Meucci went overseas!!!

3andstop said:
Sure quality, fit and finish of custom cues are far better than production cues. You are also paying thousands more for that....

...Yes, many times production lower end cues don't feel so good right out of the wrapper, but that isn't a 2000 dollar issue....

...In fact most of the custom sneaky petes use the same damned shafts as the companies 5000 dollar cue....

...My point is not to have new players or even advanced player bull#$#ed into thinking they need to spend 1500 to 2500 to get a cue stick thats worth playing with....
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Your persistence/fixation in comparing a $300 production cue to a $1500-$2500 custom cue is pretty pointless. You can buy a heck of a custom cue from many cuemakers for around $300-$500. You seem to think that a "Sure quality, fit and finish" in a custom cue must cost thousands of dollars. That is simply not true.

Kelly
 
Kelly_Guy said:
Your persistence/fixation in comparing a $300 production cue to a $1500-$2500 custom cue is pretty pointless. You can buy a heck of a custom cue from many cuemakers for around $300-$500. You seem to think that a "Sure quality, fit and finish" in a custom cue must cost thousands of dollars. That is simply not true.

Kelly
Click to expand...

I think that's 3andstop point all along. A "good production" cue is just as good as "good custom" cue. Cheaper cue doesn't mean bad cue and more expensive cue doesn't mean better cue.
 
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crosseyedjoe said:
I think that's 3andstop point all along. A "good production" cue is just as good as "good custom" cue. Cheaper cue doesn't mean bad cue and more expensive cue doesn't mean better cue.
Click to expand...

While making his point (whatever it is), if someone not knowing were to read it, one would think all custom cues cost thousands of dollars. That is false information.

His point as far as I see it is not to say that a good production is as good as a good custom, his point is to say the difference in price between a production cue and a custom cue is not worth it when you consider only the utilitarian aspect of the cue. The price difference he is comparing is $300 to $2000, which is overblown.

Kelly
 
Forgive me as I haven't read this entire thread. But from the title...I think it would be a fantastic move for Moochie to move its plant to China. This would actually be quite a step UP over current quality.;)
 
Sorry guys, I do tend to get passionate and ramble about this subject. In my mind having people say lower end cues are junk is no different than me saying custom cues are overpriced re-inventions of the wheel which can now be an automated process.

To be fair I don't price cues. If what I example is overblown, I'm sorry. The guys I play with all own cues well over 1500 bucks and most of them have more than one of them.

If they told me they enjoyed the craftsmanship I'd understand the expense, but it cranks this old guy up when they start with the "plays better" garbage.

I'll kick their butts with a good sneaky pete regardless, so I suppose I over defended my Meuccis. :) Sorry. :)
 
Let's stop lying to ourselves about Meucci's!

:cool:

Meucci's have always been subpar pool cues. And today, well, I'm not one to criticize a fool and how he separates himself from his money... :cool:

You'll never catch The Woim playing with a Meucci or any production cue. I've said it before and I'll say it again, if you have the requisite amount of self respect than you will see that playing this gentleman's parlor room board game literally demands that you buy a custom cue.

Lots of great custom cue makers out there in the $350-$900 range. Unless you're homeless, you have no excuse to not own a custom cue. No excuse at all. Get out a credit card. Sell the extra car that's always parked in the back yard. Cash in your IRA or a CD. Reach into the cookie jar where you stash all those crisp $100 bills...

Do whatever it takes but do it. Buy a custom cue today as your token of love for the game of pool.

I understand the point of view of the other posters who are rationalizing their ownership of Meucci cues. I even agree that someone could mistakenly believe that an inexpensive production cue plays well enough for serious pool. Those men can believe in the tooth fairy if they want, I won't complain. But you'll never catch The Woim ever playing with a production cue.

Blackjack said Meucci's are firewood. Nope, they're not. Your house will really stick if you put that plastic on the fire on a cold November night...

:D

Will you just buy a custom cue and stop being in denial about your [Meucci, Joss, Predator, Schon, Viking, Peschaur, Falcon, Fury, Cuetech, Player, etc]

The Woim
 
Junk

I wish I had been able to read comments like these a couple of years ago (before I bought mine)! The black dot shaft is horrible and is only slightly better than their customer service. I had a friend wait a year for a shaft that he sent back, and when it came back the collar was a completely different color. I would like to send mine in to get fixed but I really don't want to wait a year or longer to get it back. Meucci BAD!
 
Meucci's have always been subpar pool cues
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That is just absolutely not true. I have played with many meucci's from back in the day. They were built good and played great. If one can get there hands on an original, then they will be happy. I had to stop selling them in my store last year do to many quality issues that were left unresolved. One cue I sent back three times due to warpage.. not just a little either... and they sent me one back the forth time that was warped both in the butt and shaft. That was the last chance for them in my store.
 
Nineballnut, we're in agreement (sorta)

:cool:

Rob,

No doubt the Meucci's of the early years up to approx. 1990 were superior to today's Meucci's. And no doubt many novice players (APA SL3's and below) enjoy the Meucci's they, IMO, mistakenly buy.

No offense but the stuff of the early years just wasn't as junky as today's Meuccis. Also, production cues as a whole are a quantum leap better than 20-30 years ago.

I'm a lover of custom cues. I think custom cues are the entryway into the respectable phase of pool. But I will acknowledge that the pro's of the past used custom cues because production cues in those days were equavalent to the nonsense being sold in Wal-Mart today.

A great cuemaker (one of today's living legends) told me with today's milling equipment can get the joint to 1/1000th of an inch in precision and even yesteryear's great custom cuebuilders couldn't match that.

I've never stroked a Meucci that felt half as solid as the Viking I stroked at Cue N' Cushions. It's a great cue. However, you won't ever catch The Woim playing with a production cue.

Let's not waste time and energy defended and detracting from Meucci cues. In the arena of making a quick buck, ALL cuebuilders take a back seat to Bob "Sell Out" Meucci!

My words are true, those who know, know.

The Woim
 
Sent the same cue back THREE TIMES?

:mad: Rob,

As a retailer, I can understand selling Moochies. If people want to buy them, who am I to say no. But pity the poor guy who spent probably a whole paycheck on a Mooch only to have it sent back three times! :mad: I hope that guy didn't quit pool.

Let's assume, from a retailer's point of view, that the guy who had his Meucci sent back three times decided to quit pool. First things first, pool is a tough game to get good at.

Mr. Joe buys a mooch with a week's salary. He's worked 40 hours that week and the money went to his new pool cue instead of savings or food or a piece of jewelry for a girlfriend or wife. He's excited to get this pool stick because he likes his new hobby and wants to improve and he likes the idea of owning his own stick (just like Paul Newman in "The Hustler").

However, after three unsuccessful attempts by the really caring people at Mooch, he quits pool. No big deal, right?

What did the fine, caring people at Mooch cost the pool world by Mr. Joe quitting? After all, Mr. Joe can take up bowling (a sport that could "school" pool) or chess (don't try comparing yourself to these guys, you won't measure up) or darts or pingpong or video games or just watching football on TV. Mr. Joe doesn't have to put up with the BS from the billiards industry.

So, what did the billiards industry miss out by Mooch's disregard for the satisfaction of Mr. Joe? Let's assume Mr. Joe would have developed into your standard APA league player.

Well, here goes:

*** The APA league in my part of the USA charges $7 per league night. Mr. Joe likes pool enough to do two nights a week. Over a 25 year period, that's approx. $19000. Not including the inflation in the years to come.

*** Mr. Joe will buy, on average, 7 production cues. Ranging in price from $125 to $350 (assuming he never develops The Woim's taste for cues. So, there goes approx. $1900 in cue retail sales.

*** Mr. Joe likes to go to pool halls and play on those fancy GC III's... Being frugal at $3.50 an hour, Mr. Joe will spend approx. $22,500 in the next 25 years on table time. But not now, Mooch has decided to steer him into another endeavor.

*** Mr. Joe will buy cue cases (don't we all) amounting to approx. $500 in the next 25 years. A small loss to the billilards industry when you compare it to the other categories.

*** Mr. Joe didn't embark on his billiard career (whether that's a top of SL5 in the APA or HOF status) so he never bought that pool table. Approx $3000.

Mr. Joe was, in all likelihood, going to spend approx. $50,000 (or more) in his billiard career. Don't tell me these numbers are inflated, most likely I'm lowballing the estimate.

Also, Mr. Joe would have passed the traditions of the game on to his sons and daughters. At least one of them would have carried on the tradition.

So, you see what one stupid Meucci cue can cost the billiard industry?

Am I exaggerating?

If the story changes and Mr. Joe just leaves for 10 years and comes back, the billiard industry lost approx. 16,000 in revenue. Yeah, that's right! I know.

Mr. Joe loses nothing by leaving "this industry" because there are many fine endeavers which can keep him occupied and in a state of enjoyment.

Know this, and take it to heart, the billiard industry needs Mr. Joe much more than he needs us. The billiard industry could disappear and most of us would take up darts, porn, watching pro wrestling, poker or just drinking ourselves to death.

So, should we just giggle and say, "Those Meucci's, they often need repairing."

Just how much does Meucci cost the billiard industry?

The Woim
 
I had a customer today with a brand new one he paid $600 for....the forearm was entirely plastic and lifted off the table 1/4" as it rolled...and the blk dot shaft was clearly cracked 1" between the laminations, going completely through the shaft to the other side. I actually felt horrible when he asked me to "be honest". :(
 
Kelly_Guy said:
You seem to be a bit defensive. If you like the way your cues play, good all over you, they probably play quite fine. Nobody has said every Meucci ever made plays bad. Nobody has suggested you should change your taste or throw away your cues.

The thread is about them moving overseas, and about the decline of what once was the premier name in cues. There were many pro players using Meccui cues for a long time. Bob Meucci knew how to make a great cue and really knew how to market them. The popularity and production outran their quality control. They were making so many cues, the individual products and their customer service suffered. The reputation started to suffer. Instead of tightening the quality control, they started putting more plastics into the cues, and Bob started touting machines that showed why dots on shafts made the cues play better. Then there was the power piston, and another colored dot. Then there was a partial bankruptcy.

The problems with many of the cues straight out of the box, the problems with customer service, including loss of cues and money from customers (some people resorted to catching up with Bob personally at a cue show), and the fact that many long time dealers of the cues had to completely stop selling the cues is a matter of record.

Kelly
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?????? Where does my post say anything about me liking Meuccis?
I was responding to a guy who liked his Meucci. I've got a 25
year old Meucci that I used to love, but I've heard they're
terrible anymore.
 
Production and Cheap Production???

Do people feel as negitively about the more expensive production ones? say $700+ ones? have these gone down hill as much?

Also curious how much difference does adding say 314 shaft make to a Meucci in your humble opinons???
 
Most league players in our area aspire to one day own a Meucci :) Seriously though Meucci kept us repair guys busy with their ferrules for the longest time. I buy and sell a lot of used cues here at the room and when ever I get an older Meucci in the first thing I do is put a threaded capped ferrule on it. The older Meucci's in my opinion hit better and were just plain made better, Ever since the 97 line came out the quality has seemed to go down hill and their warranties are not very good. I wish they would stand behind their product better, if they did I would still stock them.
 
Heckler said:
Also curious how much difference does adding say 314 shaft make to a Meucci in your humble opinons???
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Thats easy....the difference is that it makes a poor quality cue play better. Same as a set of Bilstein shocks will make a poor quality auto ride better...but in the end...you know what you have no matter how you dress it. :)
 
The Woim said:
:cool:

Meucci's have always been subpar pool cues. And today, well, I'm not one to criticize a fool and how he separates himself from his money... :cool:

You'll never catch The Woim playing with a Meucci or any production cue. I've said it before and I'll say it again, if you have the requisite amount of self respect than you will see that playing this gentleman's parlor room board game literally demands that you buy a custom cue.

Lots of great custom cue makers out there in the $350-$900 range. Unless you're homeless, you have no excuse to not own a custom cue. No excuse at all. Get out a credit card. Sell the extra car that's always parked in the back yard. Cash in your IRA or a CD. Reach into the cookie jar where you stash all those crisp $100 bills...

Do whatever it takes but do it. Buy a custom cue today as your token of love for the game of pool.

I understand the point of view of the other posters who are rationalizing their ownership of Meucci cues. I even agree that someone could mistakenly believe that an inexpensive production cue plays well enough for serious pool. Those men can believe in the tooth fairy if they want, I won't complain. But you'll never catch The Woim ever playing with a production cue.

Blackjack said Meucci's are firewood. Nope, they're not. Your house will really stick if you put that plastic on the fire on a cold November night...

:D

Will you just buy a custom cue and stop being in denial about your [Meucci, Joss, Predator, Schon, Viking, Peschaur, Falcon, Fury, Cuetech, Player, etc]

The Woim
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I gotta say that while this post is full of holes the biggest is putting Schon in the same category as Player, Fury, Falcon, Cuetech, and Meucci.

I guess these guys don't know what they are doing.

Alex Pagulayan
Shannon Daulton
Ronnie Wiseman

All of them play or played with Schon cues for years without any sponsorship deal. Can't say as I have ever seen a Player, Fury, Falcon, Cuetech, or Meucci sell for more than they retailed for on the used market. Just about any R series Schon does that easily.

I have owned South West, Tad, Gilbert, Stacey, Mottey, Tascarella, Prewitt, Scruggs, Black, Stroud and a few others. I have owned a ton of Schon's and as far as playability for me they rank right up there with the best of them.

Since I have fell into the photography/video pit of addiction I am out of the custom cue game. I play with a custom Sneaky made by a guy none of you has heard of and I like it just fine but it sure is not the same as any of the above cues. Its good but not the same. Just my opinion.

For those who appreciate the difference I think it matters. For those who don't know or don't care it doesn't. Pretty simple.
 
NineBallNut said:
That is just absolutely not true. I have played with many meucci's from back in the day. They were built good and played great. If one can get there hands on an original, then they will be happy. I had to stop selling them in my store last year do to many quality issues that were left unresolved. One cue I sent back three times due to warpage.. not just a little either... and they sent me one back the forth time that was warped both in the butt and shaft. That was the last chance for them in my store.
Click to expand...


I agree. I got mine about 25 years ago through Cornhusker
Billiards and it was like getting a custom cue. It took Bob
Meucci 3 months to have it ready for me.
Still has original tip & ferrule, still straight as an arrow, and
still looks nice. And I played with it for years until I discovered
Tim Scruggs.
 
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