She does her job very well. She is able to incorporate her natural ability with what she has learned.
That is harder to do than it sounds!
Pros not telling you everything.....
- Thread starter PistolPat
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She does her job very well. She is able to incorporate her natural ability with what she has learned.
That is harder to do than it sounds!
LOL...it aint rocket science fellas...it's not even about math..
Hahahahah....First thing is...finding a pro that's gonna pass the knowledge ( NOT EASY ) Mike Dechaine tried getting Shane to share his secret for breaking and SHANE wouldnt give it up for anything...Looks like Mikey is gonna have to watch a lot of Accustats videos. Theres a reason a lot of us arent at that level and it's because we don't even possess the knowedge so that we may get there. Some say there is NO secret...well hot damn...then THEY must play at a pros level and beyond if there is no more knowledge for them to gain from playing. Wish I knew that much..well you know what? Ask me anything..if it's anything about pool, that's one my brother knows
Hahahahah....First thing is...finding a pro that's gonna pass the knowledge ( NOT EASY ) Mike Dechaine tried getting Shane to share his secret for breaking and SHANE wouldnt give it up for anything...Looks like Mikey is gonna have to watch a lot of Accustats videos. Theres a reason a lot of us arent at that level and it's because we don't even possess the knowedge so that we may get there. Some say there is NO secret...well hot damn...then THEY must play at a pros level and beyond if there is no more knowledge for them to gain from playing. Wish I knew that much..well you know what? Ask me anything..if it's anything about pool, that's one my brother knows
No matter how talented you are, you have to practice a lot. If you get some good hint and coaching from the very beginning it will be easier.
One guy who was honest when he got the question, "Can you tach me how to play?". Just said "No, you have talent and, if I teach you. Then you might beat me."
One guy who was honest when he got the question, "Can you tach me how to play?". Just said "No, you have talent and, if I teach you. Then you might beat me."
Why would we expect them too?
Do you think pros in other sports like golf share their secrets with amatuers? Of course not! Shanes break is his bread and butter! He probably has spent hundreds of hours working on it, so why would he just give someone the knowledge just so they can learn in seconds what he spent hours learn? I work very hard on my game and I can't play at near thier level, but if an open level or pro sees that you are truely committed they will throw you a bone every now and then. I practice every Sunday side by side in the same room with an open level player and after about 5 months he started giving me a little help here and there.
But they will not waste thier time with bangers and will not also give competion ammo to beat them. Are there secrets yes, but some of the stuff is so deep that without time at the table, most players wouldn't understand anyway. Some stuff you have to get for yourself and that stuff will stick with you forever.
Do you think pros in other sports like golf share their secrets with amatuers? Of course not! Shanes break is his bread and butter! He probably has spent hundreds of hours working on it, so why would he just give someone the knowledge just so they can learn in seconds what he spent hours learn? I work very hard on my game and I can't play at near thier level, but if an open level or pro sees that you are truely committed they will throw you a bone every now and then. I practice every Sunday side by side in the same room with an open level player and after about 5 months he started giving me a little help here and there.
But they will not waste thier time with bangers and will not also give competion ammo to beat them. Are there secrets yes, but some of the stuff is so deep that without time at the table, most players wouldn't understand anyway. Some stuff you have to get for yourself and that stuff will stick with you forever.
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The pros of 30-40 years ago were very secretive about their knowledge for fear of the same being used against them when it was either in a tournament or matching up.
Today's Pros seem to feel they have a Talent that cannot be learned. They freely critique lower ranked pros about flaws in their games.
As far as telling secrets... well we were asked not to repeat any of them. Aiming is just a small part of the game. PRESSURE is the toughest part to learn.
Today's Pros seem to feel they have a Talent that cannot be learned. They freely critique lower ranked pros about flaws in their games.
As far as telling secrets... well we were asked not to repeat any of them. Aiming is just a small part of the game. PRESSURE is the toughest part to learn.
If only i knew the secrets, i could break like Shane and play like Efren!
Nope, I agree with the person you responded to. The person with more talent.
Earl was not a world beater because of knowledge, he was a world beater because he has a gigantic amount of natural talent. Alex Pagulayan was exactly the same when he came close to being THE most domninant player on the planet. Neither of those guys showed huge knowledge that no other pros had access to, what they showed was huge amounts of talent and heart, which are the two main keys WAY more important then knowledge TBH. Knowledge of what? How to aim? Someone with huge talent will figure that out fast on their own to a level you will NEVER reach via studying, sorry to burst your bubble. Trick style shots that might get used once a match? Those don't define world beaters either, all of the pro's know all of the shots that are needed to win, some simply make those shots alot better and more consistently then others.
I agree completely. I have actually taken a few lessons from a pro, and it was amazing the difference it made when he would pass on one of the "nuggets of information". These little nuggets were things if you weren't shown, it would have taken a lifetime to figure out. Amazing how easy it made to excecute something after you were told. I was in fact, told not to pass it on these little little bit of wisdom.
Actually, that was YOUR OWN FAULT, Pat. Step away from the situation, and look at it from a different angle. You *know* aiming system topics are "hard-wired" to go south, no matter how politely and civilly the OPs try to "frame" them. You know this.
Yet, you write, and I quote:
While I get your superficial point about the aiming system scenario "being only an example," you ARE alluding to, or demonstrating, the following:
1. That a particular aiming system is a secretive society (via the Hal Houle quote), and that because you took some instruction, you are now part of the secret society;
2. That you "possess" knowledge of "THE" (notice the use of caps) aiming system (implying it's the panacea -- the only one that matters) that is so perfect, that you can make "ANYTHING" (notice the use of caps) on the table -- to the point of "stealing." And, via that paragraph's opening sentence, you were instructed not to reveal anything. Sort of an Eddie Murphy-esque "I have some ice cream... wanna lick? PSYCHE!!" nyeh-nyeh statement.
You don't think the combination of these two obvious points is going to reignite some aiming system fires? Sorry to call you out, but your "woes of having your 'example' being misunderstood" are hollow, Pat.
-Sean
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there are no secrets, its a game of absolutes.
there are a given number of angles/contact points that will get a given ball to a given pocket, either you can reliably/repeatedly make that happen or you cant.
There is no magic. CTE does work for a large number of shots, but not all of them and is just another approximation system.
Keith McCready told me 10-12 years ago that it was real easy to play at his level, he said play 12 hours a day for a decade and you will be there.
I cant imagine how much pro's who lurk these forums laugh at these threads, thinking "you cant get better debating aiming systems on the internet, lol." It all comes down to table time, put in 12 hours a day and you will learn the secret.
there are a given number of angles/contact points that will get a given ball to a given pocket, either you can reliably/repeatedly make that happen or you cant.
There is no magic. CTE does work for a large number of shots, but not all of them and is just another approximation system.
Keith McCready told me 10-12 years ago that it was real easy to play at his level, he said play 12 hours a day for a decade and you will be there.
I cant imagine how much pro's who lurk these forums laugh at these threads, thinking "you cant get better debating aiming systems on the internet, lol." It all comes down to table time, put in 12 hours a day and you will learn the secret.
Hahahahah....First thing is...finding a pro that's gonna pass the knowledge ( NOT EASY ) Mike Dechaine tried getting Shane to share his secret for breaking and SHANE wouldnt give it up for anything...Looks like Mikey is gonna have to watch a lot of Accustats videos. Theres a reason a lot of us arent at that level and it's because we don't even possess the knowedge so that we may get there. Some say there is NO secret...well hot damn...then THEY must play at a pros level and beyond if there is no more knowledge for them to gain from playing. Wish I knew that much..well you know what? Ask me anything..if it's anything about pool, that's one my brother knows
Shanes Break blows my mind everytime I see him break , Personally I don't think there's a big secret to shanes break I think it's all about timing and mechanics , Just like Django's break they had an story on his break a few years ago and there's no secret to his break .
Unless the secret is kicking yourself in the back of the head with your foot on the followthrough. The reality is Bustamente puts a boatload more into the break then almost anyone else. His legs spring, he has a super long bridge and a very long final backstroke, he follows through well past the center of the table, AND he does all this with a truly absurd amount of control.
It is the same thing as a golf swing. There is no hidden secret to those hugely long drives some players can manage, the swings have been broken down to the most finite degree and anyone can access that knowledge. But despite it all being right there very few people have the ability to put that knowledge to use due to a lack of muscle memory, a lack of flexability, a lack of hand/eye coordination, a lack of the needed fast mucsle release needed to create a 150MPH+ club head speed, ect...
The break is no different at all. I know what Bustamente is doing there, I simply cannot do it. I am nowhere near as flexable as he is so the follow through is not going to be as complete. I have no chance of controling the white ball if I use that long of a bridge and have that much body motion into the shot and thus I am not going to hit the rack square like he still manages to do. Bustamente's break is an atheletic feat if there ever has been one in pool and just like not everyone has the ability within them to serve a tennis ball with the speed and accuracy that Federer does nor can everyone have the abiliity to break the balls like Busta does. Knowledge is pointless, even if you had it you STILL could not do it.
TheThaiger
Banned
Off topic slightly, but do pros/top players/anyone else have a method for making their opponent miss? I used to play a guy who would never lose, ever, and he had very limited ability. He told me once he had a technique for making his opponent miss, but refused to tell me what it was. I'm a much better player than him but found I missed the 8 ball every time I played him, even if they were over the pocket - I missed the ball entirely once, from about a foot away. It was as if I didn't see even see it - I was trance like.
I am used to playing very good players, and yes, I do choke quite often, but this was something different - I'm convinced this guy hit on system for making his opponent miss. He once held a table for 12 hours straight - winning at least 100 consecutive racks - and I repeat, he was a very limited player.
I am used to playing very good players, and yes, I do choke quite often, but this was something different - I'm convinced this guy hit on system for making his opponent miss. He once held a table for 12 hours straight - winning at least 100 consecutive racks - and I repeat, he was a very limited player.
There are no big secrets in pool. Maybe little things that some pros have learned that helped them here and there. There is no retirement plan or health insurance in being a professional pool player so if just one of the top pros really wanted to make some big bucks on a "secret" that would make us all great players they would just market it. The secret is execution the top pros do it and we dont plain and simple.
they woulndt even need to market it, it would instantly sell itself, which is why of course there are no major secrets. every top player that ever lived would have to have kept their mouth shut, even though every single one of then is dead broke. i think we all would have to agree on this. they can offer great mental advice though, not that it would apply to every player
Pros not telling
The first time I heard Backhand English mentioned was 1968 the next time I heard of it was on a Bert Kinnister tape.
They kept that a pretty good secret for 25 years.
I don't prescribe to the conspiracy ideas, just that the people who knew it didn't tell many people.
The first time I heard Backhand English mentioned was 1968 the next time I heard of it was on a Bert Kinnister tape.
They kept that a pretty good secret for 25 years.
I don't prescribe to the conspiracy ideas, just that the people who knew it didn't tell many people.
I think sfleinen and jcrack corn's posts make very good sense. I don't know any pros, so I can't say whether or not there is some secret society of knowledge (or whether it requires some secret decoder ring). The physics behind pool is simple, but mastering the game is any but. IMHO it's because there are many variables to control for (stroke fundamentals/repeatable, equipment: table variation, cue; infinite ball layouts; mental aspects: nerves, breathing, playing "smart" under pressure).
I think people who are in the elite category (at anything) are the best able to picture what they intend to do, and do it. In pool this includes solid stroke fundamentals, CB speed/english Example: break a game of 9-ball and plan the run from start to finish (to win or play a safe). An expert's actual play might match his intention by 90%, given an allowable small margin of error. The expert will plan the smartest, most efficient shots, while a lesser player might end up chasing the CB around the table a lot more. Experts have the experience to put their superior knowledge to its best use.
Football is on and I'm getting sidetracked. This post probably makes no sense or adds little value, but I might as well add it to the mess...
I think people who are in the elite category (at anything) are the best able to picture what they intend to do, and do it. In pool this includes solid stroke fundamentals, CB speed/english Example: break a game of 9-ball and plan the run from start to finish (to win or play a safe). An expert's actual play might match his intention by 90%, given an allowable small margin of error. The expert will plan the smartest, most efficient shots, while a lesser player might end up chasing the CB around the table a lot more. Experts have the experience to put their superior knowledge to its best use.
Football is on and I'm getting sidetracked. This post probably makes no sense or adds little value, but I might as well add it to the mess...