Think that would be if you want to get better you must practice, and playing pool with your buddies is not practice.
The hardest thing to teach lower skill level players
- Thread starter jdxprs
- Start date
To me, the hardest thing to teach a beginner is to stroke straight. After that, other things start falling into place. As far as ball selection, that will only come with experience. It's the reason so many league games are won from the bench, with a timely call by an experienced coach.
All you need is a straight-stroke 
rest is practise^^
I personally prefer to teach beginners- then i can work directly on fundamentals.
And if they re already playin league- you can also teach beginners on tactical and strategy. That shouldn t be the problem.
lg
Ingo
rest is practise^^
I personally prefer to teach beginners- then i can work directly on fundamentals.
And if they re already playin league- you can also teach beginners on tactical and strategy. That shouldn t be the problem.
lg
Ingo
the first requirment to get better is for them to want learn and take advice. I have seen so many lower skill players who want to do it there way.
The second hardest thing is for them to try and play within there ability, lower levals always seem to think they are better than they are.
if you have a player who understands the above all the advice in previous posts will help. if they dont the learning time is greatly increased and no matter what you try and teach wont work.
The second hardest thing is for them to try and play within there ability, lower levals always seem to think they are better than they are.
if you have a player who understands the above all the advice in previous posts will help. if they dont the learning time is greatly increased and no matter what you try and teach wont work.
I think I'm gonna regret going down this road, but what the hey....
I have limited time to play pool. I work 50-60 hours a week, not counting the 45 minute commute each way. Married, two kids. Pool time is at a premium. No table at home, no possibility of a table at home, won't fit.
In the limited time that I have, would you suggest that I go to a pool room and run drills by myself, realizing that I am indeed a beginner and probably am not exactly qualified to teach myself a lot? Or might I play as much pool as I can, with a group of far more experienced players than I, and learn from them as I play, getting tips and suggestions along the way?
{shakes head}
Regardless how the balls are laying, the person has to know the "Why" behind what they are doing. That way they can apply the same principles to other situations.
Yes, there are some simple drills one can do that work on the stroke, potting balls, and on getting position. These drills can be found via Google. If you work specifically on those shots you missed last time you played, you will get better faster than if you just shoot or just play. When you are at the table by yourself, you get 3X-4X as many shots in in an hour than when you are playng against someone. If you make these count, your ill improve faster than while palying.
You want to do both. While you are running your drills, look over at the other table(s) and watch the other players play. You can gain valuable insite into what to do from just watching.
But, when given the opportinity, play with these people, and gain that valuable insite. Whether the valuable insite improves your game faster than more table time is determined a lot on where you are in your game.
I agree. By the time a guy becomes a good shot and good at playing position he will be good at patterns. The ability to play position for a shot to break open a cluster is a challenge.
The right ball is usually the easiest shot and I wouldn't be afraid to tell them that. There are occasional exceptions to the rule (like where there are multiple easy shots) but if we're talking a C or lower, I really want them to take the easiest shot rather than get too cute and play a missable ball for the sake of the pattern. Especially in league.
If they're at a level where they can control the ball sorta and they have options, there are a couple of mantras to drill into their head:
- If you're playing 8 ball, work backwards from the 8.
I have a buddy who is only a bit below me but still doesn't do this but it'll come someday. Maybe I'll get a megaphone. Pick your key ball to get on the 8 (something that is as close to a stop shot as possible) pick a ball to get on that ball, and pretty much roll your own for the rest.
- Solve your problems first. As early as humanly possible.
I can't tell you how many times I've had this conversation when they place their ball in hand...
Me: "do you have any problems on the table?"
Them: "yeah, the 4-6 are tied up."
Me: "so why aren't you placing the cue ball here to shoot in the 4 from the short side?"
Them: "well I was gonna do that. See I was gonna shoot the 7 here and draw to that spot and then shoot the 4."
Me: ...."DON'T PLAY POSITION ON YOUR PROBLEMS *SOLVE* YOUR PROBLEMS$@%!@#$!@#$!$" (have seizure and fall over).
Just keep repeating that last line until it sinks in. Some people don't trust it. But hammer it in there... you want to solve problems on this current shot, if possible.
Once they get in that mindset the patterns will sort of open up to them.
If they're at a level where they can control the ball sorta and they have options, there are a couple of mantras to drill into their head:
- If you're playing 8 ball, work backwards from the 8.
I have a buddy who is only a bit below me but still doesn't do this but it'll come someday. Maybe I'll get a megaphone. Pick your key ball to get on the 8 (something that is as close to a stop shot as possible) pick a ball to get on that ball, and pretty much roll your own for the rest.
- Solve your problems first. As early as humanly possible.
I can't tell you how many times I've had this conversation when they place their ball in hand...
Me: "do you have any problems on the table?"
Them: "yeah, the 4-6 are tied up."
Me: "so why aren't you placing the cue ball here to shoot in the 4 from the short side?"
Them: "well I was gonna do that. See I was gonna shoot the 7 here and draw to that spot and then shoot the 4."
Me: ...."DON'T PLAY POSITION ON YOUR PROBLEMS *SOLVE* YOUR PROBLEMS$@%!@#$!@#$!$" (have seizure and fall over).
Just keep repeating that last line until it sinks in. Some people don't trust it. But hammer it in there... you want to solve problems on this current shot, if possible.
Once they get in that mindset the patterns will sort of open up to them.
Playing Position Drill
Perhaps both.
You can do drills like the 3 rows x 3 balls (1-9) drill taking ball in hand for the first shot and put the 8 ball in the group and plan to shoot it last. When you can run all the solids off and pocket the 8 ball last you can add in some stripes as blockers in the mix still shooting the 8 ball last. When that becomes too easy use 3 rows of 5 balls so you have all 15 balls and shoot the 8 ball last. That will help you on your small shape and patterns. Then when you've practiced this a few times, go play with your friends. Just a thought.
A more advanced version.
snipped
In the limited time that I have, would you suggest that I go to a pool room and run drills by myself, realizing that I am indeed a beginner and probably am not exactly qualified to teach myself a lot? Or might I play as much pool as I can, with a group of far more experienced players than I, and learn from them as I play, getting tips and suggestions along the way?
{shakes head}
Perhaps both.
You can do drills like the 3 rows x 3 balls (1-9) drill taking ball in hand for the first shot and put the 8 ball in the group and plan to shoot it last. When you can run all the solids off and pocket the 8 ball last you can add in some stripes as blockers in the mix still shooting the 8 ball last. When that becomes too easy use 3 rows of 5 balls so you have all 15 balls and shoot the 8 ball last. That will help you on your small shape and patterns. Then when you've practiced this a few times, go play with your friends. Just a thought.
A more advanced version.
Jerry Forsyth
Well-known member
Toughest thing to teach them is to bet high.
Very sound advice, from all of you. I certainly will try and work in some drill time, I believe that does make sense.
What I need is to find a different job, closer to home, so I could have more time for pool (and maybe the family, too, I suppose) but that's asking a lot these days...
Again, many thanks. This is fun, banging ideas around, and getting advice. Sure is fun to think about.
What I need is to find a different job, closer to home, so I could have more time for pool (and maybe the family, too, I suppose) but that's asking a lot these days...
Again, many thanks. This is fun, banging ideas around, and getting advice. Sure is fun to think about.
In coaching SL2's, 3's, and 4's over the years, I can remember one glaring problem:
Getting them to stop using an attempted draw on EVERY shot......it was impossible. We could take a timeout, talk about the shot, setting them up for a nice easy shot with a little follow for easy position on the 8 ball, diagraming the whole thing on the table....right before they pull the trigger, you could see the cue drop and I knew what was coming :embarrassed2:
For the record, my position play sucks, I'm officially low level :grin-square:
Getting them to stop using an attempted draw on EVERY shot......it was impossible. We could take a timeout, talk about the shot, setting them up for a nice easy shot with a little follow for easy position on the 8 ball, diagraming the whole thing on the table....right before they pull the trigger, you could see the cue drop and I knew what was coming :embarrassed2:
For the record, my position play sucks, I'm officially low level :grin-square:
I would have to agree, it is very difficult to get them to take (or maybe even see) the "right" shot... they tend to see and try to take the shot that they think is the easiest for them to make giving no regard to the leave for the next shot, or even the shot after that.
jdxprs
Banned
the point you are missing is that every ball you make when you are not going to get out, just makes it easier and more likely that i will beat you when you let me back to the table. making your opponent use his position off a made ball to move one of your balls, instead of setting up for his next shot, decreases his chances of running out.
blah blah
Shoebat
Speed control.
New players often blame every poor leave on hitting "too hard" or "too soft," and will even loudly announce whichever they think they did on that last shot before they get down on the next ball.
After an hour of banging balls around with my friend, and feeling rather like rolling my eyes every time she claimed her poor shape was due to incorrect speed control, I finally realized that she really, honestly believed that speed control was the problem with her shape.
We set up "hangers" in the corner pocket, and practiced how much of the ball to hit, which side of the ball to hit, and then finally, what the 9 englishes would do based on where (and on how much) she hit.
At first she was very self- conscious about actually practicing hitting the hangers, but she quickly got interested in seeing the immediate cb results.
It was a true revelation to her that the more of the object ball she hit, the less energy the cb would have after contact to travel with. The less ob contacted, the more energy the cb would still have to run with.
And it was a true revelation to me that I was hearing but not listening.
New players often blame every poor leave on hitting "too hard" or "too soft," and will even loudly announce whichever they think they did on that last shot before they get down on the next ball.
After an hour of banging balls around with my friend, and feeling rather like rolling my eyes every time she claimed her poor shape was due to incorrect speed control, I finally realized that she really, honestly believed that speed control was the problem with her shape.
We set up "hangers" in the corner pocket, and practiced how much of the ball to hit, which side of the ball to hit, and then finally, what the 9 englishes would do based on where (and on how much) she hit.
At first she was very self- conscious about actually practicing hitting the hangers, but she quickly got interested in seeing the immediate cb results.
It was a true revelation to her that the more of the object ball she hit, the less energy the cb would have after contact to travel with. The less ob contacted, the more energy the cb would still have to run with.
And it was a true revelation to me that I was hearing but not listening.
Reealize that I do understand where you are going with this. But for the sake of argument...
At what point do I actually try to make shots? If I take your point literally, I cannot start making balls until/unless I can run 8 in a row. Running out. I am not able to do that at this point in my game. 3-4 is sometimes possible, 5 every once in a while.
So every ball I make makes it easier for you, I get that. If I can't get out, what am I supposed to do, play safe after the break?
I have been drilled and drilled and drilled by my friend to play safe rather than try a shot that I don't have a great chance to make, and I get that. And I even do that sometimes.
I think I'm actually pretty good at reading the table for the next few shots, for my experience. All I need to do is get the stroke consistent enough to actually start making them, enough times in a row to actually make that run at "getting out". So tell me, where is the balance? When do I start making shots?
The hardest thing to teach a lower skilled level player is to understand their true speed.
Can't tell you how many times i've seen crappy players going around pumping themselves up with a bunch of hype, talking about how good they are and how they are the be all to end all of pool, or how they can compete at a really high level, all because they think they play better then they really do, when in reality, THEY SUCK!!!!!!
Makes me want to laugh every single time i see someone who overestimates their ability in a grotesque manner when they really have no clue how terrible they are.
Can't tell you how many times i've seen crappy players going around pumping themselves up with a bunch of hype, talking about how good they are and how they are the be all to end all of pool, or how they can compete at a really high level, all because they think they play better then they really do, when in reality, THEY SUCK!!!!!!
Makes me want to laugh every single time i see someone who overestimates their ability in a grotesque manner when they really have no clue how terrible they are.
blah blah
Shoebat
: ) I freely admit I suck.
I had a teacher who both told me and showed me that constantly.
(Even now I can STILL hear him singing "it's so eeeeasy/ like taking candyyyyy/ from a babyyyy!!!" while he ran out on me.)