Watching mr. 400 trying to break the record

Nostroke said:
People try to break records during the normal playing of the games. When Bob Beamon broke the long jump record by almost 2 feet in 68, no one set up a pit and took a stab at it every day.Nobody had down the middle fast balls pitched at them every day at Yankee Stadium either til one was hit out of the Park.

If John breaks the record, it will certainly be an achievement but definitely will have an asterisk.
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I guess that makes those records more formidable than Mosconi's then.


You could have broken Beamon's record on your pit but nobody is going to recognize it. Certainly not the Guinness .

The home run distance record is a record for an official game . Are we even going to argue nobody in batting practice hit it farther ? Have you ever heard of a batting practice home run record ? Exactly. They don't even recognize spring training home run distance record . If they did, you'd have a few of them claiming they hit some 600+ footers in the desert .


Pool, damn if you and damn if you don't.

Btw, whose record did Mosconi break ?
 
Nostroke said:
People try to break records during the normal playing of the games. When Bob Beamon broke the long jump record by almost 2 feet in 68, no one set up a pit and took a stab at it every day.Nobody had down the middle fast balls pitched at them every day at Yankee Stadium either til one was hit out of the Park.

If John breaks the record, it will certainly be an achievement but definitely will have an asterisk.
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It is obviously outlandish and wrong to contend that Mosconi's non-competitive exhibition run took place during the "normal playing of the game".
 
Nostroke said:
People try to break records during the normal playing of the games. When Bob Beamon broke the long jump record by almost 2 feet in 68, no one set up a pit and took a stab at it every day.Nobody had down the middle fast balls pitched at them every day at Yankee Stadium either til one was hit out of the Park.

If John breaks the record, it will certainly be an achievement but definitely will have an asterisk.
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Wrong amundo, it will have 40 asterisks. And 5 years from now , there will be a huge group of people who say it never happened.
 
Get_A_Grip said:
EDIT: Thinking about it -- why stop with cloth. Dang it! John MUST use a wooden shaft too to consider him really beating Willie's record. The conditions argument will never end.
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Whats he using? Its like the first military confirmed kill at 1000 yds, it was a record but not one someone was trying to make. Who knows how many times it was broken but each time was with more and more advanced weapons. Few good players can run 100 balls and fewer can run 200, and way fewer the numbers John does. What he does on any table is a tremendous challenge. Its just an opinion but if I had his talent I would try and copy Mosconi, for lack of a better term. Smaller table, larger pockets and slower cloth if so desired. Its like the dirt track in my little town, champion race car drivers have run it but they would have a hard time putting up the same numbers at the Indy 500 track.
 
$TAKE HOR$E said:
Whats he using? Its like the first military confirmed kill at 1000 yds, it was a record but not one someone was trying to make. Who knows how many times it was broken but each time was with more and more advanced weapons. Few good players can run 100 balls and fewer can run 200, and way fewer the numbers John does. What he does on any table is a tremendous challenge. Its just an opinion but if I had his talent I would try and copy Mosconi, for lack of a better term. Smaller table, larger pockets and slower cloth if so desired. Its like the dirt track in my little town, champion race car drivers have run it but they would have a hard time putting up the same numbers at the Indy 500 track.
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John's using a carbon fiber Revo shaft. I think that players today should use the standard playing conditions, cloth, table, cues, etc. Fast cloth certainly is the biggest factor to allow the balls to open easier, thus allowing more balls to be run, but that is the standard cloth used now -- so I say, use the conditions of the day.




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Is fast cloth really an unmitigated advantage in a game where pinpoint position matters and players get in trouble from flying cue balls after the break?

There would have been no Ghost of Willie scratch on nappy cloth...
 
skip100 said:
Is fast cloth really an unmitigated advantage in a game where pinpoint position matters and players get in trouble from flying cue balls after the break?

There would have been no Ghost of Willie scratch on nappy cloth...
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The most recent extensive test of nappy cloth for pool was the IPT. Everybody was running out from anywhere. It seemed to fail to do what the proponents claimed it would do. Or, modern players have more stroke than the old fogies give them credit for. I think slow cloth does not make 14.1 harder.
 
Bob Jewett said:
The most recent extensive test of nappy cloth for pool was the IPT. Everybody was running out from anywhere. It seemed to fail to do what the proponents claimed it would do. Or, modern players have more stroke than the old fogies give them credit for. I think slow cloth does not make 14.1 harder.
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That appears to be very counter intuitive. The IPT was 8 ball. I've been watching John and the most challenging moments are when he goes into the stack and the balls don't separate much to give him much of a shot. And that's with fast cloth. I can't even imagine thinking that it would be no harder on slow cloth if the balls don't separate as much. But, everyone has an opinion....




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Get_A_Grip said:
That appears to be very counter intuitive. The IPT was 8 ball. I've been watching John and the most challenging moments are when he goes into the stack and the balls don't separate much to give him much of a shot. And that's with fast cloth. I can't even imagine thinking that it would be no harder on slow cloth if the balls don't separate as much. But, everyone has an opinion....




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Most of those poor separation situations come from getting weak position on the break ball. It's easier to get good position on the break ball (to within 1-2 inches of the ideal spot) when the cloth is slow.
 
The main thing that pains me is seeing John try all these new diets to try and increase his energy during the days he plays, etc. I know he was doing intermittent fasting, high fat/low carb diets, drinking smoothies... why introduce something his body isn't used to during his record breaking attempts? I'd think he'd want to keep things consistent and just focus on his performance.
 
Doing this kinda hours for 14.1 at his age is record of it´s own!
It is so damn hard to start from zero after miss and refocus.
His stamina is unreal IMO.
 
Luxury said:
John said on his Facebook page that he would go to an 8 footer next if unsuccessful on the 9


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If he does go to an 8 footer and breaks the record, there will be, imho, many more top pro's going 8 foot, some beating John's mark, all leading to a collective feeling of under-whelming due to the table size.
 
526 my ass. I'd like to see him be Mr. 400 during this challenge, 8 more days to do it. I think he shot 384 and 390 but that ain't 400, let alone 526! (and yes, it's impressive, I admire him for trying, and I can't shoot that).
 
I think one thing we can all agree on (and perhaps agree to appreciate) in this thread is how many factors actually figure in ANY type of play - from physical fitness and diet to mental toughness. Concentration and distractions of surroundings. Cloth, table size and the myriad equipment possibilities like shafts, tips and balls. Pressure of beating a personal best and fatigue. On and on and on. And on.

Like the ones we all face every time we play.

Which is WHY we all play. The incessant challenge and trying to master just a few of them at any one time at the table.

And thanks to John, we get see every single factor play out in front of us to witness and replay and critique. For the ages.

Being able to watch and learn from what John is doing has to rank right up there with “an opportunity of a lifetime” for most of us passionate pool folks.

Thank you, John.

$0.02



~ K.


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Bob Jewett said:
The most recent extensive test of nappy cloth for pool was the IPT. Everybody was running out from anywhere. It seemed to fail to do what the proponents claimed it would do. Or, modern players have more stroke than the old fogies give them credit for. I think slow cloth does not make 14.1 harder.
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I am inclined to agree that slower cloth may be a bit easier to play on.
 
weakfingers said:
The main thing that pains me is seeing John try all these new diets to try and increase his energy during the days he plays, etc. I know he was doing intermittent fasting, high fat/low carb diets, drinking smoothies... why introduce something his body isn't used to during his record breaking attempts? I'd think he'd want to keep things consistent and just focus on his performance.
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Agreed. You never get your hair cut the day before prom.
 
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