should I feel bad?

It depends. In my BCA league you must watch the table. If your opponent fouls, it is up to you to spot it. If you don't he has no obligation to tell you anything. I haven't played anything but BCA league, and that is the rule. Everyone is aware of this rule, so people watch their matches very closely.
With that said, if I was playing in more casual league, or for that matter playing an individual one on one, I would be honest, and hand him the ball.
 
Integrity = Call your own Foul

Integrity = Call your own Foul.

If you want this sport to strive, Play it like it is supposed to be played (FAIR!)

Their is nothing worse than being cheated like I was. I was playing in a Tri-State Tournament @ Castle Billiards,
When my opponet Mike Harrington Fouled. Since I didn't want to Shark him I stayed in my seat without view of the shot.
Also if I had moved out of the chair it could have been called Concession.
So after he fouled I had no idea until another Tournament player Mike Zimmy
& a couple of spectators told me after the Match.

So please call your own fouls :-)

torgy2 said:
I was playing in my scotch doubles summer league last night and my

partner had left me hooked to where i had to kick at one of our balls but

clearly hit the other teams ball first and fouled but i didnt say any thing

and just went and sat in my chair and waited for the other team to shoot.

I guess they were to busy talking to eachother and they didnt notice the

foul or even care to ask if it was a foul and they just shot. Should I have

said something since they werent paying attention or did what i did and

just not say anything?

What would you have done?

Thanks
Click to expand...
 
I miscued once...in a league match...and didn't get a rail...

The opposing team wasn't watching...they were all partying and taking shots...and BS-ing.

I didn't tell them...(they were killing us, anyway)

But one of the other bystanders from another team, told them...after the match was over (I lost anyway)...and I was asked about it...I explained the miscue and no rail...

Overall, I had to eat crow because I didn't speak up...(felt guilty as hell)
My team says "screw them" they should be paying attention.
And at the end of it all, I still felt guilty ever since.

It falls under "Good Sportsmanship"...
It's Best to Tell them.
I will Tell Them, from now on...as I don't like the feeling it left me with.
 
I am a firm believer that people have a responsibilty to pay attention to a competitive game. None the less, I still feel that I would need to tell them if I foul.
 
torgy2 said:
i didnt call it cuz i feel thats its not really cheating or anything because its

not my fault that they were more concerned about their conversation then

the game and its not my resposibility to call fouls that they miss when

they are supposed to be watching the game. As long

as there isnt any real cheating going on ( moving balls around by hand or

pocketing balls by hand) im starting to think that the opposing player(s)

should call fouls. But thats just me lol
Click to expand...

LOL - seems to be the attitude of the majority today....why take responsibility?! I mean, heck I was just going 50 mph in a school zone, wasn't like I was knocking over a bank, or killing someone. It was a little white lie, not a REAL lie, or .... nevermind, do what you like, you have to live with it, and if you can; so be it.

Bobby Jones called a foul on himself in a US Open playoff. He told the marshalls about it, and they said that neither they, his opponent, or the gallery saw the infraction....was he sure that the ball moved? It was completely up to him. He took the penalty and lost the tournament by 1 stroke. He could have said nothing, and just hit the ball (just like you had a seat and said nothing), but I don't think he could have dealt with knowing he had cheated. BTW, he was/is forever known as THE greatest ambassador of the game (of golf) and a TRUE gentleman. Lots of folks couldn't care less that others would think that of them, but it was to him, and in my opinion, a high honor, and something to strive for - ALWAYS.
 
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jwe711 said:
I miscued once...in a league match...and didn't get a rail...

The opposing team wasn't watching...they were all partying and taking shots...and BS-ing.

I didn't tell them...(they were killing us, anyway)

But one of the other bystanders from another team, told them...after the match was over (I lost anyway)...and I was asked about it...I explained the miscue and no rail...

Overall, I had to eat crow because I didn't speak up...(felt guilty as hell)
My team says "screw them" they should be paying attention.
And at the end of it all, I still felt guilty ever since.

It falls under "Good Sportsmanship"...
It's Best to Tell them.
I will Tell Them, from now on...as I don't like the feeling it left me with.
Click to expand...

Good on you. You took away from the situation exactly what you should have. We all make mistakes, if we don't learn from them we are bound to repeat them.
 
Neil said:
I'm not going to reward them for not paying attention on obvious fouls. You snooze, you lose in cases like that.
Click to expand...

I snipped just these two lines to ask a question....

How is you committing a FOUL, them not seeing it, and you admitting said foul REWARDING them? I've read other posts saying there are rules stating it's a team's responsibility to call fouls on an opponent (know idea about that, I've always let my opponent know, even in league), but saying you are rewarding them for admitting that you FOULED seems like a bit of a stretch. If my opponent is due BIH, and I don't let him/her know I'd be getting over on him/her, so I can't be rewarding them by letting them know. Don't get me wrong, I watch guys cheat every week in golf league, and I don't say a thing. What's really funny is when they say how well they played, when I know I could add 4-5 strokes to their score if they had played by the rules....so I know it goes on, but I don't get how you can feel good doing it. I want to beat someone legitimately, not by getting away with what I can get away with.
 
hmmm

torgy2 said:
i didnt call it cuz i feel thats its not really cheating or anything because its

not my fault that they were more concerned about their conversation then

the game and its not my resposibility to call fouls that they miss when

they are supposed to be watching the game. As long

as there isnt any real cheating going on ( moving balls around by hand or

pocketing balls by hand) im starting to think that the opposing player(s)

should call fouls. But thats just me lol
Click to expand...


This is not softball. Most other amatuer/recreation type activites have a referee. Softball, volleyball, soccer, basketball, hockey, football, heck even flag football still has a ref. And these are park district type leagues and they still have ref's.

I don't really think another player should be penalized because the waitress walked in front of you and blocked out the shot, or somebody walked by and said hello, or your teammate was asking you some questions, etc, etc, and thus you could not see what happened.

So, yeah, you should feel real proud of yourself. You not only cheated your opponent, but you cheated yourself. And the fact you can't kick worth a sh*t says a little something about your game.... Well done, sir.
 
onepocketron said:
It depends. In my BCA league you must watch the table. If your opponent fouls, it is up to you to spot it. If you don't he has no obligation to tell you anything. I haven't played anything but BCA league, and that is the rule. Everyone is aware of this rule, so people watch their matches very closely.
With that said, if I was playing in more casual league, or for that matter playing an individual one on one, I would be honest, and hand him the ball.
Click to expand...

Wow. Is that in the BCA rulebook? Sounds more like APA, fwiw.
 
way to point out the obvious and say that this isnt softball or football or

basketball but just because there isnt a ref at every match doesnt mean

that i have to make all the calls for the opposing players. If they want a

ball in hand they have to pay attention and watch to see if i foul and take

it upon themselves to call the fouls. Its not like they asked me and i lied n

told them no i didnt foul when i did. now if they went to the bathroom or

to get a drink or walked away from the table and told me and i still went

ahead and shot and fouled then i would tell them that i fouled cuz of

course they couldnt see what happened, but if they are sitting there

talking and no one is in the way of them watching and they dont call it I

dont feel the need to reward them and let them put the ball where ever

they feel like if they didnt catch the mistake in the first place especially if it

is league play.
 
Having your opponent not watching whats going on always bugs me, it's almost as if they don't care whats happening on the table. All that said if it's an obvious foul I'll call it, but if can go either way no way.
 
I will call my own fouls if I am playing someone who has a mutual respect for the game. If it is my choice, I will only play such people in the first place.

But in leagues and tournaments I will sometimes end up in games against opponents that will try to make moves and or try to get away with fouls or accuse my good hits of being fouls.

I feel no obligation to try to help these types if they aren't paying attention.
 
rayjay said:
Wow. Is that in the BCA rulebook? Sounds more like APA, fwiw.
Click to expand...

The official APA rule is that either team captain can call a foul. If both captains agree it's a foul, it's a foul. If the captains disagree, it's the shooter's call (sometimes after the rule has been explained to the shooter). There's nowhere in the APA manual that says your opponent has to call your fouls.

In practice in the APA, honest players call their own fouls, which accounts for about 99% of the people I've played. Most of my teams will call the foul on our own players if the player doesn't notice they fouled, and I think that's the way it should go.

As far as calling fouls on the opposing team's shooter, I'm beyond the point of arguing any more. I call the foul, explain what the foul was, and if they decide it wasn't a foul, fine, I know what kind of player you are now. :D
 
im not understanding how its "cheating" its the other players fault that they missed the foul, its not like im lying to them when they ask and i tell them it was a good hit when it really was a foul cuz if that was the case then it would be cheating. but to their knowledge its a good hit and dont even suspect any thing and if they did or do suspect something they shuld ask and then i would tell them it was a good hit or not. does it say any where in the rules that the shooter has to call the fouls?
 
I play Scotch Doubles with my wife.
Its a sociable night out for ourselves and the other team. Quite often, we all sit at the same table. There is a small end of the year tourney, everyone that plays gets paid.

Yes, we call foul on ourselves and our opponents do the same.

Team play, I call foul as well. There are maybe one or two circumstances in which I may be inclined not to, buts thats not the norm.
 
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