Shame on you guys

I love TAR, they are great guys that willing to give for this game so much, i know that.. but the thing is, i'd rather watch DVDs at my friends poolhall than watching pool infront of my PC to be honest.. also i love watchin pool at the TV. so yea we don't watch it live throught computer.. but we might buy them in the future to view them on tv no? just like how we do it back in the accu-stats, i remember watching them as video tapes :) all of them.. god bless accu-stats . pat-flaming . billy incardona
 
yobagua said:
I am not putting regular folks on the spot. But folks who post on AZ Billiards forum who continually comment on the state about the billiard industry. Who complain about Kevin Trudeau, about Don Mackee, about a Jay Helfert Event, about why the indutry is in such a state its in. It is going to take commitment to improve it. And the guys from TAR is doing an extraordinary thing.

We cant complain about the prize money in other sports like golf if we cant support a $15 12 hour PPV. Golf people spend thousands to be on the same course as their pros, football and basketball fans spend thousands of dollars on tickets to their events. They are proud of that fact. Im saying that on the free days there are 4 times the amount of people on the PPV day. JCIN told me there were 33 paid people on that day. That is a SHAME. I for one am tired of hearing pool people who have all kinds of criticism of why pool is not considered a top rate sport and yet dont want to make the financial commitment to support it. I am not talking to Katrina victims. Im not asking them but for those that go to a pool hall every day and lay down $30 or $40 to think of their priorities and what is going to support their passions. THose guys who think nothing of buying that $1200 cue for their COLLECTION.

THis event took a lot of work. Big Nasty drove all the way from South Dakota carrying the equipment. JUstin flew in early to set it up. Hotel and food had to be paid for. You cant just reap the rewards and not help sow the field. I would feel SHAME if I did that.

The guys from TAR would never come on here and ***** and neither would Mark Griffin. THey have too much class. But someone needs to make it known that they need our utmost support.
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TapTapTap!!!

You are right on the money with this whole thread. Shame is the right word. Listen up folks and put your money where your mouth is or in the future just keep you mouth shut about the state of pool. You don't get to have an opinion if you don't pay your dues. Such are the rules of life. No excuses. Do the right thing or just stfu and go pout. If you're buying stuff from TAR then you ARE doing your part.... doesn't matter if it's DVD's or PPV but if you aren't paying them for their services you should feel shame. If you don't then you just don't have integrity.
 
I can only speak from my own perspective.
I'll never watch a pool match on my monitor. A 5 minute clip yeah, but a match never. I've bought TAR's dvds and were satisfied with them, though at this point I'd never put them in the same category as Accu-stats. They are producing a product, possibly more out of love of the game than anything else, but, nevertheless, if somebody doesn't like the product they shouldn't be "shamed" for not buying it.
 
Johnnyt said:
When its free everyone has time to watch. Go figure. Johnnyt
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I agree, I purchased every TAR feed except the women's Derby all-around and was not always able to watch every second of the events. I purchased last nights and could not watch from work but I watched several great matches last night. I agree this it is sad that 200 plus people have time for the free feed and only 40 or so have time for the PPV. The cost is like two hours of table time.

-don
 
TAR, da bomb!

cajunbarboxplyr said:
beleive me my friend I am not agianst you on this.....I totally agree with you.. I was jsut laying my thoughts out.......

oh and I wasnt meaning that YOU were putting peeps on the spot..... I was jsut speaking in general...... no harm done or intended
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Tap tap, you are right. Justin and Chad will take care of you. Communicate with them and I guarantee that they will make it right!!!
 
JimS said:
TapTapTap!!!

You are right on the money with this whole thread. Shame is the right word. Listen up folks and put your money where your mouth is or in the future just keep you mouth shut about the state of pool. You don't get to have an opinion if you don't pay your dues. Such are the rules of life. No excuses. Do the right thing or just stfu and go pout. If you're buying stuff from TAR then you ARE doing your part.... doesn't matter if it's DVD's or PPV but if you aren't paying them for their services you should feel shame. If you don't then you just don't have integrity.
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This thread is absolutely ridiculous. Like a good number of ppl here (maybe even most) I've been shooting pool for a long while (17yrs. in my case). That's how I've paid my dues, period. It's also how I've earnt the right to an opinion. What I choose to buy and when I choose to buy it is no one's business but my own. We all have a right to spend our money and our time however we choose to. Reminding ppl about the DVDs and PPV is a great idea (and a service to the forum), trying to shame ppl into buying them is not.
 
av84fun said:
Well, I'm not sure that "shame on you" was the most positive way to lead off your plea for support.

Sure, it's frustrating but almost everything about pro pool matches is frustrating.

How many times have you watched world champions in matches where there were clearly less than 50 people in the stands...even at BCA Vegas tournaments when there are thousands of ACTIVE pool players in the building?

The obvious fundamental is that very, very few people in America care to spend their time and MONEY watching pool matches.

In a free market economy, it is up to the product/service provider to recognize meaningful demand and then present themselves to the market in a way that would encourage people to spend their money.

Say what you will, but daytime, weekday broadcasts would require the vast majority of the potential audience to sneek around at their workplaces trying to watch what they can while the boss isn't looking.

For free...people will "tune in" when they can but for money, they won't.

Pretty obvious really and not the least bit shameful.

Bottom line...not many care to watch. Even "majors" FINALS, like the BCA only draw a half million households across the entire U.S. population and the pool forums that TAR primarily markets through have a tiny audience compared to the whole population.

IMHO, their business model should be building a DVD library. Accu-Stats can't be everywhere. And the live feeds would be a "loss leader" marketing tool to build awareness of the library.

Just my $0.02.

Regards,
Jim
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I agree with this 100%. But on top of it.. I spend more time at a pool hall by far than at home. They have 9 plasma tv's there and usually one of them has pool on it. So while I'm there playing pool I can also watch pool on tv when it's not my turn.

It seems like a catch 22 honestly.. You're targeting pool players (which generally go out and play pool often) to watch an online live feed (which would require someone a: not go out to play pool and b: pay for it even tho it's a small cost). Thats really hard. At least dvds can be watched when someone has time.

As far as the 200 vs 40 goes.. if you dont think you will be able to watch much of something but its free you'll tune in anyway for the chance you might get to.. but paying for it without being able to have the time to really get into it wont happen as much. The ratio seems fairly accurate.

And trying to guilt someone into paying for ANYTHING is just stupid. Theres a thing called marketing for a reason.

ALTHOUGH THIS ENTIRE THREAD IS STILL PUBLICITY FOR THEM :)
 
I just wanted to say how much I enjoyed the ppv last night. They had a couple of minor problems early on but it seemed to clear up and seeing that 10 ball finals was special. I think the breaker lost in the first 10 games or so. Right after that Scott and Shane in a 9 ball match. Scott F. played a near perfect set with only one or two errors, yet still lost. Before that Steve M. vs. Cliff J. was special to me for personal reasons. Just wanted to report how much I enjoyed it. I'm certainly not qualified to start blasting anybody about anything. I like to watch the cheap ppv's to see if I want to order a dvd. Thanks TAR.... Well worth it....
 
Here is my take on this. I don't fault anyone for not buying a mid-week pay per view. Most people work and cannot watch it. The prime time last night is a little different in that most people could have paid. During the Derby City there were over 1000 viewers at some times for the free feed and the numbers for Reno's free feed are way more than the PPV also. I personally have bought every PPV that TAR has had even though I didn't get to watch a couple of them or went to bed early. To be honest, $15-$25 means nothing to me. I spend that much going back and forth to the bathroom. I am also in a position where I can watch at work. It would probably be different though if I was living paycheck to paycheck and needed my kids to eat.
That being said, there are a lot of people on here that gripe and complain about the sad state of American pool that have the means to pony up a measly $15 that don't. I think of one specific individual whom I won't name that use to gripe daily about the "American Pool" scene and she has seen ONE PPV that was purchased FOR her. In my opinion these are the people that should feel shame for not practicing what they preach. IMO


Edit: 1700th post, lol.
 
I bought a DVD (shane vs. alex) but I doubt I'll ever buy the live PPV unless I know for a fact I will be around for it. I'll probably keep buying the dvds until I have them all, but I can't afford to buy them all at once :)
 
I havent been able to watch this week. Too busy with work and family. I have bought every feed they had prior to this, and even was involved in staking a player for one of the TAR matches that they did a PPV for.

Right now pool is not my highest priority. I will get back into it one day, just not today.
 
cubc said:
I agree with this 100%. But on top of it.. I spend more time at a pool hall by far than at home. They have 9 plasma tv's there and usually one of them has pool on it. So while I'm there playing pool I can also watch pool on tv when it's not my turn.

It seems like a catch 22 honestly.. You're targeting pool players (which generally go out and play pool often) to watch an online live feed (which would require someone a: not go out to play pool and b: pay for it even tho it's a small cost). Thats really hard. At least dvds can be watched when someone has time.

As far as the 200 vs 40 goes.. if you dont think you will be able to watch much of something but its free you'll tune in anyway for the chance you might get to.. but paying for it without being able to have the time to really get into it wont happen as much. The ratio seems fairly accurate.

And trying to guilt someone into paying for ANYTHING is just stupid. Theres a thing called marketing for a reason.

ALTHOUGH THIS ENTIRE THREAD IS STILL PUBLICITY FOR THEM :)
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Thanks...and I agree with you that this whole guilt thing is ridiculous and counter-productive. If I were TAR, I would come on here and beg people not to take that tack.

Yes, this thread is publicity...but Enron and Worldcom got a lot of that too!
(-:
Regards,
Jim

PS: For clarity, I am pulling for TAR and will likely buy several of their DVDs.
 
yobagua said:
As of today before the finals TAR has only 33 buyers. Where are all you guys who say TAR is great!!!!???
If we dont support them they might disappear. There was some great matches today. Shane vs Montel, Luat vs Gabe, and now Luat vs Montel. Take your $15 and give them your money. Is it much to ask. Dont be a freeloader and just watch the free stuff. Support these guys, now!!!!!!! Dont be a nit!!!!!
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Personally, I don't think this approach will work, but I could be wrong.

By the way, I didn't watch any of the free stuff this time around, but I was wondering... did the people in the booth promote the PPV's a little more?

I think calling people nits and freeloaders is just going to turn them off and make them ignore you, but perhaps highlighting the great things about TAR and stressing that they need to be supported in order to keep going, hopefully that will help. Especially from the booth during the free stuff, when you know that people are listening.

I think the worst thing you could do would be to piss people off and make them want to even stop watching the free stuff. Look at it this way, if they got enough viewers only watching the freebies, maybe TAR could get some sponsorships and plug those sponsors during the free streams.

Do we want to send the message that, if you know you're not going to buy the PPV, that you shouldn't even watch the free stuff?

For the record, not that anyone should have to defend themselves, but although I didn't watch anything this time around, I have bought PPV's and DVD's from TAR in the past and I will buy more in the future.
 
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poolhustler said:
I ordered and PAID for a DVD, never got it.

Hows that for a donation?? lol

Russ.......
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Russ, just email TAR. It must have been some kind of error or delay. They'll definitely take care of you. I had an issue and they helped me right away after I contacted them; good customer service.
 
Its not about guilt. You dont have it. You dont have it. But its like welching on a bet. Hundreds of people will get on and castigate a guy for welching on a bet or criticize a pool event or cue maker for this and that. Thats all free. But when it comes down to putting money where your mouth is a lot of people clam up. Its the old woofing and hollering but are you going to get down? Lot of people are willing to go off on Bucktooth and live their lives vicariously through Fatboys adventure. Thats free. BUt how do you think these two men got to where they got? But by being participants.

Im not speaking to the poor and indigent. Im speaking to the pool fan that has disposable income. Income you use for fun things. Like Beer, Cigarettes, a collectible cue, a sweat bet, etc. Im asking you to think of your priorities. THis is one chance when you can stop being a railbird and become a participant. When it is good for your benefit and mine.
 
TAR is the only guys I know who will call me at home right away if there is a problem with my DVD order. I had a zip code mistake and they took care of it inside of 3 minutes. WHere else do you get this kind of service? PM them and Im sure when they get back from Reno they fix it up right away. Dont forget its virtually a 2 man operation.
 
yobagua said:
Its not about guilt. You dont have it. You dont have it. But its like welching on a bet. Hundreds of people will get on and castigate a guy for welching on a bet or criticize a pool event or cue maker for this and that. Thats all free. But when it comes down to putting money where your mouth is a lot of people clam up. Its the old woofing and hollering but are you going to get down? Lot of people are willing to go off on Bucktooth and live their lives vicariously through Fatboys adventure. Thats free. BUt how do you think these two men got to where they got? But by being participants.

Im not speaking to the poor and indigent. Im speaking to the pool fan that has disposable income. Income you use for fun things. Like Beer, Cigarettes, a collectible cue, a sweat bet, etc. Im asking you to think of your priorities. THis is one chance when you can stop being a railbird and become a participant. When it is good for your benefit and mine.
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Good post here. The bet welching scenario is more black and white, but I understand what you're saying. In some individual cases, the shoe may fit. It's a little subjective and we all need to look within ourselves and decide for ourselves if we are behaving as nits and freeloaders.

So why don't we all just ask ourselves, am I being a nit? Am I looking for a free ride off the blood and sweat of TAR? Can I kick down a couple of bucks for a good cause? Will I miss it if they fade away?

Like you are saying, now is the time to step up if you can. Buy a PPV if you can afford it, try out a DVD if you love pool. Need a present for someone? How about a TAR T-shirt.

Not everyone will decide that it's worth it, or that they want it. Just because you didn't buy this PPV, doesn't mean you did something wrong, but we should each take a moment and decide for ourselves what we want to do to support these guys.
 
Cuebacca said:
Good post here. The bet welching scenario is more black and white, but I understand what you're saying. In some individual cases, the shoe may fit. It's a little subjective and we all need to look within ourselves and decide for ourselves if we are behaving as nits and freeloaders.

So why don't we all just ask ourselves, am I being a nit? Am I looking for a free ride off the blood and sweat of TAR? Can I kick down a couple of bucks for a good cause? Will I miss it if they fade away?

Like you are saying, now is the time to step up if you can. Buy a PPV if you can afford it, try out a DVD if you love pool. Need a present for someone? How about a TAR T-shirt.

Not everyone will decide that it's worth it, or that they want it. Just because you didn't buy this PPV, doesn't mean you did something wrong, but we should each take a moment and decide for ourselves what we want to do to support these guys.
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If that can be the outcome of this thread than I agree. Its not TAR's approach but solely mine.
 
Yobe Baby

Lighten up buddy. I have spent a whole week at the US Open and only watched a couple of matches. I don't think I have even watched a whole set while there. I didn't even watch my stake-horse win the damn tournament. I just don't like to WATCH pool very much. I did purchase the Schmidt / Harriman matches and was bored to death. Not that it wasn't great pool.
I am thinking that if the interaction between the players could add a lot to it. I would like to hear more of them and see more of their personalities. I am not sure if I would watch then. For TAR's sake, I hope there arn't a lot of players like me. I wish them all the best and moocho success.
JMHO, Purdman
 
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yobagua said:
Its not about guilt. You dont have it. You dont have it. But its like welching on a bet. Hundreds of people will get on and castigate a guy for welching on a bet or criticize a pool event or cue maker for this and that. Thats all free. But when it comes down to putting money where your mouth is a lot of people clam up. Its the old woofing and hollering but are you going to get down? Lot of people are willing to go off on Bucktooth and live their lives vicariously through Fatboys adventure. Thats free. BUt how do you think these two men got to where they got? But by being participants.
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I'm unable to see the parallel between publicly criticizing someone who doesn't pay their debts and purchasing the PPV feed from TAR. Yes, in the case of this forum, public discussion is free.* Is that to say, then, that people who do not purchase the PPV feed from TAR should not be allowed to participate in this forum?

* Not counting the cost of an internet connection.
 
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