

I hope that helps. I'm sure it will.
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Wing,

Did you try out some of the advice on the jump shot resource page? If so, did it help any?

Dave
 
You probably have most of what you need to get started but I will stress one more thing. Tip hardness makes all the difference. It's huge. A very very hard tip makes jumping feel effortless. That's one of the big advantages to the jump cue, not just its short length or light weight. That's another reason a full cue (even a house cue with a beat tip) is so difficult to jump with. The tips on these jump cues are made of the same material as the pool balls, and the cue ball can't wait to get away from it when you smack it lightly.

Also, you can't do it timidly. You need to have no fear of hurting the table or jumping the ball off the table and looking like a jackass. Yes, the whole room will probably turn and look if you do it. Still, you have to shoot as if you don't care about that. If you allow the fear to affect your stroke, you won't spike through the ball the way you need to. If you're truly worried, ask the owner if he keeps a spare patch of cloth for breaking or practicing, this protects the table so you don't have to worry.

One last common issue... some people have trouble getting their bridge hand stable and high enough to give them clearance. On other words, their thumb is only 2 inches over the cue ball, therefore their maximum stroke length is only 2 inches. You can't put a full, firm, driving stroke on the ball if you're only able to pull the cue back 2 inches before it slips out of your hand. So you gotta figure out a way to get your hand high over the ball. Just for training, the easy way to do this is to sit the cue ball near the rail and use the rail as an elevator. Without the rail, use your two middle fingers... they're the longest so they give you the most elevation. Also try standing on your tip toes so you can elevate the back end of the cue comfortably.
 
ThePoolkillers said:
Just aim at the position where the white is touching the table surface and stab forward. Make sure you add enough power (at least PL4) or the ball will most likely skid.
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This is excellent advice for anyone who wants to remove their old table cloth. Or new table cloth. Or be forcibly removed from the table by the owner.

For the OP:

The best advice I received on this was from Dr. Dave. Loosening the grip, down to just two fingers immediately let me jump full ball. The stick does the work. Follow his links.
 
DoubleD said:
Just go to the nearest real pool hall, ask the person working the desk if they know anyone who can jump well and legally. Get that person to teach you. Hand him a $20 bill and thank him for the five minutes it took.
dld
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Or just find me and I will teach you for free!!!

Maniac
 
At first I really tried to help this guy to point him to some real information on how to play pool, then it just became really frustrating to deal with a sick mind that really is incapable of getting any new information in, now it's just fun to watch what gems this poster comes up with. Jump Shot in quotes like it's some foreign term that should not be used. We have found another grade of lunatic. We have some political lunatics (Stalin, Hitler), religious lunatic (that guy that keeps claiming god told him the end of the world is coming every week this year for example) and now we have our own Pool Lunatic. Trying to jump by hitting bellow center and at the cloth will just end up ripping the cloth aside from the fact that it's an illegal shot. He forgot to add "before doing this, take out $300 for new cloth and installation and hand it to the owner of the table".

ThePoolkillers said:
Believe me, you don't need a "jump stick". I can do AGS (you called it "jump shot"), my friends can do AGS, and many other people I saw, who are far from pro, can perform this type of shot with pretty much any stick. OK, make sure the stick is at least moderately good, but otherwise, most bar sticks should be enough. You don't even need that much angle (45 degrees). Just aim at the position where the white is touching the table surface and stab forward. Make sure you add enough power (at least PL4) or the ball will most likely skid. Accuracy of the shot is more of a problem, but that comes with time and practice.

Read about AGS, power levels and other shots on pages 17 and 18 in the manual I posted in the thread "All-out offensive vs Successive offensive"
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DoubleD said:
So your messages are:

1. You don't need to hit hard.
2. You should hit hard.
3. If your bridge is 2" higher than the top of the cueball you only get 2" of stroke...sounds like you are stroking straight down on the cueball to me. Try jumping with an angle. Vertical cues are for masse shots.

To the OP:

Just go to the nearest real pool hall, ask the person working the desk if they know anyone who can jump well and legally. Get that person to teach you. Hand him a $20 bill and thank him for the five minutes it took.

dld
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Not exactly.

1. You don't need to hit hard.
2. But you can't hit it like a six year old girl either because you're scared of causing a ruckus.
3. I'll rephrase, because yes, you're not spiking straight down on the ball. But a lot of the time you're going pretty vertical (usually over 45 degrees). So if you can't elevate your hand enough, you can't bring the cue very far back. Getting that extra elevation gives you a little extra bridge length.
 
CreeDo...You offered some good information. Just FYI not all jump cues come with phenolic tips. The jump cue that I use, and teach others how to use, comes with a hard leather tip. I happen to think it outperforms every other jump cue out there...the Stealth AT-1 Air Jumper.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

CreeDo said:
The tips on these jump cues are made of the same material as the pool balls, and the cue ball can't wait to get away from it when you smack it lightly. .
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The jump cue is an incredible aid that helps players of all skill levels jump easier.

From your OP, if you were scooping to jump, it makes me think you may be a bit of a beginner. Not trying to insult you in any way. We were all beginners at one time. The one thing I always stress with any of the new players I coach, is the importance on learning how to kick.

All I'm saying is don't just ignore kicking at a ball in order to grab a jump stick. You will be hindering your progress in the game by doing so.

Just some friendly advice.

Good luck with your learning process.
 
Also excellent advice!

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com

Brozif said:
The jump cue is an incredible aid that helps players of all skill levels jump easier.

The one thing I always stress with any of the new players I coach, is the importance on learning how to kick.

All I'm saying is don't just ignore kicking at a ball in order to grab a jump stick. You will be hindering your progress in the game by doing so.
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Brozif said:
The jump cue is an incredible aid that helps players of all skill levels jump easier…

…The one thing I always stress with any of the new players I coach, is the importance on learning how to kick.

….All I'm saying is don't just ignore kicking at a ball in order to grab a jump stick. You will be hindering your progress in the game by doing so….
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Yes this is great advice that I take a step further with my students. Don’t get ___ happy; jump happy isn’t the only ____ happy problem, there is draw happy, jump happy, rail happy, soft shot happy, firm shot happy, follow happy, English happy etc.. etc.. (by “happy” I mean do an excessive amount of.

In pool there are almost always several solutions to the problems/puzzle that you face. When you learn a new way of dealing with the table don’t get “happy” with it. The story of one of my students comes to mind.

Whenever I teach the masse I preface by saying “I am about to show you a really bad idea”. So after I taught this kid the masse he was choosing masse 10-12 times a night. I didn’t realize this until I saw him play at the pool room. So I walk up to him and say “you missed the “bad idea” part of what I said huh?” When you learn how to full table draw don’t make that your “go to” solution, in fact don’t make anything a “go to” way of playing any situation.

So to bottom line this is when you do get a good handle on the jump shot don’t think to yourself “I have this new way of dealing with this situation so that is probably the better way of handling it” think of it in terms of “I have added a weapon to my arsenal; so I have another avenue”, don’t use your grenade when your pistol will do. You would be surprised at how big a problem this is with newer players, good luck.
 
PGHteacher said:
In pool there are almost always several solutions to the problems/puzzle that you face.

When you learn how to full table draw don’t make that your “go to” solution, in fact don’t make anything a “go to” way of playing any situation.

So to bottom line this is when you do get a good handle on the jump shot don’t think to yourself “I have this new way of dealing with this situation so that is probably the better way of handling it” think of it in terms of “I have added a weapon to my arsenal; so I have another avenue”, don’t use your grenade when your pistol will do. You would be surprised at how big a problem this is with newer players, good luck.
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PGH, you sound like you are a fine instructor/teacher. I tell people that I informally instruct much of the same. I tell them that unless they are on a shot clock, to walk the table and see how many reasonable ways you can shoot your next shot and still get the cueball where you want it. Then, pick the option that gives you the best chance of success.

Sometimes high/right will put you in the same place that low/left will, but which one can you perform most successfully?

Good advice about not getting "jump happy", and to those who recommend mastering the kick shot. I may use my jump cue once-a-match, sometimes never at all, but there are times when it's absolutely needed and the smart choice.

Maniac
 
Scott Lee said:
CreeDo...You offered some good information. Just FYI not all jump cues come with phenolic tips. The jump cue that I use, and teach others how to use, comes with a hard leather tip. I happen to think it outperforms every other jump cue out there...the Stealth AT-1 Air Jumper.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
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Well, I guess it's possible I'm off about this one :) But... what if that cue were the exact same in every other way, but you replaced the tip with something even harder? I'd think it would make jumping even easier (but maybe less controlled?)
 
CreeDo...I didn't say you were "off on this one"...I merely wanted to point out that leather tipped jump cues can jump just as efficiently (more, imo) as phenolic tipped ones. It's still all about technique.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
 
CreeDo said:
... what if that cue were the exact same in every other way, but you replaced the tip with something even harder? I'd think it would make jumping even easier (but maybe less controlled?)
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My J/B has two shafts, one with a Samsara, one with phenolic. I can jump just as easily with either but the Samsara has far more control.
 
Scott Lee said:
CreeDo...I didn't say you were "off on this one"...I merely wanted to point out that leather tipped jump cues can jump just as efficiently (more, imo) as phenolic tipped ones. It's still all about technique.

Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
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Another thing to consider is that phenolic tips are illegal under some rule sets.
 
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