The Mosconi Cup 2014 onwards

[Peter@CEP]

The two most important words in your question Doug are "Team Spirit" For some years now there has been none in the American Team and it is so in contrast to that shown by the Europeans.

No one doubts the ability of the American players but they simply don't gel as a team. It's sometimes hard to even spot them in the audience when their team mates are playing.

 

[Island Drive]

The two most important words in your question Doug are "Team Spirit" For some years now there has been none in the American Team and it is so in contrast to that shown by the Europeans.

No one doubts the ability of the American players but they simply don't gel as a team. It's sometimes hard to even spot them in the audience when their team mates are playing.

I was watching the last scotch doubles match last night. Early on Rodney and Shane were back and forth, on which way to go to play safe, and the clock started beeping, I think the score was 3-3 at the time. Rod stepped up quickly and hit the obj. ball up/down long rail, cue ball went three rails and left the opponent straight in. The body language spoke loudly and I immediately was disgusted, and I turned my computer off. When you bring a herd of stallions together, they need allot of time to work things out before calm and pecking order....are realized, understood and implemented. I'm still trying to understand what was Really going on, other than a good paycheck and losers realizing they would probably be getting less than their opponents.

 

[Hungarian]

I made an interesting observation that I believe might be affecting USA's team play. I don't like the idea of having a 'playing coach'. It causes too many distractions. This shouldn't be a family vacation. While playing in the MC players should ONLY be focused on trying to win.

Also, Team Europe is a real team and taking the MC seriously. They are honkered down together like a small village sharing meals and having team meetings and such.

Team USA can't wait to go their own way after it's over. I think the Euro's enjoy each other on and off the table.

Pool is dead in the USA.

Happy Holidays..

 

[se10player]

the americans need to just watch Efren and Bustamante play doubles to learn how to play. They never ask or tell the other how or what to shoot they just allow each other to shoot. All of the americans are great players and have won everything in pool by playing their game and the should keep doing that. Play what you know has worked and won for you in the past don't try to shoot what Shane or Johnny or Earl would shoot. Make the shots you know you can make to win. Then support the team, I have kicked people of my APA team for not supporting it, this should be a standard in the cup if you don't support you don't play again. Just my opin.

 

[jalapus logan]

Let's all be real for two seconds. The Mosconi Cup isn't making players rich. There's no good return on investment for the players. In fact financially, they're maximizing profit doing it how they do it now. There will be no training and team building exercises, those things cost money that broke pool players don't have. I know the guys care about Team USA this week, but they are not hitting balls practicing year round thinking about playing for Team USA. Ask any of them if they'd rather have the trophy or the money.

You can't spend trophies!

 

[Johnnyt]

I like this idea. Perhaps a compromise and only allow 2 players in on public vote - that way the best players by merit will be there too!
Forums - you gotta love 'em - I feel like the Chairman of Matchroom :thumbup:

LMAO. I'm guilty too. Johnnyt

 

[CrownCityCorey]

In view of the poor showing by the US team maybe it is time for a radical rethink of how future US teams are compiled. Under the status quo it can only be a matter of time before public interest in a One Horse Race fades.

What would work is for someone to come up with a proposal to Matchroom to take responsibility for the US team. They could then compile a squad of maybe 10 younger players who would be the core from which future players are selected.

They could associate with each other at other major events and hopefully engender some team spirit over the course of a season. Maybe the US might have a chance then.

How about that one for Badi Navhat if he wants to get a foothold in the American game. In the longer term he could enlarge his squad up to 16 or 32 and have a tournament schedule just for them. They would be the only TRUE US PROFESSIONAL PLAYERS.

Not a bad idea, but Badi, correct me if I am wrong, is not a US Citizen.

I'd think it a must for the such an individual or organization to be so.

 

[ElLeon]

I am a rookie when it comes to knowing the pro players or following them. And am, gasp!, one of those crummy APA/NAPA/BCA armature players who has no aspirations to be on TV or be a pro (my day job pays well).

However, as my interest in billiards has been increasing the past few years i've started to learn a few of the pro players and lurk a lot on here about the rules changes from year to year.

So i'll chime in with this: I've been glued to the stream of the Mosconi cup this year! Even though the US isn't doing well, it's a great show to watch. And I look forward to seeing more pro events going forward.

For me its about seeing such quality pool, even if one sided on the results side at the moment. Minus the antics of Earl. He is as obnoxious as the worst sharks i've met at local tournaments... Now if he could back up his talk with play that would be one thing, but he is shooting really poorly, so then it's time for him to shut up until his game comes back.

 

[punter]

Why not let the pool public vote for the players who go to Mosconi Cup?? Like baseball does picking the All Star team...Then whatever happens we can't complain...Seems like everyone has a different pick each year on who should be there...
Not sure the format should be changed..We didn't complain when we were winning...

Not a bad idea, especially since the Mosconi Cup has about the same meaning as a MLB All-Star game, i.e., it's really just entertainment.

 

[Peter@CEP]

You can't spend trophies!

Along with the trophy, comes a hefty chunk of cash, win or lose. The Europeans regularly practice by playing tournaments all over the world and thus gain valuable experience. Apart from one or two, the Americans are stay at home players.

As far as practicing together as a team, this only takes place for a few days before the big event.

The Europeans are committed and dedicated, they play for each other. The Americans are totally the opposite. Of course they encourage their players when they win but when they lose, they just slink off to their hidey holes.

 

[dkleather]

Not so sure about your one horse race thought. The United States took the trophy home 11 of the first 13 years. The interest stayed around pretty well through all of that.

You have to remember at that time the Europeans were learning the game and chasing a superior team, there was a novelty aspect.

You not have to look at this board to see that American fans expect to win even when they are clearly not the best team and I believe that if Europe keep winning American interest could dwindle.

 

[Island Drive]

You have to remember at that time the Europeans were learning the game and chasing a superior team, there was a novelty aspect.

You not have to look at this board to see that American fans expect to win even when they are clearly not the best team and I believe that if Europe keep winning American interest could dwindle.

Sounds like the USA should have Mosconi cup player qualifiers, one every month. From this grouping the team should be picked. I'm sure there are a few that would commit to this venture, and communicate....Divide the country into four zones to minimize travel, and in each zone have rooms bid or blind draw who gets what, when and where.

 

[Maniac]

You not have to look at this board to see that American fans expect to win even when they are clearly not the best team and I believe that if Europe keep winning American interest could dwindle.

It won't have to dwindle.......fan interest/participation already sucks in this country. As for the Mosconi Cup arena.....I've seen more attendance at high school basketball games. Was that arena sold out? And, if it was...how many interested ticket buyers did they have to turn away? These numbers would show how much interest this country has in watching pool at its top level.

My guess is.....not enough!!!

Sh*tloads of people playing the game in America...not so many watching it being played.

Everybody's got a fix for pool, though.

Maniac (not holding his breath)

 

[SammyUtd]

Maniac: As a UK viewer I was surprised by the attendance... It always seems much busier when it is hosted in the UK (I hope to get tickets in 2014!). It is such an exciting game, I can't believe it isn't bigger, I think it has the potential to be HUGE in the UK.

Going forward, I imagine the Americans will come back a hell of a lot stronger. I hope they continue with Morris and Hatch, who for me are pure box office.

What has happened to Duel, I'm not a pool expert but he always struck me as a world class player and I was surprised not to see him this year?

 

[Maniac]

Maniac: As a UK viewer I was surprised by the attendance... It always seems much busier when it is hosted in the UK (I hope to get tickets in 2014!). It is such an exciting game, I can't believe it isn't bigger, I think it has the potential to be HUGE in the UK.

Going forward, I imagine the Americans will come back a hell of a lot stronger. I hope they continue with Morris and Hatch, who for me are pure box office.

What has happened to Duel, I'm not a pool expert but he always struck me as a world class player and I was surprised not to see him this year?

Corey simply wasn't chosen. I read a lot of opinions here on AZB that thinks he SHOULD have been on the team. With only five going....there is always somebody deserving that's going to get left off the team. I guess this year it was Corey. He doesn't fully commit himself to the game (his choice...I'm not knocking him), and opinions here think that may have hurt his chances. He's been one of my favorite players for some time now.

As far as the American team coming back stronger......with who??? We tried Shuff, Dechaine, Dominguez, and others....but they just can't seem to stand up to the pressure (especially in the UK arena). Team Europe plays with ice water running through their veins (except VanDen Berg, who always looks like a frightened puppy dog).

The difference in the past four Cups, imo, has come down to 75% nerves...25% talent. Team Europe's players are only slightly more talented than Team America....but have loads more ability to "keep it together" under pressure.

Team America doesn't so much need younger players...or more talented players...just players that can perform better under pressure. Imo, that alone would tighten up the matches...and make for a more interesting contest.

Maniac

 

[CreeDo]

The trend has been to have more and more wildcard picks from Matchroom over time.
It started out as only 2 players being chosen by Matchroom (I think that's how it was for 2010 / 2011
and who knows how many years prior) and the rest earned their spot via BCA points.

Then in 2012 they went with 3 wildcard picks.

Finally in 2013 they said "we're picking all 5 of them."

I don't think our AZB chatter will influence them in the slightest but just for the sake of discussion,
why have they been moving this way?

- Is it because Europe has won so many of these that they feel they need to hand-pick veteran
mosconi cup champions, just to level the playing field? If so that's backfired.
Johnny Archer is normally solid as a rock, even if he's past his prime, but didn't perform well this year.

- Is it because the number and quality of events in the USA has tanked so much that BCA points lists
are meaningless and there aren't enough majors to judge from?

- Is it because Mosconi Cup ratings have been dropping and they want more recognizable "personalities"
from the days when pool was on TV, like Earl and Johnny rather than young straight shooters like Dechaine and Shuff?

- Total conspiracy theory but maybe they just WANT team USA to lose?
I don't buy it but I'm sure someone will suggest it.

Will they ever reverse this trend or will it be wildcards from here out?

 

[pro9dg]

Mosconi Cup bring on the reseves

What might be interesting would be for the European Team to replace Appleton and Boyes with Van Den Berg and Hohmann;

Then Darren and Karl could join forces with Jayson Shaw, Chis Melling and Daryl Pech to represent the UK.
That would be an interesting contest.
Then there are other players who cannot make either of these squads but would waltz into the US team. For Europe - Ekonomopoulous, Ouschen, Ortmann, Petroni.

For the UK - Mark Gray, Phil Burford, Imran Majid

Picking another 5 from those seven and matching them up with the 20th MC American team. Then there might be a glimmer of hope for Team USA (but not much of a glimmer) against this third team.
We could even have a US linked Europeans - Mika, Darren, Thorsten, Phil Burford and Kelly Fisher.. They would give any team in the world a run for their money.

 

[JAM]

What might be interesting would be for the European Team to replace Appleton and Boyes with Van Den Berg and Hohmann;

Then Darren and Karl could join forces with Jayson Shaw, Chis Melling and Daryl Pech to represent the UK.
That would be an interesting contest.
Then there are other players who cannot make either of these squads but would waltz into the US team. For Europe - Ekonomopoulous, Ouschen, Ortmann, Petroni.

For the UK - Mark Gray, Phil Burford, Imran Majid

Picking another 5 from those seven and matching them up with the 20th MC American team. Then there might be a glimmer of hope for Team USA (but not much of a glimmer) against this third team.
We could even have a US linked Europeans - Mika, Darren, Thorsten, Phil Burford and Kelly Fisher.. They would give any team in the world a run for their money.

Doug, as you saying that America has not one player to compete with any of their European counterparts? I can hardly wait to read the answer.

 

[arps]

maybe US players could come visit PI and train/gamble here. pool rooms like this, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXBJZ2yXTVA would help a lot (especially Earl).

 

[Hungarian]

Go **** yourself. You *****s are all for show and have very little substance or grit. You spend 25 years trying to emulate the American pool player. And as the sport grows in popularity you begin to develop pockets of talent in various EU countries. I mean what else is their to do in Norway and Finland in the winter ... play pool or eat raw fish. Then a marketing genius steals the name Mosconi and creates the Cup and builds a team drawing on all of Europe where billiards is growing in participation which is close to 1 Billion people and still couldn't complete with the USA for many years. Meanwhile back at the ranch pool has been on a downward spiral since the creation of the Cup and oh yeah, we can only draw from the 310 Million Americans. Meanwhile half of Team Europe lives in the USA and most of the best European players wish they were here as well. Then we have to listen to all the hype and listen to Karl Boyles' interview as he basically kicks Earl while he's down.

Great victory for team Europe. You guys really did something. You are so amazing.

What might be interesting would be for the European Team to replace Appleton and Boyes with Van Den Berg and Hohmann;

Then Darren and Karl could join forces with Jayson Shaw, Chis Melling and Daryl Pech to represent the UK.
That would be an interesting contest.
Then there are other players who cannot make either of these squads but would waltz into the US team. For Europe - Ekonomopoulous, Ouschen, Ortmann, Petroni.

For the UK - Mark Gray, Phil Burford, Imran Majid

Picking another 5 from those seven and matching them up with the 20th MC American team. Then there might be a glimmer of hope for Team USA (but not much of a glimmer) against this third team.
We could even have a US linked Europeans - Mika, Darren, Thorsten, Phil Burford and Kelly Fisher.. They would give any team in the world a run for their money.