Saratoga......same crap...different year

M

mntnman

New member
Anyone going to the Saratoga WY tourney?
Just learned some tidbits from a friend in CO about what is happening in the Masters/Pro division again this year.
As everyone probably knows that the pros play with all us amatures. This year SVB, Rocket, Williams, Raj and a couple others will be there. Impressive!
What everyone doesnt probably know is that the tournament director pays their room and board while there, pays their entry and then seeds them away from each other to ensure they make the final 16. Once that happens, he seeds them away from each other again so they wont play one another til close to the semi-finals.
It's fine if he wants to do all this. It's his tourney. The fact that he doesnt state what he is doing as far as the seeding to the rest of the field is a bit decieving.
If he wants a pro exhibition, then put one on. Don't do it at the expense of the other 60 or so players who spend on average $300 for the weekend to come up there. At least tell us what you are doing.
Just my $.02
 
mntnman said:
Anyone going to the Saratoga WY tourney?
Just learned some tidbits from a friend in CO about what is happening in the Masters/Pro division again this year.
As everyone probably knows that the pros play with all us amatures. This year SVB, Rocket, Williams, Raj and a couple others will be there. Impressive!
What everyone doesnt probably know is that the tournament director pays their room and board while there, pays their entry and then seeds them away from each other to ensure they make the final 16. Once that happens, he seeds them away from each other again so they wont play one another til close to the semi-finals.
It's fine if he wants to do all this. It's his tourney. The fact that he doesnt state what he is doing as far as the seeding to the rest of the field is a bit decieving.
If he wants a pro exhibition, then put one on. Don't do it at the expense of the other 60 or so players who spend on average $300 for the weekend to come up there. At least tell us what you are doing.
Just my $.02
Click to expand...

Imagine that.......another disgruntled poolplayer.

Some people won't care about this TD's decisions, but some will. It's the fact that top players are treated with entitlement is part of what make pro pool languish.

I hope you've got your facts straight.......and......hold on to your seat!!!

Maniac
 
Maniac said:
Imagine that.......another disgruntled poolplayer.

Some people won't care about this TD's decisions, but some will. It's the fact that top players are treated with entitlement is part of what make pro pool languish.

I hope you've got your facts straight.......and......hold on to your seat!!!

Maniac
Click to expand...

You said " hold on to your seat "...snicker...snicker..agh.haha...yeeeaahh..lol.
 
I guess I don't see the problem. IMHO amateurs will have a better chance of playing with a pro if the pros don't eliminate each other in the early rounds. Of course, this assumes that one of the reasons amateurs attend the event is to have the chance to play with a pro.

Will the amateur play a couple fewer matches than he would otherwise? Sure, but I'd rather play one match with SVB (even if I only get to take 10 strokes the entire match :D) and one with Johnny Archer, even if it means I only play 4 matches instead of 6.

I can understand there's a problem if playing with the pros isn't a motivation for attending the event.

It's a moot point since I can't attend the event. I'm busy playing golf with Tiger Woods that weekend.
 
Come on guys, isn't this the event where all of Charlie's players agreed in advance (and in public) they would split the money earned by all of them? They essentially played for the trophy. Is there something wrong with that or am I being too picky?

OP, I agree with you. Guess it's why Mike Zuglan fills every Turning Stone field.

Maniac, agree with your comment about why pro pool languishes. Bill it as an exhibition. Then, who cares how they slice the pie.

Lyn
 
I don't see a prob with what the Td is doing but it should be billed as a seeded tourney.

Thanks for letting us know about the seeding.
 
I refuse to attend that tourney every year for the exact reasons mentioned. I as an amateur relish the opportunity to run into a world class player in a tournament. Obviously, I hope to run into one later in a tournament than earlier. But to have to beat two or three in a row once you've reached that later round is crap, especially when you look at the brackets and see that every one of them came from a different part of the bracket. One of the other things I like about a tourney is the opportunity to watch two world class players facing eachother in early rounds, and it doesn't happen up there. That tourney has been wired for Charlie and his crew to take it all.

dave
 
Tokyo-dave said:
I refuse to attend that tourney every year for the exact reasons mentioned. I as an amateur relish the opportunity to run into a world class player in a tournament. Obviously, I hope to run into one later in a tournament than earlier. But to have to beat two or three in a row once you've reached that later round is crap, especially when you look at the brackets and see that every one of them came from a different part of the bracket. One of the other things I like about a tourney is the opportunity to watch two world class players facing eachother in early rounds, and it doesn't happen up there. That tourney has been wired for Charlie and his crew to take it all.

dave
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You should have been at Felt today. It was great. Nick Varner doing trick shots and challenge matches. Junior tournament and a $500 added bar table tournament.And I was there playing .50 on the 5 and 9 with a few of the guys. I walked out with a pocket full of quarters.
Measureman likes a good score.:thumbup:
 
Nick Varner did a 3 hour exhibition down here in the Springs Wednesday night. I almost went to felt today but with all the snow and roads closed here it would have taken me about 3 hours to get there
 
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BryanB said:
Nick Varner was did a 3 hour exhibition down here in the Springs Wednesday night. I almost went to felt today but with all the snow and roads closed here it would have taken me about 3 hours to get there
Click to expand...

He does some pretty basic trick shots but mixes in some pretty funny humor that makes it very good.
How did you like the ones with the silver dollar? That was new to me and I've been watching this stuff for 50 years. I ran out to the table and bet 25 cents on that one. Got a laugh from the peanut gallery and he called me "Diamond Jim". All the the money went to the junior pool program.
 
Maniac said:
I hope you've got your facts straight.......and......hold on to your seat!!!

Maniac
Click to expand...

He doesn't "have" to have the facts completely right. He is probably a member already and created a new screen name so he could post it without getting flack. :smile: No big deal though, I can see both sides of the story and don't have an interest either way. On one hand, it sucks that the am. players feel like they are getting treated like filler and have longer odds of getting deep into the money. On the other hand, it is incentive to get pros to attend the tournament and helps draw spectators and those players who want the chance to play top players. Hopefully it is a good tournament and noone feels screwed when it is all over.
 
mntnman said:
Anyone going to the Saratoga WY tourney?
Just learned some tidbits from a friend in CO about what is happening in the Masters/Pro division again this year.
As everyone probably knows that the pros play with all us amatures. This year SVB, Rocket, Williams, Raj and a couple others will be there. Impressive!
What everyone doesnt probably know is that the tournament director pays their room and board while there, pays their entry and then seeds them away from each other to ensure they make the final 16. Once that happens, he seeds them away from each other again so they wont play one another til close to the semi-finals.
It's fine if he wants to do all this. It's his tourney. The fact that he doesnt state what he is doing as far as the seeding to the rest of the field is a bit decieving.
If he wants a pro exhibition, then put one on. Don't do it at the expense of the other 60 or so players who spend on average $300 for the weekend to come up there. At least tell us what you are doing.
Just my $.02
Click to expand...
If this is true,then its almost partially rigged.Prime example of why pool
never progresses.They want the ameteurs money but want the pros to win it.
 
Tokyo-dave said:
I refuse to attend that tourney every year for the exact reasons mentioned. I as an amateur relish the opportunity to run into a world class player in a tournament. Obviously, I hope to run into one later in a tournament than earlier. But to have to beat two or three in a row once you've reached that later round is crap, especially when you look at the brackets and see that every one of them came from a different part of the bracket. One of the other things I like about a tourney is the opportunity to watch two world class players facing eachother in early rounds, and it doesn't happen up there. That tourney has been wired for Charlie and his crew to take it all.

dave
Click to expand...

Iam Sure it was Charlie himself that recommened the tournament to be run this way, just thank if the TD dont listen then there are no pros that show up and then no business in the stands!
 
Openly seeding the pros is acceptable, to me.

Fixing the draw is not.
 
That's the jest of it. Without the other 60 player and their $9600 he wouldn't be able to draw the pros so they had a payday.
I personally wont play but if he would just tell the field upfront what he is doing then there could be no illusion of unfairness. The fact that he wont post it on flyers or the facebook page for the tourney shows that he knows its borderline and would hurt turnout.
 
Saratoga

I agree with Lou.

And these other pros are getting their name dirty - and may not even realize it.

It is a shame. It is one of the things that just keeps pool it the tank.

And all of this crap just makes it a lot harder on the legitimate promoters.

I actually dislike being termed a promoter - I just try to make pool better. The term 'promoter' sound a little too 'slick' and self serving.

Mark Griffin
 
Mark Griffin said:
I actually dislike being termed a promoter - I just try to make pool better. The term 'promoter' sound a little too 'slick' and self serving.

Mark Griffin
Click to expand...

Too Don King-ish, eh???

I agree with Mark, and Lou, and the others with the same sentiment.

Maniac
 
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