Snooker World No. 1 John Higgins in betting scandal

interesting

Seems very slam dunk but I'll wait and see how this one plays out. Media set-ups and edited video never does play quite right with me. Where this took place does put a lot of pressure on Higgins to play along and then get the hell out of Dodge. On the other hand had I done that the next thing I would have done is report the issue to the governing association to cover my butt.

Neither side of the story has the ring of truth to it. At the very least it stinks of entrapment. I have never had anyone come to me that didn't have a hard number in mind for a deal and then want to deal from that number either. Years ago when I had just bought an auto salvage a mafia goon wanted me to get involved in an auto theft operation. We talked several times but never came to terms because I had no intention of coming to terms with him. Never-the-less I handled him with kid gloves because he didn't seem like the kind of guy I wanted for an enemy. This wasn't an existing operation but one he was trying to set up so I didn't feel like I had anything to take to the law in a strange place even if I wanted to. Hmm, have to say I am starting to sound more like Higgins all the time when I think about it.

Hu
 
Next move?

This looks terrible for Higgins, but I too will keep his noose (barely) at bay...

What's next? Hearn has an investigation going. What other wheels might be turning?


KK9 <-- has felt the sensationized rath of ravenous media before
 
He runs the World Series of Snooker which consists of events around Europe and he and Pat Mooney travelled over there to look into the possibilities of holding an event in Kiev.
 
Buckster_uk said:
He runs the World Series of Snooker which consists of events around Europe and he and Pat Mooney travelled over there to look into the possibilities of holding an event in Kiev.
Click to expand...

And making a few extra dollars on the side. I wonder what Mooney's cut would have been. Probably the usual agents 10-20%.
 
Buckster_uk said:
He runs the World Series of Snooker which consists of events around Europe and he and Pat Mooney travelled over there to look into the possibilities of holding an event in Kiev.
Click to expand...

I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt, I even thought Nixon was telling the truth until the tapes came out. If they had a legitimate reason for being there then perhaps their story about feeling threatened is true, but unless there is evidence exonerating them on the tape I think they are finished. If snooker wants to survive they pretty much have to drop the hammer of these guys don't they?

The World Series of Snooker even in Kiev could simply have been cover for what they were really planning.
 
jay helfert said:
In the early 90's I found out that a player dumped a match in a tournament I put on. He was a rather well known player at the time. I confronted him on it and he wouldn't deny it. He just said it was none of my business what he did. I told him it was my business if he was playing in my event.

I never invited him back to any tournament I put on, and there were some big ones. He had several friends call me on his behalf, but I wasn't about to change my mind. He did play in some tournaments I directed, but I had no control over who got invited. He was on his best behavior too because he knew I was watching him.

Another guy got caught putting slugs in the bar tables at the U.S. Bar Table maybe 15 years ago. He apologized profusely and also tried hard to get back in. Nothing doing! I even told Mark Griffin about him when he took over the tournament.

There is only so much we can do here without an organization to mandate rules and regulations. But one thing a promoter can do is not allow someone to play, if they consider them an undesirable. If something like that happened at the U.S. Open, I bet they would also be banned for life.

Most of the dumping that has gone on that I am aware of has happened in money games, not in tournaments. By the way, deal making and "savers" are a fact of life in pro pool. You can't legislate against that. As long as both players are making an honest effort to win the match, that is all you can ask for. Even with a saver, there is a difference in dollars between winning and losing the match. They do have an incentive to win.

Yes, something funny happened one year at the Tournament of Champions. I am very much aware of that. It is one of those events that I directed. When the sports book made one player a 20-1 underdog it was too tempting for the other players. A somewhat similar situation to what was happening with Higgins but for far less money. The maximum bet at the sports book was $200, so a winning ticket was worth four grand. I asked the head of the book how much they lost, and he said there were only ten tickets for 40K total. He just laughed it off, but they never made a line again on a pool match.
Click to expand...

Jay, we've all heard rumors about this, you are saying that the 1991 International Challenge of Champions was in fact rigged by the eight players so that Mike LeBron won? If that's the case then the player lineup at the time included players such as Jim Rempe, Nick Varner, Johnny Archer, Tony Elin, Oliver Ortman, Buddy Hall, and Mike Sigel. Obviously they all had to be in on it, so please tell us, did you ever invite any of them to any of your future tournaments? If so, then why the double standard?

Please understand, I'm not trying to offend you, I'm just wondering, if we consider Higgins to be a scumbag, then aren't all of those guys scumbags too? I wish I'd been involved in the game back then, I'd have pulled a Kenesaw Landis and banned them all from the sport for life.
 
I find the question of entrapment interesting from a legal standpoint.

I know evidence from a journalist can convict someone of a crime. But can a journalist's sting operation be admitted? It can be argued they enticed him into a crime he otherwise wouldn't have committed. He may even sue them for damage to his reputation.

I figure he can still be booted from the snooker governing body and fined by them, that's all written in a contract he must have signed at some point. But I don't imagine he'll see jail for this.
 
gromulan said:
Jay, we've all heard rumors about this, you are saying that the 1991 International Challenge of Champions was in fact rigged by the eight players so that Mike LeBron won? If that's the case then the player lineup at the time included players such as Jim Rempe, Nick Varner, Johnny Archer, Tony Elin, Oliver Ortman, Buddy Hall, and Mike Sigel. Obviously they all had to be in on it, so please tell us, did you ever invite any of them to any of your future tournaments? If so, then why the double standard?

Please understand, I'm not trying to offend you, I'm just wondering, if we consider Higgins to be a scumbag, then aren't all of those guys scumbags too? I wish I'd been involved in the game back then, I'd have pulled a Kenesaw Landis and banned them all from the sport for life.
Click to expand...


You have some of the correct players but not all. Like I said in my earlier post, I was just the TD, not the promoter. I didn't set this event up, and if I did it would have been handled differently.
 
jay helfert said:
You have some of the correct players but not all. Like I said in my earlier post, I was just the TD, not the promoter. I didn't set this event up, and if I did it would have been handled differently.
Click to expand...

Ok, but do you regard the eight players who took part as scumbags, though?
 
ironman said:
jay would probably know this better thatn I butI'm pretty sure The MIZ went to London and competed and did pretty well, finishing pretty highin one of the championships, thiking a 2nd, 3re, or 4th place finish? Ialso remember Billy Stroud going over and competing at one time! Why wouldn't more be taking a shot at this gold??
Click to expand...

Mizerak and Rempe tried qualifying for the World Championships a fair few times, but neither made it to the first round at The Crucible.
 
Last edited:
gromulan said:
Ok, but do you regard the eight players who took part as scumbags, though?
Click to expand...

Scumbags is a pretty harsh word. I don't think you would like to be called a scumbag, would you?

Now, were they dishonest? Yes. It definitely affected the entire play of the event and tainted it in my mind. Remember one thing, these were very low paid pool players, not millionaire snooker players. For these guys, making a few thousand was a big score. I am not condoning what they did, and in fact worked closely with the promoter to see that it didn't happen again in the future.

It was and remains a black mark on our sport, and certain players will forever be tainted by participating in this scheme. The main individual who put the plan in action was never invited back. I want to say one thing for all to hear. Earl Strickland was entered in this event, and he refused to be part of any shenanigans. He was the only one who refused to participate. The other seven were not so innocent.
 
Now we have something statistically significant!

jay helfert said:
Scumbags is a pretty harsh word. I don't think you would like to be called a scumbag, would you?

Now, were they dishonest? Yes. It definitely affected the entire play of the event and tainted it in my mind. Remember one thing, these were very low paid pool players, not millionaire snooker players. For these guys, making a few thousand was a big score. I am not condoning what they did, and in fact worked closely with the promoter to see that it didn't happen again in the future.

It was and remains a black mark on our sport, and certain players will forever be tainted by participating in this scheme. The main individual who put the plan in action was never invited back. I want to say one thing for all to hear. Earl Strickland was entered in this event, and he refused to be part of any shenanigans. He was the only one who refused to participate. The other seven were not so innocent.
Click to expand...


Now we have something statistically significant. Seven out of eight pool players are crooked, the eighth one is crazy!!

The post is meant in fun but daaa-ummm :eek:

Hu
 
gromulan said:
Jay, we've all heard rumors about this, you are saying that the 1991 International Challenge of Champions was in fact rigged by the eight players so that Mike LeBron won? If that's the case then the player lineup at the time included players such as Jim Rempe, Nick Varner, Johnny Archer, Tony Elin, Oliver Ortman, Buddy Hall, and Mike Sigel. Obviously they all had to be in on it, so please tell us, did you ever invite any of them to any of your future tournaments? If so, then why the double standard?

Please understand, I'm not trying to offend you, I'm just wondering, if we consider Higgins to be a scumbag, then aren't all of those guys scumbags too? I wish I'd been involved in the game back then, I'd have pulled a Kenesaw Landis and banned them all from the sport for life.
Click to expand...


I have to agree with gromulan, if these guys made money by dumping an event, then they are o better then Higgins. The only difference is the amount of money involved. If that story is indeed true, then why was this basically swept under the table and most of these guys continued to play and rack up some big wins.

If someone could shed some light on the difference between 1 guy and his agent agreeing to dump 1 frame in a match and 7 guys rigging the outcome of a tournament by throwing matches. It seems pretty obviious to me which is worse but yet the pool playing community let these guys slide.

Any body have any thoughts?
 
jay helfert said:
I want to say one thing for all to hear. Earl Strickland was entered in this event, and he refused to be part of any shenanigans. He was the only one who refused to participate. The other seven were not so innocent.
Click to expand...

Good for Earl.
 
LeagueGuy said:
I have to agree with gromulan, if these guys made money by dumping an event, then they are o better then Higgins. The only difference is the amount of money involved. If that story is indeed true, then why was this basically swept under the table and most of these guys continued to play and rack up some big wins.

If someone could shed some light on the difference between 1 guy and his agent agreeing to dump 1 frame in a match and 7 guys rigging the outcome of a tournament by throwing matches. It seems pretty obviious to me which is worse but yet the pool playing community let these guys slide.

Any body have any thoughts?
Click to expand...


I'd say that the amount of harm done, is still dozens if not hundreds of times bigger, what this incident will do to Snooker and also other Billiard sports, than the 1991 case, which for example I hear now for the first time, even though played already internationally then.

I'd still agree, that also they should've had penalties. For example fine, and 2 years ban or smt like that.
 
jay helfert said:
It was and remains a black mark on our sport, and certain players will forever be tainted by participating in this scheme. The main individual who put the plan in action was never invited back. I want to say one thing for all to hear. Earl Strickland was entered in this event, and he refused to be part of any shenanigans. He was the only one who refused to participate. The other seven were not so innocent.
Click to expand...

People can say what they want about Earl, but the fact that he wouldn't go along with this scheme puts him way up on the pedestal for me. This tells you a lot about his character and gives me a different perspective on Earl.

Chris
 
Last edited:
Jay, while I wouldn't ever say you're afraid to speak your mind, you're usually pretty circumspect in some things. It seems like an unusually bold statement to name 7 major, well-liked pros and say in no uncertain terms that they rigged a major tournament. I feel like I should have heard of something so serious. Maybe this is one of those old news topics that was already hashed to death on this forum or RSB.

How sure are you?
 
jay helfert said:
I want to say one thing for all to hear. Earl Strickland was entered in this event, and he refused to be part of any shenanigans. He was the only one who refused to participate. The other seven were not so innocent.
Click to expand...

The nickname now has to be "Honest Earl The Pearl" :cool:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top