The WPA vs. the WNT

Bob Jewett

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The ban/sanction issue seems to be heating up. Here is Panozzo's view on part of the matter. Stolen from FB.

Michael Panozzo

𝗣𝗦𝗔 — 𝗧𝗵𝗶𝘀 𝗶𝘀 𝙡𝙤𝙣𝙜!
I wanted to clarify this response to Darren yesterday and share some thoughts on “the line in the sand” pro pool is facing. This is no bash at Darren, who is as thoughtful and thorough with his stands on issues as anyone in the game. And, in reality, it’s not really about the WPA or their efforts.

My confusion and concern with player movement is more about what’s being taken for granted and what’s being looked over. And I’m afraid that if this becomes a battle with only one winner, it will set the game back 20 years.

Many of us old timers have waited a very long time for something that looked like it was elevating the entire sport for people outside our little railbird world to take notice of. Something that looked and sounded big. Something that got talked about all year long. Something you could follow. Players becoming stars. Events leading to something.

It's about more than prize money. It’s about growth potential. I see that with Matchroom’s WNT. This may sound like a Matchroom crush, but it’s about more than a company. It’s about presentation of a sport. I honestly do not see that with the WPA.

(And for the record, very few people outside the WPA board room have tried to get people to understand the role and value of the WPA. Do I think they do a lot wrong? Absolutely. But the WPA is necessary, and it isn’t going away, so forget that notion. And again, this is not really about the WPA.)

And here’s why I say this.

What I see with the WPA is a bunch of deals with independent promoters who pay a sanction fee to run an event. Nothing wrong with that. But that event comes and goes, usually without a lot of fanfare and almost always without any residual value to the sport other than prize fund payout. When the event is over, it evaporates into the ether until next year. It has zero relevance with regards to any other event the WPA sanctions.

(Of course, the Predator World Championships and Pro Billiard Series events do go beyond that, but still most are one-offs.)

And with all those independent events you have inconsistencies. Nothing looks the same. There is no uniformity. No commonality.

And the WPA? Don’t kid yourself. They don’t have any control over these events, nor do they want to be promoters. They are about sanction fees and federations and government subsidies.

So, what you end up with is a hodgepodge of events throughout the year, with little rhyme or reason other than a payday for the players — and I get that is all they’re concerned about.

But where is the growth? Where is something that fans or sponsors can latch onto? The WPA does not own these events, so they can’t market them. They can’t get a sponsor for all of the events because they don’t have the power. They can’t make a TV deal for all the events because they don’t have the power. They cannot speak for these events in any way. They are solely a seal of approval. And that’s fine. But that doesn’t get the sport any closer to becoming a real sport.

To me, the real value of the WNT is that it is a product, owned and produced by a company. A company with a real live full-time production team. A real full-time marketing team. A real full-time television team. This is what they do. This is their job 365 days a year.

And because of that there is uniformity and vision and a product that, when it reaches a certain point, can be marketed and sold and promoted as a single entity… a tour. It boggles my mind that the players and even the WPA don’t realize the long-term value of that for the sport that everyone feigns to care about.

When I said get used to mediocre ballrooms, inconsistency and lack of visibility, those are real things. The WPA doesn’t determine where the China Open is going to be played. Or the Maldives Open. Or the Qatar Open. They don’t determine where, or even if, the event will have adequate worldwide coverage on TV or a streaming platform. And those things matter in developing a sport or legitimate tour.

I am steadfast in the belief that the growth of the sport will come from a single entity whose sole reason for being is to grow a sellable product. That does not mean that the WPA doesn’t have its place and isn’t of real value to the sport. It’s different business models. That doesn’t mean one is right and one is wrong, or that one should survive, and one should perish. But I see the critical importance of the WNT and worry that we may be doing our damnedest to chase it away. That said, I believe Matchroom is equally complicit in this conflict getting to this point.

In the end, what this all means is that, for the sake of the sport and the players everyone purports to “care about,” figure this shit out! Co-freaking-exist.

A lot has been written about player stances and statements and holding to one’s word. But if the players REALLY want to affect change, demand that these two entities meet and devise a workable solution for all. They both OWE you the courtesy, fellas. Help make it happen.

And if you’ve made it this far, bless you!
 
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The ban/sanction issue seems to be heating up. Here is Panozzo's view on part of the matter. Stolen from FB.

Michael Panozzo

𝗣𝗦𝗔 — 𝗧𝗵𝗶𝘀 𝗶𝘀 𝙡𝙤𝙣𝙜!
I wanted to clarify this response to Darren yesterday and share some thoughts on “the line in the sand” pro pool is facing. This is no bash at Darren, who is as thoughtful and thorough with his stands on issues as anyone in the game. And, in reality, it’s not really about the WPA or their efforts.

My confusion and concern with player movement is more about what’s being taken for granted and what’s being looked over. And I’m afraid that if this becomes a battle with only one winner, it will set the game back 20 years.

Many of us old timers have waited a very long time for something that looked like it was elevating the entire sport for people outside our little railbird world to take notice of. Something that looked and sounded big. Something that got talked about all year long. Something you could follow. Players becoming stars. Events leading to something.

It's about more than prize money. It’s about growth potential. I see that with Matchroom’s WNT. This may sound like a Matchroom crush, but it’s about more than a company. It’s about presentation of a sport. I honestly do not see that with the WPA.

(And for the record, very few people outside the WPA board room have tried to get people to understand the role and value of the WPA. Do I think they do a lot wrong? Absolutely. But the WPA is necessary, and it isn’t going away, so forget that notion. And again, this is not really about the WPA.)

And here’s why I say this.

What I see with the WPA is a bunch of deals with independent promoters who pay a sanction fee to run an event. Nothing wrong with that. But that event comes and goes, usually without a lot of fanfare and almost always without any residual value to the sport other than prize fund payout. When the event is over, it evaporates into the ether until next year. It has zero relevance with regards to any other event the WPA sanctions.

(Of course, the Predator World Championships and Pro Billiard Series events do go beyond that, but still most are one-offs.)

And with all those independent events you have inconsistencies. Nothing looks the same. There is no uniformity. No commonality.

And the WPA? Don’t kid yourself. They don’t have any control over these events, nor do they want to be promoters. They are about sanction fees and federations and government subsidies.

So, what you end up with is a hodgepodge of events throughout the year, with little rhyme or reason other than a payday for the players — and I get that is all they’re concerned about.

But where is the growth? Where is something that fans or sponsors can latch onto? The WPA does not own these events, so they can’t market them. They can’t get a sponsor for all of the events because they don’t have the power. They can’t make a TV deal for all the events because they don’t have the power. They cannot speak for these events in any way. They are solely a seal of approval. And that’s fine. But that doesn’t get the sport any closer to becoming a real sport.

To me, the real value of the WNT is that it is a product, owned and produced by a company. A company with a real live full-time production team. A real full-time marketing team. A real full-time television team. This is what they do. This is their job 365 days a year.

And because of that there is uniformity and vision and a product that, when it reaches a certain point, can be marketed and sold and promoted as a single entity… a tour. It boggles my mind that the players and even the WPA don’t realize the long-term value of that for the sport that everyone feigns to care about.

When I said get used to mediocre ballrooms, inconsistency and lack of visibility, those are real things. The WPA doesn’t determine where the China Open is going to be played. Or the Maldives Open. Or the Qatar Open. They don’t determine where, or even if, the event will have adequate worldwide coverage on TV or a streaming platform. And those things matter in developing a sport or legitimate tour.

I am steadfast in the belief that the growth of the sport will come from a single entity whose sole reason for being is to grow a sellable product. That does not mean that the WPA doesn’t have its place and isn’t of real value to the sport. It’s different business models. That doesn’t mean one is right and one is wrong, or that one should survive, and one should perish. But I see the critical importance of the WNT and worry that we may be doing our damnedest to chase it away. That said, I believe Matchroom is equally complicit in this conflict getting to this point.

In the end, what this all means is that, for the sake of the sport and the players everyone purports to “care about,” figure this shit out! Co-freaking-exist.

A lot has been written about player stances and statements and holding to one’s word. But if the players REALLY want to affect change, demand that these two entities meet and devise a workable solution for all. They both OWE you the courtesy, fellas. Help make it happen.

And if you’ve made it this far, bless you!
At least he remembered to metion "That said, I believe Matchroom is equally complicit in this conflict getting to this point." (y)
 
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Mike thx for the perspective. I liked your below paragraph quite allot.

But where is the growth? Where is something that fans or sponsors can latch onto? The WPA does not own these events, so they can’t market them. They can’t get a sponsor for all of the events because they don’t have the power. They can’t make a TV deal for all the events because they don’t have the power. They cannot speak for these events in any way. They are solely a seal of approval. And that’s fine. But that doesn’t get the sport any closer to becoming a real sport.
 
I'm of a different mindset. WPA had their chance many times and failed to do ANYTHING that elevated the sport. In fact, prize monies not only didn't keep up with inflation, they went down and only now, with the WNT, are they starting to get respectable.

I say WPA either comes along and works around the scheduling of the WNT without threatening any players, or good riddance.

Jaden
 
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The best thing for the players may be that they co-exist. But Matchroom is a profitable business and if I was on their team, and sitting in their meetings, I would have a very hard time formulating a coherent argument for why working with the WPA made sense. Why does Matchroom (not the players) need the WPA? Guess you could argue they need some form of sanctioning, but if the prize funds are big enough, nobody will care about WPA sanctioning. Nobody.

The problem for the players will continue to be eking out a living from a game that IS NOT as discriminating as snooker. Due to the variance found in 9 Ball you could be a top 20 player one year and 40-50 the next. What happens if Matchroom doubles the total prize fund? It will just attract even more monster players and further dilute the overall payouts. This is not an easy road for the players to travel.

The players need options. The WNT doesn't.
 
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for the sport to get up in the world it needs players that the public yearns to watch . not just play but watch.

boxing took off with cassius clay then again with tyson.
john mcenroe got people talking tennis.
minnesota fats had everyone in awe
the movie, the hustler, had a big surge in pool as it made pool characters exciting so pool followed it.

present pool players for the most part have little personality during their matches.= boring.

in the pool room. when cornbread played, or crazy bruce, ronnie allen, cokes , siegal, all would stop and watch,
and leave or fall asleep when vickery, or cook, played.
not because they were good but waiting for the fun or crazy things that they would say or do.
 
The best thing for the players may be that they co-exist. But Matchroom is a profitable business and if I was on their team, and sitting in their meetings, I would have a very hard time formulating a coherent argument for why working with the WPA made sense. Why does Matchroom (not the players) need the WPA? Guess you could argue they need some form of sanctioning, but if the prize funds are big enough, nobody will care about WPA sanctioning. Nobody.

The problem for the players will continue to be eking out a living from a game that IS NOT as discriminating as snooker. Due to the variance found in 9 Ball you could be a top 20 player one year and 40-50 the next. What happens if Matchroom doubles the total prize fund? It will just attract even more monster players and further dilute the overall payouts. This is not an easy road for the players to travel.

The players need options. The WNT doesn't.
AS the payouts increase, the top players may shift, but it most likely will equalize. You'll see players capable of taking top spots dedicate themselves more to the game and that may cause a shift, but the best, most dedicated players will still rise to the top. Also, with more money in those events, you'll see smaller events crop up more often and as popularity increases, so will events.

Jaden
 
The best thing for the players may be that they co-exist. But Matchroom is a profitable business and if I was on their team, and sitting in their meetings, I would have a very hard time formulating a coherent argument for why working with the WPA made sense. Why does Matchroom (not the players) need the WPA? Guess you could argue they need some form of sanctioning, but if the prize funds are big enough, nobody will care about WPA sanctioning. Nobody.

The problem for the players will continue to be eking out a living from a game that IS NOT as discriminating as snooker. Due to the variance found in 9 Ball you could be a top 20 player one year and 40-50 the next. What happens if Matchroom doubles the total prize fund? It will just attract even more monster players and further dilute the overall payouts. This is not an easy road for the players to travel.

The players need options. The WNT doesn't.

Its not the variance in Nine Ball, its just not enough Money spread across the field. If there was a way to pay the top 50 in a event enough to pay the bills then it wouldn't matter if you only cashed in a few events. But the current modeling is for the top few in each event no the field.

The competition level in 9/10 Ball is to high for anybody to expect to finish at the top all the time so the Money needs to paid deep into the field to reflect the talent level..., hard to to do without alot of sponsorship.
 
WNT gives the WPA the purple crush (formerly known as the "orange crush," thanks to WNT.)

I have not been a fan of the WPA for decades, but back in the mid 2000s when I voiced my opinion in this very forum about them, it was met with many, many WPA supporters. Look how the winds have shifted today.

A very well-written piece by Michael Panozzo. I had never looked at the WNT in that lens before, but I feel as though I can see clearly now the way he has encapsulated it.

I still have reservations about the direction Matchroom is taking pool on a global scale, and I refuse to bend the knee to some of the WNT admin staff, as most are wont to doing, but I respect and appreciate the amount of effort happening, taking professional pool to a new frontier. That's a good thing for the pros.

But I just know in my heart of hearts that it's Bye-Bye, American Pool Pie. And that is not Matchroom's fault. BCA organization had dropped the ball years ago, yet the fact that the governing body of professional pool in North America is an industry organization today and does not represent the pros continues to be swept under the rug. USA has no federation. The pro players have no union or agent protecting their rights. They continue to work as free agents, and if they dare to make a personal decision about their career and not follow the others like trained little pigs, they are crucified on social media. They have every right to pick and choose what event to compete in as it pertains to their career and livelihood, and if they change their mind, that is okay.

Mike Panozzo's post makes a lot of sense, and so does Darren Appleton's opinion. Somebody needs to get rid of that line in the sand. Sadly, the pro players can't do it alone by not attending this tournament or that tournament.
 
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I say WPA either comes along and works around the scheduling of the WNT without threatening any players, or good riddance.
Wasn't that what Matchroom was parroting? Guess they are not strong as they think they are given the mass exodus at the Hanoi Open. However, some will never learn.
 
Anyone has Darren's statement? I am trying to understand causes for the last minute withdrawals. Were the players hoping for last minute caving by the WPA?
 
Panozzo's post is very well written and gets to the crux of the matter.

The WPA, by its very nature, does not present to sponsors or the public a cohesive package. Even if there were 1000 tournaments all with 1MM added and the money was always paid. Each event is independent, and each promoter is on their own.

What the WNT is doing (and making progress on), is building one cohesive branding package that, finally, has the potential to grow the sport.
 
Wasn't that what Matchroom was parroting? Guess they are not strong as they think they are given the mass exodus at the Hanoi Open. However, some will never learn.
There is no mass exodus. Little more than a handful of truly notable players: Filler, Ouschan, He, Lechner and Kazakis.

We know you don't like MR and like to attack them. Which is fine.

But I'd be curious to know what your positive vision for the sport is. What do you think should be done? Do you want MR to go away?
 
Panozzo does not explain why MR is equally complicit in the stalemate getting to this point. He should.

I don't know if MR is or isn't. Just not enough info for me to determine that.
 
Anyone has Darren's statement? I am trying to understand causes for the last minute withdrawals. Were the players hoping for last minute caving by the WPA?
Darren is my friend on FB and i did not find anything posted in his personal or dynamite profiles... maybe he deleted post..
 
There is no mass exodus. Little more than a handful of truly notable players: Filler, Ouschan, He, Lechner and Kazakis.

We know you don't like MR and like to attack them. Which is fine.

But I'd be curious to know what your positive vision for the sport is. What do you think should be done? Do you want MR to go away?
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If you don't see the above as mass exodus of major players I have no time to argue. List does not include others like Darren and i understand possibly Raga and others.

I actually like what MR is doing for the sport in terms of the events they host and their production. I don't like their attempt to brand 9 ball as "the thing" when I believe 10 ball is more interesting. I don't like their orchestrated boycott where they could have had players boycotting their own sponsors. I don't like their cohorts social media shaming of Filler and Albin. I would have liked Filler and Albin playing in the Hanoi Open but MR created a poisonous atmosphere. Oh, and I don't like having to sign up to see the brackets.


Matchroom needs to find a way to work with others. They are not the powerhouse they believe they are. Whatever happened to Predator sponsorship of some of MR events as was done in the past? Was there something animosity between Predator and MR? If yes, why?
 
There is no mass exodus. Little more than a handful of truly notable players: Filler, Ouschan, He, Lechner and Kazakis.

We know you don't like MR and like to attack them. Which is fine.

But I'd be curious to know what your positive vision for the sport is. What do you think should be done? Do you want MR to go away?
I’m surprised Kazakis is on the list. I could have sworn one of the Greek pros had stated Greece gives zero financial support.
 
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